Robert Luna

Well, he does, he says he does it. Can I try to answer John's question about baptism? I think it draws a lot of the themes together. Our sins are forgiven in the cross of Jesus. They're forgiven in that great act. And when the soldier pierces a side, out comes blood and water. And the church fathers read that as the blood of the Eucharist, but the water of baptism.

Well, he does, he says he does it. Can I try to answer John's question about baptism? I think it draws a lot of the themes together. Our sins are forgiven in the cross of Jesus. They're forgiven in that great act. And when the soldier pierces a side, out comes blood and water. And the church fathers read that as the blood of the Eucharist, but the water of baptism.

And they further linked it to Ezekiel's great prophecy that, you know, the Shekinah of the Lord had left the temple and it'll come back someday. And when it does, that's when water flows forth from its side for the renewal of the world and of the human heart and all that. And I think that's how they read it, is from the side of the renewed temple.

And they further linked it to Ezekiel's great prophecy that, you know, the Shekinah of the Lord had left the temple and it'll come back someday. And when it does, that's when water flows forth from its side for the renewal of the world and of the human heart and all that. And I think that's how they read it, is from the side of the renewed temple.

So when John the Baptist, this priestly figure, says, behold, there's the Lamb of God, there's the one who will be sacrificed, and whose very body is the new temple, that's what the baptismal water symbolizes. It's the water coming from the redemptive act of Christ on the cross. I bring all those themes together.

So when John the Baptist, this priestly figure, says, behold, there's the Lamb of God, there's the one who will be sacrificed, and whose very body is the new temple, that's what the baptismal water symbolizes. It's the water coming from the redemptive act of Christ on the cross. I bring all those themes together.

When that's the scandal of it, so from the beginning, And even scholars today recognize that the fact that it's in the Gospels is scandalous. Why would Jesus, the Son of God, have to seek a baptism of repentance? So the fact that it's there means that, boy, this really happened. It's one of the stronger arguments.

When that's the scandal of it, so from the beginning, And even scholars today recognize that the fact that it's in the Gospels is scandalous. Why would Jesus, the Son of God, have to seek a baptism of repentance? So the fact that it's there means that, boy, this really happened. It's one of the stronger arguments.

He's the icon of the invisible God. Now, what's going on inside his own psychology, his own human psychology, is a famously, you know, controverted issue. He grows in wisdom and understanding. Right, it says that.

He's the icon of the invisible God. Now, what's going on inside his own psychology, his own human psychology, is a famously, you know, controverted issue. He grows in wisdom and understanding. Right, it says that.

So I think that's really fine to say that in his human nature, to use more technical language, sure, he grows.

So I think that's really fine to say that in his human nature, to use more technical language, sure, he grows.

go into the desert and encounter satan and begin his ministry as a concept well in its human nature and i think that's part of the baptism is the identification with the sinner so he stands shoulder to shoulder with sinners in the muddy waters of the jordan and anyone walking by would say oh there's another one of those sinners but that's anticipating the cross that's right becomes sin on the cross and that also explains the question of why do we need john the baptist because

go into the desert and encounter satan and begin his ministry as a concept well in its human nature and i think that's part of the baptism is the identification with the sinner so he stands shoulder to shoulder with sinners in the muddy waters of the jordan and anyone walking by would say oh there's another one of those sinners but that's anticipating the cross that's right becomes sin on the cross and that also explains the question of why do we need john the baptist because

I agree. I mean, one of the earliest fights the church had was against Marcion. That's right. So the Marcionite heresy that tried to divide the New Testament from the Old. And the church, by a very deep and correct instinct, led by St. Irenaeus, said, no, you cannot understand Jesus apart from the Old Testament. So that's a very bad instinct to say, just read the gospel, you'll be fine.

I agree. I mean, one of the earliest fights the church had was against Marcion. That's right. So the Marcionite heresy that tried to divide the New Testament from the Old. And the church, by a very deep and correct instinct, led by St. Irenaeus, said, no, you cannot understand Jesus apart from the Old Testament. So that's a very bad instinct to say, just read the gospel, you'll be fine.

You won't get the gospel apart from the Old Testament.

You won't get the gospel apart from the Old Testament.

When people say, oh, the God of the Old Testament, cruel and violent and all that. I love the God of the New Testament. That's a neo-Marcionism. And the church has got to stand against that just as clearly today.

When people say, oh, the God of the Old Testament, cruel and violent and all that. I love the God of the New Testament. That's a neo-Marcionism. And the church has got to stand against that just as clearly today.