Sam Brigger
Appearances
Fresh Air
The Gutting Of The Department Of Education
Hey, Sam Sanders here with KCRW personally inviting you to check out my new podcast. It's an entertainment show that tries to figure out what makes the culture tick and tell the stories behind creators we love. New episodes are out every Friday, wherever you get your podcasts.
Fresh Air
Mark Ruffalo Hates The Hulk Suit
What about the celebrity from being part of the Marvel Universe? By the time you started being the Incredible Hulk, you were already a very well-known and successful actor. But was the celebrity and the recognition sort of exponentially different? Yeah.
Fresh Air
Mark Ruffalo Hates The Hulk Suit
In that scene, Duncan Wedderburn is looking at Bella Baxter like a cartoon cat who's trapped the canary. What he doesn't realize is that Bella Baxter is no ordinary young innocent to corrupt. She is in fact the result of a Frankenstein-like experiment by a scientist, played by Willem Dafoe, who reanimated a dead woman's body by replacing her brain with the brain of her unborn baby.
Fresh Air
Mark Ruffalo Hates The Hulk Suit
does it take away from simple things like walking down the street or going for a hike or something?
Fresh Air
Mark Ruffalo Hates The Hulk Suit
You know, they got their head down on the phone or in a book, sleeping, whatever. Do you have to do like the cap and sunglasses thing all the time?
Fresh Air
Mark Ruffalo Hates The Hulk Suit
If you're just joining us, our guest is actor Mark Ruffalo. He was nominated for an Oscar for Best Supporting Actor for his role in the film Poor Things. We'll be back after a short break. This is Fresh Air.
Fresh Air
Mark Ruffalo Hates The Hulk Suit
Bella goes through a rapid awakening to the world around her and to her own body, and like an infant who doesn't yet know society's norms, is uninhibited to a degree that both attracts Wedderburn and undoes him.
Fresh Air
Mark Ruffalo Hates The Hulk Suit
This is Fresh Air. I'm Sam Brigger. One of our favorite interviews from the year was with our guest Mark Ruffalo. He was nominated for an Oscar for Best Supporting Actor for his role in the film Poor Things. Some of his other movies include Spotlight, Foxcatcher, The Kids Are Alright, Zodiac, and You Can Count on Me. He's also played the Incredible Hulk in many Marvel movies and TV shows.
Fresh Air
Mark Ruffalo Hates The Hulk Suit
Mark, to prepare for this interview, I watched a lot of your films, and I watched this trio of films that you did, which are all based on historical events. There's actually some sort of similarity between them. This is Zodiac, Foxcatcher, and Spotlight. And I read that for two of those movies, the people you were portraying were still alive, and you –
Fresh Air
Mark Ruffalo Hates The Hulk Suit
Got to spend time with them, got to know them. And this was Dave Tosky, who was one of the detectives investigating the Zodiac killings. And then for Spotlight, you spent time with one of the reporters who was investigating the sexual abuse in the Catholic Church, Mike Resendiz.
Fresh Air
Mark Ruffalo Hates The Hulk Suit
Mark Ruffalo's performance in Poor Things is hilarious and delicious, and he himself describes it as a big departure from his previous work in movies like Zodiac, Spotlight, Foxcatcher, The Kids Are Alright, You Can Count on Me, and of course, several Marvel movies and TV shows where he plays the Incredible Hulk. Well, Mark Ruffalo, welcome back to Fresh Air.
Fresh Air
Mark Ruffalo Hates The Hulk Suit
So when you're portraying a historical figure, an actual person, how much of an effort do you make to try to be as much like them as possible? Let's stick with Mike Rezende. How much time did you spend with him?
Fresh Air
Mark Ruffalo Hates The Hulk Suit
What were some of the mannerisms that you saw that you tried to emulate in your performance?
Fresh Air
Mark Ruffalo Hates The Hulk Suit
It's nice to have you. You said you had some trepidation about taking on this role. What were your concerns?
Fresh Air
Mark Ruffalo Hates The Hulk Suit
Mark, I wanted to ask you a little bit about your childhood. It sounds like your family moved around a bit, like you were born in Wisconsin, but then you spent some time in Virginia and then California, right? That's right. I think your family was Catholic, but it sounds like there were some active seekers of religion in the household. Is that correct? Yeah.
Fresh Air
Mark Ruffalo Hates The Hulk Suit
Well, you actually were saved by the televangelist Jimmy Swigert, right? I was. Was that on TV? No.
Fresh Air
Mark Ruffalo Hates The Hulk Suit
Did you feel bad? Did you feel like you were kind of lying or something?
Fresh Air
Mark Ruffalo Hates The Hulk Suit
If you're just joining us, our guest is actor Mark Ruffalo. We'll be back after a short break. This is Fresh Air.
Fresh Air
Mark Ruffalo Hates The Hulk Suit
This is Fresh Air. Our guest is actor Mark Ruffalo, who was nominated for an Oscar for Best Supporting Actor in the film Poor Things. How did you get into acting? Is that something you felt good at right away? Did it come easy naturally to you?
Fresh Air
Mark Ruffalo Hates The Hulk Suit
Yeah. At some point you decided to make a go of it, right? Like you must have been getting some encouragement from her and then from other people to sort of get you to take a chance and to move to L.A. eventually.
Fresh Air
Mark Ruffalo Hates The Hulk Suit
If you're just joining us, we're speaking with actor Mark Ruffalo. More after a break. This is Fresh Air.
Fresh Air
Mark Ruffalo Hates The Hulk Suit
Well, it is such a fun role. Like, once you accepted it, did you have fun doing it?
Fresh Air
Mark Ruffalo Hates The Hulk Suit
This is Fresh Air. Our guest is actor Mark Ruffalo, who was nominated for an Oscar for his performance in the movie Poor Things. So your big break was the 2000 Kenneth Lonergan movie, You Can Count on Me, which I watched again this week. It's such a terrific movie. You play Terry. You've got a sister, Sammy, who's played by Laura Linney. And you guys were orphaned early in life.
Fresh Air
Mark Ruffalo Hates The Hulk Suit
Your parents die in a car crash. So what did you think of this character when you read the script? He's often a jerk, but he's also a pretty good guy. And and tries to do the right thing a lot. And he's just been damaged by this awful tragedy when he was a kid.
Fresh Air
Mark Ruffalo Hates The Hulk Suit
This is your big break, and you start getting asked to do a lot of roles. But then everything just – you have to go on halt. You've talked about this a bunch, but you were diagnosed with a brain tumor, which turned out to be benign. You had to have this operation. You had to deal with all these side effects. You had to do all this rehabilitation. I mean, fortunately, you were able to –
Fresh Air
Mark Ruffalo Hates The Hulk Suit
to really get through it, but it took a while. And like, it just must've been, I mean, obviously it's a terrible thing to happen in your life, but just in terms of your career, like that must've been so discouraging because like here you are just breaking out and then your body just shuts it all down. Like, did that experience make you forever like suspicious of success? Like,
Fresh Air
Mark Ruffalo Hates The Hulk Suit
You might be good now, but you don't know what's coming around the corner.
Fresh Air
Mark Ruffalo Hates The Hulk Suit
Yeah, well, I was actually really interested in that particular aspect of this because, like, as we said, you know, there's some spiritual searchers in your family, right? Like, your grandmother became an evangelist after being Catholic, right? Your father joined the Baha'i religion. Like did this experience sort of alter the way you thought about spirituality or like even the soul or identity?
Fresh Air
Mark Ruffalo Hates The Hulk Suit
You've been in like romantic comedies and you've been in movies that have comedic elements like The Brothers Bloom and even in the Avengers movies. But I don't think you've ever had a role that was so broadly comic as this one. I mean you even do a pratfall at one point.
Fresh Air
Mark Ruffalo Hates The Hulk Suit
That's what I learned. Well, it's been a real pleasure speaking with you. Mark Ruffalo, thanks so much for coming on the show.
Fresh Air
Mark Ruffalo Hates The Hulk Suit
So can you just sort of compare what it's like to act in something that's comedic like this compared to your more like dramatic roles?
Fresh Air
Mark Ruffalo Hates The Hulk Suit
Yeah, yeah. You're almost like skating up the stairs, like your arms are going back and forth. And then at the landing, you just go flop over.
Fresh Air
Mark Ruffalo Hates The Hulk Suit
In Poor Things, Mark Ruffalo plays a character described in the movie as a cad and a rake. His name is Duncan Wedderburn, and he seduces Emma Stone's character, Bella Baxter, to run away from her home and fiancé and have an adventure with him in Lisbon. Let's hear a scene.
