Rob Cesternino

All, all is one.

And for whatever reason, they love to in that they had, I'll give you some, some more back.

So in the new era,

So after they came back from COVID, they sort of tried to do a little bit of a reboot of the show.

A lot of people discovered Survivor during COVID.

And so there was a lot of hype for Survivor to come back.

It had taken a year off.

And they ended up developing this game, which was based off of the idea.

Jeff had this whole other idea for the game, which was around this idea of fire tokens.

It was going to be kind of like a board game.

And Mike White of this season, of the White Lotus, that Jeff would bounce a lot of ideas off of him.

And Jeff went through his whole whiteboard pitch to Mike White.

And Mike White said, but is that fun?

And Jeff's like, you're right.

And he threw out the whole thing.

And so he came up with this idea, it's like dangerous fun.

And part of the idea of dangerous fun was, hey, small tribes, nowhere to hide.

Everything has got to be in a small group where in old school Survivor often, there would be tribes of 10.

And so as long as you weren't like really causing a scene, you could sort of be under the radar.

Right, skate through.