Robert Pape

So civilians here are not signing up as soldiers in a war to be ordered by Donald Trump to take the risk of death.

For whatever project President Trump comes up with.

Now, the military is a different story.

They have to obey those orders.

But civilians, both the United States and around the world, they just simply don't.

And by the way, they have other reasons.

This is not simply, I don't think it's quite right to call them all cowards the way President Trump does.

I mean, the fact of the matter is he did not.

He dodged the draft during the Vietnam War.

So this is not simply a matter of, I just don't think this is right.

People who are civilians have not signed up here.

They're not conscripted.

And they have families.

They have other people that depend on them.

So if they die, there's consequences to this.

And

What you're seeing with that captain here is they're just simply not going to do it.

I think even if their companies ordered them to do it, they may just simply not obey those orders.

This is a lot to ask people to die to get oil through a strait in the world.

That's a lot to die.