Fresh Air
Mark Ruffalo Hates The Hulk Suit
The character in the movie is described as a cad and a rake, and he's disreputable, but he's definitely working within the boundaries of society. And he's challenged and finally undone by Emma Stone's complete uninhibitedness. Can you talk about that?
Fresh Air
Mark Ruffalo Hates The Hulk Suit
Well, let's hear a clip of him sort of getting undone by Emma Stone's behavior. This scene takes place. The two characters have been put ashore in France and Paris, penniless, and you're completely dispirited. And Bella Baxter, Emma Stone's character, decides to go find money. And so she prostitutes herself to get money and then comes back eating like pastries. I can't remember. It's an eclair.
Fresh Air
Mark Ruffalo Hates The Hulk Suit
Yeah, an eclair. Eating eclair. And you're like, where did this come from? So let's hear some of that scene.
Fresh Air
Mark Ruffalo Hates The Hulk Suit
That's Mark Ruffalo and Emma Stone in Poor Things. As Mark Ruffalo's character, Duncan Wedderburn, sort of falls apart in just the onslaught of Emma Stone's uninhibitedness. So, you know, there's a sex scene montage in Poor Things that I wanted to talk to you about. Like, you've done sex scenes before, but this is sex played for comedy. Like, it's not supposed to be sexy.
Fresh Air
Mark Ruffalo Hates The Hulk Suit
I mean, it's meant to make the audience laugh. I mean, the characters are having a good time, but it's filmed to look awkward and rutting, and your character's even wearing a corset. So can you talk about, like, doing that kind of scene for comedy? Sure.
Fresh Air
Mark Ruffalo Hates The Hulk Suit
So, Mark, I have to ask you about the big green guy. Yeah. Since 2012, you've been playing the Incredible Hulk and, as I said, a bunch of different Marvel movies and TV shows starting with the first Avengers movie. So in 2012, there were just a lot of superhero movies out there and a lot of really good actors were being swept up in them, particularly Robert Downey Jr. playing Iron Man.
Fresh Air
Mark Ruffalo Hates The Hulk Suit
But did you ever think you were going to play a superhero? No.
Fresh Air
Mark Ruffalo Hates The Hulk Suit
To play the Hulk, you have to spend a lot of time acting in a motion capture suit. Did you have any apprehensions about doing that? I hated it.
Fresh Air
Mark Ruffalo Hates The Hulk Suit
That's really interesting. What about just in terms of being expressive with your face? Because Your face is obviously a big tool for an actor. Were you concerned that you would be doing all this work and it wouldn't be accurately captured by the animation?
Fresh Air
To Shed Luke Skywalker, Mark Hamill Turned To Voiceover Work
Well, let's use this as a segue to talk about being Luke Skywalker a little bit. I think when you auditioned for Star Wars, you came in and didn't know what you were auditioning for, and you auditioned both for Carrie and Star Wars at the same time. Is that true?
Fresh Air
To Shed Luke Skywalker, Mark Hamill Turned To Voiceover Work
He also appeared in Mike Flanagan's Netflix horror series The Fall of the House of Usher as a lawyer and fixer named Arthur Pym. Let's start with a clip from The Life of Chuck. Here Albie is going over his grandson Chuck's math homework. Chuck lives with him since his parents died in a car accident. Chuck's good at math, but his passion is dancing, and Albie's about to give him some tough love.
Fresh Air
To Shed Luke Skywalker, Mark Hamill Turned To Voiceover Work
Let's take another break here. If you're just joining us, our guest is Mark Hamill. His new movie is The Life of Chuck. He'll be back after a short break. I'm Sam Brigger, and this is Fresh Air.
Fresh Air
To Shed Luke Skywalker, Mark Hamill Turned To Voiceover Work
Let's get back to my conversation with actor Mark Hamill. His newest movie is The Life of Chuck, in which he plays a kind but haunted grandfather. The movie was adapted from a story by Stephen King. Hamill has done a lot of work both as a live action actor and a voice actor for animated projects. He is, of course, best known as Luke Skywalker from Star Wars.
Fresh Air
To Shed Luke Skywalker, Mark Hamill Turned To Voiceover Work
Well, it's interesting to me that you – reading the script, you knew that it was something special. Because back then, you know, sci-fi was – I mean I think it's fair to say like not super reputable. Like they were low-budget genre movies mostly. But you could sort of tell it was something special. Oh, yeah.
Fresh Air
To Shed Luke Skywalker, Mark Hamill Turned To Voiceover Work
Well, I think we should hear a scene from the movie. This is from the beginning of the film when you're on the desert planet Tatooine. You're living with your uncle and your aunt who are moisture farmers, and they've just bought these two droids that you mentioned, C-3PO and R2-D2. And as thrilling as it sounds to be a moisture farmer, you're dreaming of a different kind of life.
Fresh Air
To Shed Luke Skywalker, Mark Hamill Turned To Voiceover Work
So, you know, I imagine as an actor that an important part of your job and something that helps you do your job is like the feedback you receive from other actors in the scene, like from their energy, from their expressions, like you probably work off of each other. But for you, some of your most famous dramatic moments.
Fresh Air
To Shed Luke Skywalker, Mark Hamill Turned To Voiceover Work
scenes in these star wars movies you're acting opposite a puppet and even though you know it's frank oz great puppet master like was that difficult was it difficult to like stay in the moment when you're expressing yourself to yoda who is not a real person of course look frank oz is so good and
Fresh Air
To Shed Luke Skywalker, Mark Hamill Turned To Voiceover Work
So during the research for this, I read an interview with you from People magazine from 1981 when you were anticipating the release of the final – movie in the series, The Return of the Jedi. And speaking for yourself, Carrie Fisher and Harrison Ford, you said that once the movie comes out, quote, we'll be grown up and free.
Fresh Air
To Shed Luke Skywalker, Mark Hamill Turned To Voiceover Work
And, you know, for better or worse, I don't think you've ever been free of Star Wars. And I think at least one instance, the director told you they didn't want to cast you because they didn't want Luke Skywalker in their movie. And this was for the film adaptation of of a Broadway play, Amadeus, that you were starring in on Broadway. So did you hear that a lot? Did you get discouraged?
Fresh Air
To Shed Luke Skywalker, Mark Hamill Turned To Voiceover Work
If you're just joining us, we're speaking with actor Mark Hamill. He's in the new movie The Life of Chuck, which is adapted from a Stephen King story. More after a break. This is Fresh Air.
Fresh Air
To Shed Luke Skywalker, Mark Hamill Turned To Voiceover Work
A lot of voice acting, and I know you did voice acting before Star Wars, but did voice acting provide you with an opportunity to kind of avoid some of those issues with typecasting that you were facing?
Fresh Air
To Shed Luke Skywalker, Mark Hamill Turned To Voiceover Work
Well, let's hear a little bit of your Joker. This is from actually a movie called Batman Mask of the Phantasm. And this is a scene between the Joker and a gangster named Salvatore Valestra. And when I first heard this, I was like, oh, that guy's doing a pretty good Abe Vigoda impression. But it was actually Abe Vigoda who, of course, played a different Salvatore in The Godfather.
Fresh Air
To Shed Luke Skywalker, Mark Hamill Turned To Voiceover Work
So that's our guest Mark Hamill in Batman, Mask of the Phantasm, playing the Joker. So, you know, you go through a huge range of emotions in that scene. Can voice acting actually be more tiring than live action because of that?
Fresh Air
To Shed Luke Skywalker, Mark Hamill Turned To Voiceover Work
You have art in you. That's a scene with Mark Hamill, our guest in the new movie, The Life of Chuck. Mark Hamill, welcome to Fresh Air. Thank you, Sam. So you've worked with Mike Flanagan before. Did he come to you asking you to play this role? What did he tell you about it?
Fresh Air
To Shed Luke Skywalker, Mark Hamill Turned To Voiceover Work
In 2015, you returned to play Luke Skywalker in the last of the Star Wars trilogies. You were only in the last few seconds of the first one, but you had quite a long story arc in the second one.
Fresh Air
To Shed Luke Skywalker, Mark Hamill Turned To Voiceover Work
You know, this character you've been so associated with for so long, but now there were new people who were involved in creating the story of your character. First of all, did you have trepidations about doing it again? Or was it hard for you to accept sort of new people's ideas about what this character was that was really so close to you?
Fresh Air
To Shed Luke Skywalker, Mark Hamill Turned To Voiceover Work
I'd like to just play a clip from The Last Jedi. This is near the end of the movie. Your character, Luke, had been a recluse for years, jaded about your experiences. And even when people came to plead you to help with the rebellion, you were refusing. You finally relent, and you... In this scene, the rebel forces are near complete loss, but you appear to speak with Leia, played by Carrie Fisher.
Fresh Air
To Shed Luke Skywalker, Mark Hamill Turned To Voiceover Work
And in the solo, you say something like, I can't save him, and you're referring to Kylo Ren, who is the son of Han Solo, and Leia, who has gone over to the dark side. Okay.
Fresh Air
To Shed Luke Skywalker, Mark Hamill Turned To Voiceover Work
So that's a poignant scene now, especially because Carrie Fisher died shortly after filming this movie. And you've said that sometimes when you were feeling ambivalent about being Luke Skywalker that she would give you some tough love and be like, hey, you're Luke Skywalker. Deal with it.
Fresh Air
To Shed Luke Skywalker, Mark Hamill Turned To Voiceover Work
Except it's not, but in some ways.
Fresh Air
To Shed Luke Skywalker, Mark Hamill Turned To Voiceover Work
Well, Mark Hamill, thank you so much for coming on Fresh Air.
Fresh Air
To Shed Luke Skywalker, Mark Hamill Turned To Voiceover Work
The movie itself might be indescribable, but one thing that is describable is the mustache you have in this movie, which is like a Wilford Brimley, soup-straining, walrus kind of mustache. So is that yours? Did you grow that thing?
Fresh Air
To Shed Luke Skywalker, Mark Hamill Turned To Voiceover Work
But that's okay. We just listened to this clip. And what the listeners aren't seeing is how the speech is going over with the young Chuck. And his eyes are as big as saucers. I mean, it's a nice speech you're making, but you're basically kind of crushing his dreams. You're like, don't be a dancer. Be an accountant.
Fresh Air
To Shed Luke Skywalker, Mark Hamill Turned To Voiceover Work
You might be surprised to hear that a movie with Stephen King and Mike Flanagan's names attached to it is not a horror movie. Flanagan's best known for horror films... And Stephen King is, well, Stephen King. If it is horror, the life of Chuck is of the existential kind, asking questions like, are the length of our lives predetermined by supernatural forces? Does fate control us?
Fresh Air
To Shed Luke Skywalker, Mark Hamill Turned To Voiceover Work
Well, I was wondering, did you ever get that version of that speech when you were young and full of acting ambitions?
Fresh Air
To Shed Luke Skywalker, Mark Hamill Turned To Voiceover Work
So you were doing research on the people.
Fresh Air
To Shed Luke Skywalker, Mark Hamill Turned To Voiceover Work
Are we actually the product of someone else's imagination? Mark Hamill plays Chuck's grandfather, Albie, a hard-drinking accountant, a kind man, but haunted by his secrets.
Fresh Air
To Shed Luke Skywalker, Mark Hamill Turned To Voiceover Work
As you said, you were the middle child of seven. Your father was a career officer in the Navy, a captain. You were born in Oakland, but you moved around a lot, right?
Fresh Air
To Shed Luke Skywalker, Mark Hamill Turned To Voiceover Work
You were that deliberate about it?
Fresh Air
To Shed Luke Skywalker, Mark Hamill Turned To Voiceover Work
When you hear Mark Hamill's name, it's hard not to think of an epic story that took place a long time ago in a galaxy far, far away, as Hamill played one of the most iconic heroes in movie history, Luke Skywalker in the 1977 film Star Wars, a movie that changed Hollywood and the larger culture. Hamill was Luke in the original trilogy and reprised the role in the last trilogy that began in 2015.
Fresh Air
To Shed Luke Skywalker, Mark Hamill Turned To Voiceover Work
Yeah. Well, you've said before that you were really like a clown as a kid. Was that like getting trying to get people to laugh all the time? Was that a way to break the ice as the perpetual new kid?
Fresh Air
To Shed Luke Skywalker, Mark Hamill Turned To Voiceover Work
Sometimes before other people can.
Fresh Air
To Shed Luke Skywalker, Mark Hamill Turned To Voiceover Work
So that sort of the laughter that you would get being the clown, did that translate in some ways to your interest in acting?
Fresh Air
To Shed Luke Skywalker, Mark Hamill Turned To Voiceover Work
Mark, I thought we would start this part of the conversation with a cameo you did on The Simpsons. You're appearing. I think it's a comic convention. You come out of a spaceship dressed like Luke Skywalker, and with a lightsaber, you knock over a bunch of cardboard cutouts of stormtroopers and also Wonder Woman for some reason. Let's hear the clip.
Fresh Air
To Shed Luke Skywalker, Mark Hamill Turned To Voiceover Work
Hamill's other big recurring role, one that he had for three decades, was as a villain. He was the Joker in Batman the Animated Series, part of his long career as a voice actor. He said he would stop doing the voice of the Joker, though, when the actor who played Batman, Kevin Conroy, died in 2022. This is not the first time Hamill has worked with the director of The Life of Chuck.
Fresh Air
Remembering The South African Playwright Who Defied Apartheid
Hey, Sam Sanders here with KCRW, personally inviting you to check out my new podcast. It's an entertainment show that tries to figure out what makes the culture tick and tell the stories behind creators we love. New episodes are out every Friday, wherever you get your podcasts.
Fresh Air
Remembering The South African Playwright Who Defied Apartheid
The consequences for the country would have been enormous.
Fresh Air
Best Of: Sarah Silverman / Cole Escola
From WHYY in Philadelphia, this is Fresh Air Weekend. I'm Sam Brigger. Today, comic, actor, and writer Sarah Silverman talks about her new Netflix comedy special, Postmortem, which is funny and emotional. It's about the death of her father and stepmother nine days apart. Also, we'll hear from Cola Scola, creator of the Broadway comedy Oh Mary.
Fresh Air
Best Of: Sarah Silverman / Cole Escola
Sarah Silverman's new comedy special Postmortem is streaming on Netflix. She spoke with Terry Gross. Our rock critic, Ken Tucker, has been listening to new music, looking for something that's not just entertainment. He thinks he's found it in two new albums by musicians who are both influenced by country and folk music, but who otherwise could not be more different.
Fresh Air
Best Of: Sarah Silverman / Cole Escola
A relative newcomer, 22-year-old Ken Pomeroy, and a relatively old pro, 92-year-old Willie Nelson. Here's his review of Pomeroy's Cruel Joke and Nelson's Oh, What a Beautiful World, an album of covers of songs by Rodney Crowell. Let's start with Ken Pomeroy.
Fresh Air
Best Of: Sarah Silverman / Cole Escola
Ken Tucker reviewed two new albums, Willie Nelson's Oh, What a Beautiful World and Ken Pomeroy's Cruel Joke. Coming up, we hear from Cola Scola, creator of the Broadway show Oh, Mary. The show imagines Mary Todd Lincoln as a drunk who dreams about returning to her only true love, Cabaret. I'm Sam Brigger, and this is Fresh Air Weekend.
Fresh Air
Best Of: Sarah Silverman / Cole Escola
The Broadway comedy O Mary is nominated for five Tony Awards, including Best Play and Best Leading Actor in a Play. The comedy follows a very fictionalized, intentionally improbable version of First Lady Mary Todd Lincoln in the time leading to her husband's assassination. Our guest today, Kola Skola, wrote the play and stars as Mary. They spoke with Fresh Air's Anne-Marie Baldonado.
Fresh Air
Best Of: Sarah Silverman / Cole Escola
It's an intentionally ridiculous reimagining of First Lady Mary Todd Lincoln. It portrays her as having become addicted to alcohol, not because of the Civil War, but because she's desperately yearning for her only true love.
Fresh Air
Best Of: Sarah Silverman / Cole Escola
Cole Escola spoke with Fresh Air's Anne-Marie Baldonado. Escola will play Mary Todd Lincoln until June 21st. O'Mary continues its Broadway run until September. Fresh Air Weekend is produced by Teresa Madden. Fresh Air's executive producer is Danny Miller. For Terry Gross and Tanya Mosley, I'm Sam Brigger.
Fresh Air
Best Of: Sarah Silverman / Cole Escola
Plus, Ken Tucker reviews new albums by Willie Nelson and Ken Pomeroy. That's coming up on Fresh Air Weekend. This is Fresh Air Weekend. I'm Sam Brigger. Terry has our first interview. I'll let her introduce it.
Fresh Air
Best Of: Sarah Silverman / Cole Escola
We're listening to Terry's interview with Sarah Silverman. Her new comedy special, Postmortem, is streaming on Netflix. We'll hear more of their conversation after a short break. I'm Sam Brigger, and this is Fresh Air Weekend.
Fresh Air
Maggie Rogers / Kathleen Hanna
That's Maggie Rogers' song Alaska. You know, Maggie, I'm not sure if it's because the song is called Alaska, but there's always something about the song that like for me feels like there's a coolness to it, like there's cold winds blowing. And I don't know if it's related to this, but you've said that you have synesthesia and the music has a color to you.
Fresh Air
Maggie Rogers / Kathleen Hanna
And so you often when you're writing, you create these like color mood boards for your songs. Could you describe that?
Fresh Air
Maggie Rogers / Kathleen Hanna
Did that also help in order to assert yourself in those situations? Would people try to get you to record things in different ways, but you had all these different ways of showing that you were really in command of these songs and that these were your creations and you knew what was best for them?
Fresh Air
Maggie Rogers / Kathleen Hanna
Well, Maggie Rogers, thanks so much for coming on Fresh Air.
Fresh Air
Maggie Rogers / Kathleen Hanna
Our next guest is the co-founder of the Riot Grrrl movement, musician, writer, and artist Kathleen Hanna. Her new memoir is called Rebel Grrrl, which is also the name of one of the best-known songs by her band Bikini Kill. Kathleen Hanna recently spoke about her life and work with Fresh Air's Anne-Marie Baldonado.
Fresh Air
Maggie Rogers / Kathleen Hanna
This is Fresh Air Weekend. I'm Sam Brigger in for Terry Gross. While in college at NYU, getting a degree in music production, singer-songwriter Maggie Rogers met Pharrell Williams. During his visit to her class, Pharrell heard an early version of Maggie's song Alaska and was stunned by it. The interaction was captured in a video that went viral and propelled her to fame.
Fresh Air
Maggie Rogers / Kathleen Hanna
From WHYY in Philadelphia, this is Fresh Air Weekend. I'm Sam Brigger. Today we continue listening to some of our favorite interviews of 2024. First, we'll hear from singer-songwriter Maggie Rogers. In 2021, Rogers felt burnt out and took a break from music to go to Harvard Divinity School.
Fresh Air
Maggie Rogers / Kathleen Hanna
In 2021, Burnout from the Road, Maggie Rogers took a break and got a master's degree from Harvard Divinity School, where she explored public gatherings and the ethics of power in pop culture. She's been trying to find a way to make the life of a touring musician more sustainable. Let's hear a track from Maggie Rogers' latest album, Don't Forget Me. This is So Sick of Dreaming.
Fresh Air
Maggie Rogers / Kathleen Hanna
We're listening to the interview Fresh Air's Anne-Marie Baldonado recorded with Kathleen Hanna, co-founder of the bands Bikini Kill and La Tigra. Her new memoir is called Rebel Girl. We'll hear more of their conversation after a break. I'm Sam Brigger, and this is Fresh Air Weekend.
Fresh Air
Maggie Rogers / Kathleen Hanna
This is Fresh Air Weekend. I'm Sam Brigger. Back with more of our interview with Kathleen Hanna. She's the frontwoman of the bands Bikini Kill and La Tigra. She helped form the Riot Grrrl movement, challenging the sexist punk scene in the 1990s. Her songs took on sexual assault, misogyny, and female empowerment. Her memoir is called Rebel Girl, My Life as a Feminist Punk.
Fresh Air
Maggie Rogers / Kathleen Hanna
That's So Sick of Dreaming from Maggie Rogers' new album Don't Forget Me. Maggie Rogers, welcome to Fresh Air.
Fresh Air
Maggie Rogers / Kathleen Hanna
So you said that in this album, this is the first time where some of the material doesn't come from your own life, that you're playing with a persona. And I was wondering if that's freeing, because I imagine if you're writing songs about your own life, there'd be this self-imposed pressure to get it right, to be precise with the details, to be authentic to the experience. Yeah.
Fresh Air
Maggie Rogers / Kathleen Hanna
Kathleen Hanna spoke with Fresh Air's Anne-Marie Baldonado. Her memoir is called Rebel Girl, My Life as a Feminist Punk. Fresh Air Weekend is produced by Teresa Madden. Fresh Air's executive producer is Danny Miller. For Terry Gross and Tanya Mosley, I'm Sam Brigger.
Fresh Air
Maggie Rogers / Kathleen Hanna
So without revealing, like, is it that there are certain songs that are more autobiographical than others or that this persona and your own life are sort of woven through each of the songs?
Fresh Air
Maggie Rogers / Kathleen Hanna
You've said that you write songs as a way of processing your life. Does that mean that like once you've written about something that It helps you come to a resolution, like you don't have to think about that part of your life as much.
Fresh Air
Maggie Rogers / Kathleen Hanna
Well, you mentioned nostalgia, and I wanted to ask you about that. When I first listened to the album, I was like, oh, this is really nostalgic. This is interesting. But then I listened to so much over the last two weeks, and you've been writing nostalgic songs since you were like 16 or 17 years old.
Fresh Air
Maggie Rogers / Kathleen Hanna
So I was wondering, do you think that that's just you're inherently a nostalgic person, or do you think it's this process that you have of making sense of your life is inevitably going to have like a nostalgic aspect to it.
Fresh Air
Maggie Rogers / Kathleen Hanna
Also punk pioneer Kathleen Hanna. With her band Bikini Kill, she helped form a movement challenging the misogyny and punk in the 90s.
Fresh Air
Maggie Rogers / Kathleen Hanna
So Maggie, you know, you're just one of a handful of pop stars who've gotten their master's degree from Harvard Divinity School. What was it that you were hoping to get from this program? I mean, it's not a theology school at this point.
Fresh Air
Maggie Rogers / Kathleen Hanna
But clearly it has to do with some sort of element of spirituality, and that seems tethered to your understanding of what music is like and performance. So what were you hoping to sort of figure out when you were writing your thesis?
Fresh Air
Maggie Rogers / Kathleen Hanna
If you're just joining us, our guest is Maggie Rogers. Her new album is Don't Forget Me. We'll hear more of our conversation after a break. I'm Sam Brigger, and this is Fresh Air Weekend.
Fresh Air
Maggie Rogers / Kathleen Hanna
This is Fresh Air Weekend. I'm Sam Brigger. Let's get back to my interview with singer-songwriter Maggie Rogers. This interview was recorded in May, soon after the release of her album Don't Forget Me. Rogers took a break from the touring life of a musician in 2021 to attend Harvard Divinity School, where she graduated with a master's in religion and public life.
Fresh Air
Maggie Rogers / Kathleen Hanna
She was interested in examining the spirituality of public gatherings and the ethics of power in pop culture. So Maggie, you know, the moment of your discovery was filmed and went viral. You were a student at NYU majoring in music production. Your class was visited by Pharrell Williams. He came to sort of listen and give you some notes about what you guys were doing.
Fresh Air
Maggie Rogers / Kathleen Hanna
You played him an early version of your song, Alaska. And he was blown away by it. It's sweet because you both look kind of nervous and shy and like you're not sure whether you should like be seeing what he's thinking about your music. Right. Like obviously that's such an important moment in your career and partly fomented your success.
Fresh Air
Maggie Rogers / Kathleen Hanna
But like is there a part of you that sometimes wishes that that video hadn't gone viral, that that was a moment that was more yours than everyone else's?
Fresh Air
Maggie Rogers / Kathleen Hanna
Right, because you've been performing for a long time. You've been writing music for a long time.
Fresh Air
Maggie Rogers / Kathleen Hanna
Would you still be wearing that necklace that's made of elk hair?
Fresh Air
Best Of: Learning From Silence / Comic Roy Wood Jr.
Pico Ayer spoke with Terry Gross. His new memoir is called A Flame, Learning from Silence. Our co-host, Tanya Mosley, has our next interview. Here's Tanya.
Fresh Air
Best Of: Learning From Silence / Comic Roy Wood Jr.
This is Fresh Air Weekend. I'm Sam Brigger. Terry has our first interview. I'll let her introduce it.
Fresh Air
Best Of: Learning From Silence / Comic Roy Wood Jr.
From WHYY in Philadelphia, I'm Sam Brigger with Fresh Air Weekend. Today, Pico Ayer talks about coming out the other side of the 1990 wildfire that burned down his Santa Barbara home and kept him trapped for three hours until he was rescued. After being rendered homeless, sleeping on a friend's floor, he was told about a Benedictine monastery, where they accept a few guests at a time.
Fresh Air
Best Of: Learning From Silence / Comic Roy Wood Jr.
We're listening to comedian Roy Wood Jr. 's conversation with our co-host, Tanya Mosley. His new stand-up special is called Lonely Flowers. We'll hear more after a break. I'm Sam Brigger, and this is Fresh Air Weekend.
Fresh Air
Best Of: Learning From Silence / Comic Roy Wood Jr.
Roy Wood Jr. spoke with our co-host Tanya Mosley. His new comedy special is called Lonely Flowers. Fresh Air Weekend is produced by Teresa Madden. Fresh Air's executive producer is Danny Miller. Our technical director and engineer is Audrey Bentham.
Fresh Air
Best Of: Learning From Silence / Comic Roy Wood Jr.
Our interviews and reviews are produced and edited by Phyllis Myers, Anne-Marie Baldonado, Lauren Krenzel, Monique Nazareth, Thea Chaloner, Susan Yakundi, and Anna Bauman. Our digital media producer is Molly C.V. Nesper. For Terry Gross and Tanya Mosley, I'm Sam Brigger.
Fresh Air
Best Of: Learning From Silence / Comic Roy Wood Jr.
His new memoir is called A Flame. Also, we hear from Roy Wood Jr. His new comedy special, Lonely Flowers, looks at why people are so disconnected.
Fresh Air
Best Of: Learning From Silence / Comic Roy Wood Jr.
That's coming up on Fresh Air Weekend.
Fresh Air
Best Of: Learning From Silence / Comic Roy Wood Jr.
We're listening to Terry's interview with Pico Ayer. His new memoir is called Aflame, Learning from Silence. We'll hear more of their conversation after a short break. I'm Sam Brigger, and this is Fresh Air Weekend.
Fresh Air
Best Of: Jason Isbell / David Tennant
We're listening to Terry Gross' interview with Jason Isbell. His new album is called Foxes in the Snow. We'll hear more of their conversation after a break. I'm Sam Brigger, and this is Fresh Air Weekend.
Fresh Air
Best Of: Jason Isbell / David Tennant
This is Fresh Air Weekend. I'm Sam Brigger. Terry has our first interview. I'll let her introduce it.
Fresh Air
Best Of: Jason Isbell / David Tennant
Jason Isbell's new album is called Foxes in the Snow. He spoke with Terry Gross. The new series Dying for Sex is an FX on Hulu production. It stars Michelle Williams from The Fablemans and Blue Valentine as a woman whose cancer returns after a period of dormancy, leading her on a quest to explore her sexual drive and passions in a new way.
Fresh Air
Best Of: Jason Isbell / David Tennant
Dying for Sex is based on a real story and inspired by a podcast of the same name. Our TV critic, David Bianculli, says the series ends up being much deeper and more emotionally resonant than he expected. Here's his review.
Fresh Air
Best Of: Jason Isbell / David Tennant
David Bianculli is a professor of television studies at Rowan University. He reviewed Dying for Sex. It's streaming on Hulu. Coming up, Scottish actor David Tennant, perhaps best known for playing the Doctor on Doctor Who. I'm Sam Brigger, and this is Fresh Air Weekend. Scottish actor David Tennant's list of accomplishments is as long as it has varied.
Fresh Air
Best Of: Jason Isbell / David Tennant
Perhaps best known for playing Doctor Who, he is also considered one of the finest Shakespearean actors of his generation, as you can see now in the film of his Macbeth, which was staged in 2023, with Tennant playing the lead in Cush Jumbo as Lady Macbeth. It's now streaming on Marquee TV. He is also memorably played Hamlet and Richard II.
Fresh Air
Best Of: Jason Isbell / David Tennant
You probably watched him as the haunted and brooding detective in the British crime drama Broadchurch, and maybe even in the American adaptation called Grey's Point, where he plays more or less the same role but with an American accent.
Fresh Air
Best Of: Jason Isbell / David Tennant
David Tennant has also been his share of screen villains, including real-life serial killer Dennis Nilsen in the miniseries Dez, Kilgrave in the Marvel TV show Jessica Jones, one of the most repugnant characters I have ever seen, as well as the smaller but memorable, lip-licking Barty Crouch Jr. in Harry Potter and the Goblet of Fire.
Fresh Air
Best Of: Jason Isbell / David Tennant
He also hosted the BAFTA Awards for the past two years, Great Britain's version of the Oscars, this year opening the ceremony singing the song 500 Miles in a Bespoke Black Jacket and Kilt Suit. And he was hilarious to watch playing a version of himself in the streaming comedy staged with Michael Sheehan, one of the few good things to come out of the COVID pandemic.
Fresh Air
Best Of: Jason Isbell / David Tennant
David Tennant also has a podcast called David Tennant Does a Podcast With, where you fill in the name of the guest from that episode, often an actor he has worked with. A third season of the podcast released this year, and while we might have said, hey, David Tennant, stay in your lane. There's enough long-format interview shows out there.
Fresh Air
Best Of: Jason Isbell / David Tennant
Instead, we decided that this would be a good opportunity to have him on our long-format interview show to ask him about his life and career. So David Tennant, welcome to Fresh Air. Thank you very much for having me. You did two seasons of your podcast ending in 2020, but then you came back last month with the third season. Why did you come back now?
Fresh Air
Best Of: Jason Isbell / David Tennant
When you go into these interviews, like, do you have a specific agenda? Like, are you when you're like, oh, Olivia Colman, I've always wanted to know this about her? Or do you sometimes think about things in your own career which have puzzled you that gives you an opportunity to ask someone else who does the same work?
Fresh Air
Best Of: Jason Isbell / David Tennant
Speaking about coping with being a celebrity, you tell a story that someone asked you for an autograph while you were naked in a shower at the gym.
Fresh Air
Best Of: Jason Isbell / David Tennant
So, David, you grew up outside of Glasgow in Paisley. Your father was a Presbyterian minister. So do you remember your father's sermons? Were they fiery or more contemplative?
Fresh Air
Best Of: Jason Isbell / David Tennant
Well, he must have been because for a year... He served as the moderator of the General Assembly of the Church of Scotland, which is basically like the highest position in the church.
Fresh Air
Best Of: Jason Isbell / David Tennant
He also had a TV show called That's the Spirit that he co-hosted.
Fresh Air
Best Of: Jason Isbell / David Tennant
I have a hard time believing the story, but it's been told many times. Oh, come on. What's this? At the age of three, you told your family that you wanted to be an actor because you wanted to play Doctor Who.
Fresh Air
Best Of: Jason Isbell / David Tennant
Well, first of all, just the wish fulfillment that you were able to achieve in your adulthood playing one of the most famous Doctor Whos. But also, did you, at the age of three, understand that Doctor Who was an actor? Like, did you want to act as Doctor Who? Did you want to be Doctor Who? Yeah.
Fresh Air
Best Of: Jason Isbell / David Tennant
From WHYY in Philadelphia, I'm Sam Brigger with Fresh Air Weekend. Today, musician Jason Isbell. The songs on his new album are about... Old relationships, new relationships, gratitude, fear, loss, grief, joy. Several songs allude to the fracturing of his marriage to musician Amanda Shires. Terry asked if they could find a way to talk about these songs without being invasive.
Fresh Air
Best Of: Jason Isbell / David Tennant
So where I grew up, you couldn't just get Doctor Who on the 13 channels that we had.
Fresh Air
Best Of: Jason Isbell / David Tennant
We had three. But there was this other dial where you could – it was kind of like a radio dial where you could dial in – like farther television stations. And sometimes I could dial in like the out of state public television show that did have Dr. Who. And the things that I remember about it was first that it was really scary. Like the monsters were scary and the theme music terrified me.
Fresh Air
Best Of: Jason Isbell / David Tennant
But then the thing that I also noticed was like sometimes I would notice how cheaply made the show was. Like why are all these sci-fi futuristic characters wearing clothes that look like they were borrowed from like Masterpiece Theater? And then in all of these science fiction or futuristic sets, there are always these drapes everywhere like blocking off sections of the stage. I don't know.
Fresh Air
Best Of: Jason Isbell / David Tennant
Well, let's hear you from Doctor Who. This is from your first big scene. You've just been regenerated. This would happen. It's sort of like the character would be reincarnated, which was a convenient way to have new actors play this role. And so you're reintroducing yourself to your traveling companion played by Billy Piper and some other characters.
Fresh Air
Best Of: Jason Isbell / David Tennant
And you're also surrounded by some pretty tough looking aliens. Let's hear this. Now, first things first.
Fresh Air
Best Of: Jason Isbell / David Tennant
That's our guest David Tennant as Doctor Who in his first big scene. So you're asking, you're like, who am I there? One of the things that I really liked about your portrayal of of the Doctor was this unbridled enthusiasm that you brought to the character.
Fresh Air
Best Of: Jason Isbell / David Tennant
But here you are at this point, you've been classically trained, you went to the Royal Scottish Academy of Music and Dance, and now you're playing this important British pop figure. How did all of the things that you had learned and the ways that you've trained help you sort of embody this role?
Fresh Air
Best Of: Jason Isbell / David Tennant
Well, it's pretty remarkable how much the show has given you. Again, like it's sort of this great wish fulfillment. You also met your wife, Georgia, on the show. She actually played your daughter in an episode.
Fresh Air
Best Of: Jason Isbell / David Tennant
She's an adult character, yes, exactly. And George's father, your father-in-law, was a different incarnation of Doctor Who.
Fresh Air
Best Of: Jason Isbell / David Tennant
Well, David Tennant, it's been a real pleasure to talk with you. Thank you so much for coming on Fresh Air.
Fresh Air
Best Of: Jason Isbell / David Tennant
David Tennant's podcast, called David Tennant Does a Podcast With, is now in its third season. Fresh Air Weekend is produced by Teresa Madden. Fresh Air's executive producer is Danny Miller. Our technical director and engineer is Audrey Bentham.
Fresh Air
Best Of: Jason Isbell / David Tennant
Our interviews and reviews are produced and edited by Phyllis Myers, Roberta Shurock, Anne-Marie Baldonado, Lauren Krenzel, Monique Nazareth, Thea Chaloner, Susan Yakundi, and Anna Bauman. Our digital media producer is Molly Seavey Nesper. For Terry Gross and Tanya Mosley, I'm Sam Brigger.
Fresh Air
Best Of: Jason Isbell / David Tennant
Also, we hear from Scottish actor David Tennant. When he was three, he told his parents he wanted to grow up to play Doctor Who on TV. As a teen, he held on to that dream.
Fresh Air
Best Of: The Innovation Of 'I Love Lucy' / Mark Hamill
Todd Purdom is the author of the new book, Desi Arnaz, The Man Who Invented Television. Paul Rubens, the actor best known for his alter ego Pee Wee Herman, died in 2023 after a private six-year battle with cancer. Near the end of his life, Rubens collaborated on a documentary, sitting for 40 hours of intimate interviews with director Matt Wolfe.
Fresh Air
Best Of: The Innovation Of 'I Love Lucy' / Mark Hamill
The result of that effort is the two-part HBO documentary Pee Wee As Himself. TV critic David Bianculli has this review.
Fresh Air
Best Of: The Innovation Of 'I Love Lucy' / Mark Hamill
This is Fresh Air Weekend. I'm Sam Brigger. Our first interview today is with Terry Gross and Todd Purdom, author of the new book Desi Arnaz, The Man Who Invented Television.
Fresh Air
Best Of: The Innovation Of 'I Love Lucy' / Mark Hamill
David Bianculli is a professor of television studies at Rowan University. He reviewed the new HBO documentary, Pee Wee As Himself. Coming up, we hear from actor Mark Hamill, best known for playing Luke Skywalker. He's in the new movie, The Life of Chuck, which was adapted from a Stephen King story. I'm Sam Brigger, and this is Fresh Air Weekend. Our next guest today is actor Mark Hamill.
Fresh Air
Best Of: The Innovation Of 'I Love Lucy' / Mark Hamill
He's in the new movie The Life of Chuck by director Mike Flanagan, who adapted the movie from a Stephen King story. You might be surprised to hear that the film is not a horror movie. Flanagan's best known for horror films, and Stephen King is, well, Stephen King.
Fresh Air
Best Of: The Innovation Of 'I Love Lucy' / Mark Hamill
If it is horror, the life of Chuck is of the existential kind, asking questions like, are the length of our lives predetermined by supernatural forces? Does fate control us? Are we actually the product of someone else's imagination? Mark Hamill plays Chuck's grandfather, Albie, a hard-drinking accountant, a kind man, but haunted by his secrets.
Fresh Air
Best Of: The Innovation Of 'I Love Lucy' / Mark Hamill
When you hear Mark Hamill's name, it's hard not to think of an epic story that took place a long time ago in a galaxy far, far away, as Hamill played one of the most iconic heroes in movie history, Luke Skywalker in the 1977 film Star Wars, a movie that changed Hollywood and the larger culture. Hamill was Luke in the original trilogy and reprised the role in the last trilogy that began in 2015.
Fresh Air
Best Of: The Innovation Of 'I Love Lucy' / Mark Hamill
Hamill's other big recurring role, one that he had for three decades, was as a villain. He was the Joker in Batman the Animated Series, part of his long career as a voice actor. He said he would stop doing the voice of the Joker, though, when the actor who played Batman, Kevin Conroy, died in 2022. This is not the first time Hamill has worked with the director of The Life of Chuck.
Fresh Air
Best Of: The Innovation Of 'I Love Lucy' / Mark Hamill
He also appeared in Mike Flanagan's Netflix horror series, The Fall of the House of Usher, as a lawyer and fixer named Arthur Pym. Let's start with a clip from The Life of Chuck. Here Albie is going over his grandson Chuck's math homework. Chuck lives with him since his parents died in a car accident. Chuck's good at math, but his passion is dancing, and Albie's about to give him some tough love.
Fresh Air
Best Of: The Innovation Of 'I Love Lucy' / Mark Hamill
You have art in you. That's a scene with Mark Hamill, our guest in the new movie, The Life of Chuck. Mark Hamill, welcome to Fresh Air. Thank you, Sam. So you've worked with Mike Flanagan before. Did he come to you asking you to play this role? What did he tell you about it?
Fresh Air
Best Of: The Innovation Of 'I Love Lucy' / Mark Hamill
The movie itself might be indescribable, but one thing that is describable is the mustache you have in this movie, which is like a Wilford Brimley, soup-straining, walrus kind of mustache. So is that yours? Did you grow that thing?
Fresh Air
Best Of: The Innovation Of 'I Love Lucy' / Mark Hamill
But that's okay. We just listened to this clip, and what the listeners aren't seeing is how the speech is going over with the young Chuck, and his eyes are as big as saucers. I mean, it's a nice speech you're making, but you're basically kind of crushing his dreams. You're like, don't be a dancer, be an accountant.
Fresh Air
Best Of: The Innovation Of 'I Love Lucy' / Mark Hamill
Well, I was wondering, did you ever get that version of that speech when you were young and full of acting ambitions?
Fresh Air
Best Of: The Innovation Of 'I Love Lucy' / Mark Hamill
From WHYY in Philadelphia, this is Fresh Air Weekend. I'm Sam Brigger.
Fresh Air
Best Of: The Innovation Of 'I Love Lucy' / Mark Hamill
So you were doing research on the people.
Fresh Air
Best Of: The Innovation Of 'I Love Lucy' / Mark Hamill
Mark, I thought we would start this part of the conversation with a cameo you did on The Simpsons. You're appearing, I think it's a comic convention. You come out of a spaceship dressed like Luke Skywalker, and with a lightsaber, you knock over a bunch of cardboard cutouts of stormtroopers and also Wonder Woman for some reason. Let's hear the clip.
Fresh Air
Best Of: The Innovation Of 'I Love Lucy' / Mark Hamill
Well, let's use this as a segue to talk about being Luke Skywalker a little bit. I think when you auditioned for Star Wars, you came in and didn't know what you were auditioning for, and you auditioned both for Carrie and Star Wars at the same time. Is that true?
Fresh Air
Best Of: The Innovation Of 'I Love Lucy' / Mark Hamill
So, you know, I imagine as an actor that an important part of your job and something that helps you do your job is like the feedback you receive from other actors in the scene, like from their energy, from their expressions, like you probably work off of each other. But for you, some of your most famous dramatic moments. scenes in these Star Wars movies, you're acting opposite a puppet.
Fresh Air
Best Of: The Innovation Of 'I Love Lucy' / Mark Hamill
And even though it's Frank Oz, great puppet master, was that difficult? Was it difficult to stay in the moment when you're expressing yourself to Yoda, who is not a real person, of course?
Fresh Air
Best Of: The Innovation Of 'I Love Lucy' / Mark Hamill
Playing Ricky Ricardo on I Love Lucy made Desi Arnaz a star. Behind the scenes, he created what became standard procedures for producing, shooting, lighting, and broadcasting TV sitcoms. Today, author Todd Purdom talks about his new book, Desi Arnaz, The Man Who Invented Television. Also, we hear from Mark Hamill.
Fresh Air
Best Of: The Innovation Of 'I Love Lucy' / Mark Hamill
Well, Mark Hamill, thank you so much for coming on Fresh Air. Of course. Actor Mark Hamill. He's in the new movie The Life of Chuck, which is adapted from a Stephen King story. Fresh Air Weekend is produced by Teresa Madden. Fresh Air's executive producer is Danny Miller. Our technical director and engineer is Audrey Bentham. Our engineer today is Charlie Kier.
Fresh Air
Best Of: The Innovation Of 'I Love Lucy' / Mark Hamill
Our interviews and reviews are produced and edited by Phyllis Myers, Roberta Shorrock, Anne-Marie Baldonado, Lauren Krenzel, Monique Nazareth, Thea Chaloner, Susan Yakundi, and Anna Bauman. Our digital media producer is Molly C.V. Nesbert. Our consulting video producer is Hope Wilson. For Terry Gross and Tanya Mosley, I'm Sam Brigger.
Fresh Air
Best Of: The Innovation Of 'I Love Lucy' / Mark Hamill
He's in the new movie, The Life of Chuck, and is known for playing the iconic hero, Luke Skywalker, in the Star Wars movies. When George Lucas cast him for the first movie, Hamill wasn't sure what to make of the script, so he turned to his co-star for help.
Fresh Air
Best Of: The Innovation Of 'I Love Lucy' / Mark Hamill
Plus, TV critic David Bianculli reviews the new HBO documentary Pee Wee As Himself. That's coming up on Fresh Air Weekend.
Fresh Air
Best Of: The Innovation Of 'I Love Lucy' / Mark Hamill
We're listening to Terry's interview with Todd Purdom. His new book is Desi Arnaz, The Man Who Invented Television. We'll hear more of their conversation after a short break. I'm Sam Brigger, and this is Fresh Air Weekend.
Fresh Air
Best Of: The Innovation Of 'I Love Lucy' / Mark Hamill
This is Fresh Air Weekend. I'm Sam Brigger. Let's get back to Terry Gross' interview with Todd Purdom. His new book, Desi Arnaz, The Man Who Invented Television, is about Arnaz, his on- and off-screen wife Lucille Ball, their show I Love Lucy, and how Arnaz's innovations and his studio helped shape the early days of television.
Fresh Air
Best Of: Amanda Knox / 'Adolescence' Co-Creator & Actor Stephen Graham
In the historical drama A Thousand Blows, Stephen Graham plays a bare-knuckle boxer in Victorian London, prone to rage and more likely to beat you up than have a conversation with you. The show was created by Stephen Knight, who also created Peaky Blinders, something you may have caught Stephen Graham in in its final season, playing the character of Union Man Hayden Stagg.
Fresh Air
Best Of: Amanda Knox / 'Adolescence' Co-Creator & Actor Stephen Graham
The other show that Stephen Graham is in is Adolescence, one he co-created. It's a four-part miniseries following what happens to a family when their 13-year-old son is arrested for murdering a girl from his school. It's a devastating show, very difficult to watch, and very difficult to stop watching. Graham plays the father, Eddie, trying his best to be a good parent, but maybe not doing enough.
Fresh Air
Best Of: Amanda Knox / 'Adolescence' Co-Creator & Actor Stephen Graham
Adolescence as a show is not interested so much in who is guilty, but why do these kinds of things happen? Is it the family's fault? Is it bullying? Is it part of a kind of toxic masculinity young boys can find on social media while they're sitting alone, supposedly safe, in their own bedrooms? The show is remarkable in many ways, but one of them is technical. Each episode is a one-take.
Fresh Air
Best Of: Amanda Knox / 'Adolescence' Co-Creator & Actor Stephen Graham
There are no edits. The camera is turned on at the beginning of the episode and turned off at the end. They're like plays but moving throughout different locations and scenes. It adds an urgency to the drama. Before we start talking, let's hear a scene from Adolescence.
Fresh Air
Best Of: Amanda Knox / 'Adolescence' Co-Creator & Actor Stephen Graham
This is from the first episode, where the police have raided the family's home, arrested the son Jamie, and taken him to the police station. Here's Stephen Graham, who is in shock, is asking Jamie's court-appointed lawyer, played by Mark Stanley, what he can do in this moment of crisis.
Fresh Air
Best Of: Amanda Knox / 'Adolescence' Co-Creator & Actor Stephen Graham
That's a scene from Adolescence starring my guest Stephen Graham. Stephen Graham, welcome to Fresh Air.
Fresh Air
Best Of: Amanda Knox / 'Adolescence' Co-Creator & Actor Stephen Graham
Thank you. Thank you.
Fresh Air
Best Of: Amanda Knox / 'Adolescence' Co-Creator & Actor Stephen Graham
Stephen Graham, thank you so much for coming on Fresh Air.
Fresh Air
Best Of: Inside The Pronatalist Movement / Making Sense Of Trauma
Hey, Sam Sanders here with KCRW, personally inviting you to check out my new podcast. It's an entertainment show that tries to figure out what makes the culture tick and tell the stories behind creators we love. New episodes are out every Friday, wherever you get your podcasts.
Fresh Air
'Adolescence' Co-Creator/Actor Asks Not Whodunnit, But Why
Like, as an actor, how hard is that to go through? I guess, like, is there an aftermath that you have to reckon with after doing that kind of performance?
Fresh Air
'Adolescence' Co-Creator/Actor Asks Not Whodunnit, But Why
There are no edits. The camera is turned on at the beginning of the episode and turned off at the end. They're like plays but moving throughout different locations and scenes. It adds an urgency to the drama. You may have first seen Stephen Graham in the Guy Ritchie movie Snatch, playing the role of Tommy, Jason Statham's sidekick.
Fresh Air
'Adolescence' Co-Creator/Actor Asks Not Whodunnit, But Why
His breakout role was playing Combo, a white nationalist skinhead in This Is England. He's been in lots of other movies and TV shows, but some recent memorable ones were his portrayal of Al Capone in Broadway Empire and as a mafia and union head in Martin Scorsese's movie The Irishman, where he steals some scenes from no less an actor than Al Pacino himself.
Fresh Air
'Adolescence' Co-Creator/Actor Asks Not Whodunnit, But Why
If you're just joining us, we're speaking with actor Stephen Graham, who stars in two new shows, Adolescence on Netflix and A Thousand Blows on Hulu. He'll be back after a short break. I'm Sam Brigger, and this is Fresh Air.
Fresh Air
'Adolescence' Co-Creator/Actor Asks Not Whodunnit, But Why
Stephen, I wanted to talk briefly with you about A Thousand Blows. You're playing actually a real-life person named Henry Sugar Goodson, who was a bare-knuckle boxer in Victorian London. And I just wanted to play a scene from the show. You have been undefeated, but there is this newcomer from Jamaica named Hezekiah Mosko. And...
Fresh Air
'Adolescence' Co-Creator/Actor Asks Not Whodunnit, But Why
When you're fighting him, it looks like you're going to lose but someone in your corner trips him and you're declared the winner even though it was unfair. But you're really shaken by this – the fact that you thought you were going to lose so you want to fight him again. So in this scene, Hezekiah who's played by Malachi Kirby comes into your bar.
Fresh Air
'Adolescence' Co-Creator/Actor Asks Not Whodunnit, But Why
You're training in the back and he talks to your brother who says like, look, if you fall in the third round, I'll pay you. And Hezekiah doesn't like that so he calls to you out in the back.
Fresh Air
'Adolescence' Co-Creator/Actor Asks Not Whodunnit, But Why
Before we start talking, let's hear a scene from Adolescence. This is from the first episode, where the police have raided the family's home, arrested the son Jamie, and taken him to the police station. Here's Stephen Graham, who is in shock, is asking Jamie's court-appointed lawyer, played by Mark Stanley, what he can do in this moment of crisis. Excuse me, mate.
Fresh Air
'Adolescence' Co-Creator/Actor Asks Not Whodunnit, But Why
That's Stephen Graham in the show A Thousand Blows. Stephen, you know, this character you're playing, Sugar Goodson, is an incredibly closed-off person. He's prone to rages. Like, he's... Something will click in him and he'll beat people to death, even if they're people he loves. And, you know, this could have been a pretty one-dimensional character. Like, play them as just a monster.
Fresh Air
'Adolescence' Co-Creator/Actor Asks Not Whodunnit, But Why
But you bring out... And some humanity in him. And I just, can you just talk about like finding the complexity of the character?
Fresh Air
'Adolescence' Co-Creator/Actor Asks Not Whodunnit, But Why
You were probably on a very restrictive diet, probably like a lot of proteins and stuff like that and eating the same things day after day. It sounds like you've kept your physique up, so congratulations on that. But when you were done filming, do you remember like the first thing you ate that was like a milkshake or something like that?
Fresh Air
'Adolescence' Co-Creator/Actor Asks Not Whodunnit, But Why
You also said that shoes are really important to your characters. Yeah.
Fresh Air
'Adolescence' Co-Creator/Actor Asks Not Whodunnit, But Why
Well, if you're just joining us, we're speaking with actor Stephen Graham, who stars in two shows right now, one on Netflix, Adolescence, and the other on Hulu, A Thousand Blows. We'll be back after a short break. This is Fresh Air. Steven, I wanted to go back a little bit to one of your early successes, which is the movie This Is England from 2006.
Fresh Air
'Adolescence' Co-Creator/Actor Asks Not Whodunnit, But Why
And you play a racist and violent prone skinhead named Combo. And there's a pretty famous speech in the movie that's heavily infused with white nationalist ideology. We're not going to play it because I think there's an F word in every sentence. So there'd just be lots of bleeps.
Fresh Air
'Adolescence' Co-Creator/Actor Asks Not Whodunnit, But Why
But I imagine in an acting career, there's a lot of times where you have to espouse beliefs as a character that you don't hold yourself. But I was wondering if this one... may have been particularly hard, obviously in part because it's just racist, but also because you have a multiracial background and one of your grandfathers is from Jamaica.
Fresh Air
'Adolescence' Co-Creator/Actor Asks Not Whodunnit, But Why
Did that make playing this character particularly difficult for you?
Fresh Air
'Adolescence' Co-Creator/Actor Asks Not Whodunnit, But Why
You grew up just outside of Liverpool in Kirby. And did you have to deal with issues of racism as a child coming from a mixed family?
Fresh Air
'Adolescence' Co-Creator/Actor Asks Not Whodunnit, But Why
That's a scene from Adolescence starring my guest Stephen Graham. Stephen Graham, welcome to Fresh Air.
Fresh Air
'Adolescence' Co-Creator/Actor Asks Not Whodunnit, But Why
You said your stepfather helped you sort of with your cultural and racial identity. He also helped you when you told your family you wanted to be an actor. Do you have this great story of him taking you to the video store and renting like all these great movies? Yeah. Yeah, he did.
Fresh Air
'Adolescence' Co-Creator/Actor Asks Not Whodunnit, But Why
So the show Adolescence was actually your idea. You came to your co-creator, Jack Thorne, with the idea. What was it that you were thinking about that you wanted to explore on the screen?
Fresh Air
'Adolescence' Co-Creator/Actor Asks Not Whodunnit, But Why
And I guess that one of the things is that you're exploring why, but it's not a didactic show. You sort of let the feelings and the issues sort of stew there, but you're not resolving them.
Fresh Air
'Adolescence' Co-Creator/Actor Asks Not Whodunnit, But Why
In the historical drama A Thousand Blows, Stephen Graham plays a bare-knuckle boxer in Victorian London, prone to rage and more likely to beat you up than have a conversation with you. The show was created by Stephen Knight, who also created Peaky Blinders, something you may have caught Stephen Graham in in its final season, playing the character of Union Man Hayden Stagg.
Fresh Air
'Adolescence' Co-Creator/Actor Asks Not Whodunnit, But Why
So your character, Eddie, is a successful businessman. He has a plumbing business. He's lifted himself up in the world. He's trying to be a good husband and a good father. And you say that you based him to some degree on your uncle's and your friend's fathers. What was it about them that you took?
Fresh Air
'Adolescence' Co-Creator/Actor Asks Not Whodunnit, But Why
So Eddie is an interesting character because he can be very emotional, but he's also not really in touch with his emotions. Like they kind of have their way with him.
Fresh Air
'Adolescence' Co-Creator/Actor Asks Not Whodunnit, But Why
The other show that Stephen Graham is in is Adolescence, one he co-created. It's a four-part miniseries following what happens to a family when their 13-year-old son is arrested for murdering a girl from his school. It's a devastating show, very difficult to watch, and very difficult to stop watching. Graham plays the father, Eddie, trying his best to be a good parent, but maybe not doing enough.
Fresh Air
'Adolescence' Co-Creator/Actor Asks Not Whodunnit, But Why
So just talking about the sort of technical issue, as I said, like each of these episodes is one take. There's no editing. This is similar to a movie that you did a few years back called Boiling Point, which takes place in a restaurant. It's a great film. But it's one location. But here, like in this first episode, you – Start in the family home and then you drive to the station.
Fresh Air
'Adolescence' Co-Creator/Actor Asks Not Whodunnit, But Why
The camera's following you and then you have to get all the other actors from the house to the station. Like talk about some of the technical things that you had to figure out.
Fresh Air
'Adolescence' Co-Creator/Actor Asks Not Whodunnit, But Why
Because they are kind of like little plays.
Fresh Air
'Adolescence' Co-Creator/Actor Asks Not Whodunnit, But Why
Owen Cooper, who plays your son, Jamie?
Fresh Air
'Adolescence' Co-Creator/Actor Asks Not Whodunnit, But Why
Which was an actual location with hundreds of kids walking around. Yeah.
Fresh Air
'Adolescence' Co-Creator/Actor Asks Not Whodunnit, But Why
Adolescence as a show is not interested so much in who is guilty, but why do these kinds of things happen? Is it the family's fault? Is it bullying? Is it part of a kind of toxic masculinity young boys can find on social media while they're sitting alone, supposedly safe, in their own bedrooms? The show is remarkable in many ways, but one of them is technical. Each episode is a one-take.
Fresh Air
'Adolescence' Co-Creator/Actor Asks Not Whodunnit, But Why
Would you know after doing all your takes that you were kind of leaning towards one that you would eventually use or?
Fresh Air
'Adolescence' Co-Creator/Actor Asks Not Whodunnit, But Why
I wanted to play another clip from the show, and this comes from episode four, which is really about the fallout that the family is dealing with having their son accused of murder. It's a really devastating episode, and I wanted to play a part of – a scene between your character and your wife, who's played by Christine Tremarco.
Fresh Air
'Adolescence' Co-Creator/Actor Asks Not Whodunnit, But Why
And, like, you're basically trying to figure out, like, how did we get here? How did things go so wrong? And what could you have possibly done differently? So let's hear that scene.
Fresh Air
'Adolescence' Co-Creator/Actor Asks Not Whodunnit, But Why
That's from Adolescence, the final episode of the show. This episode is devastating. And the show is going to stay with me, I think, forever, a very long time. And it's really hard to watch. It's really well made. It's really compelling. But you go through a lot of very intense emotions in this episode. Like you have a complete breakdown at one point.
Fresh Air
At 3 Years Old, David Tennant Knew He Wanted To Be Doctor Who
He also hosted the BAFTA Awards for the past two years, Great Britain's version of the Oscars, this year opening the ceremony singing the song 500 Miles in a bespoke black jacket and kilt suit. And he was hilarious to watch playing a version of himself in the streaming comedy staged with Michael Sheehan, one of the few good things to come out of the COVID pandemic.
Fresh Air
At 3 Years Old, David Tennant Knew He Wanted To Be Doctor Who
signify nothing okay so that's from the film version of Macbeth um so you know I'm wearing headphones now so I feel like I'm sort of experiencing what that would have been like for the audience because you are really whispering and I guess I was wondering like if you were doing that in a more traditional theater sense and you had to project to the cheap seats like how do you approach that same speech in those sort of two different scenarios
Fresh Air
At 3 Years Old, David Tennant Knew He Wanted To Be Doctor Who
And how many times did you do the play? Oh, 150 or something. So every time it feels different?
Fresh Air
At 3 Years Old, David Tennant Knew He Wanted To Be Doctor Who
Our guest is David Tennant. He'll be back after a short break. I'm Sam Brigger, and this is Fresh Air.
Fresh Air
At 3 Years Old, David Tennant Knew He Wanted To Be Doctor Who
David Tennant also has a podcast called David Tennant Does a Podcast With, where you fill in the name of the guest from that episode, often an actor he has worked with. A third season of the podcast released this year, and while we might have said, hey, David Tennant, stay in your lane. There's enough long-format interview shows out there.
Fresh Air
At 3 Years Old, David Tennant Knew He Wanted To Be Doctor Who
So, David, you grew up outside of Glasgow in Paisley. Your father was a Presbyterian minister. So do you remember your father's sermons? Were they fiery or more contemplative?
Fresh Air
At 3 Years Old, David Tennant Knew He Wanted To Be Doctor Who
But he was a good preacher, yeah. Well, he must have been because for a year, he served as the moderator of the General Assembly of the Church of Scotland, which is basically like the highest position in the church.
Fresh Air
At 3 Years Old, David Tennant Knew He Wanted To Be Doctor Who
He also had a TV show called That's the Spirit that he co-hosted.
Fresh Air
At 3 Years Old, David Tennant Knew He Wanted To Be Doctor Who
Instead, we decided that this would be a good opportunity to have him on our long-format interview show to ask him about his life and career. So David Tennant, welcome to Fresh Air. Thank you very much for having me. You did two seasons of your podcast ending in 2020, but then you came back last month with the third season. Why did you come back now?
Fresh Air
At 3 Years Old, David Tennant Knew He Wanted To Be Doctor Who
I have a hard time believing the story, but it's been told many times. Oh, come on. What's this? At the age of three, you told your family that you wanted to be an actor because you wanted to play Doctor Who.
Fresh Air
At 3 Years Old, David Tennant Knew He Wanted To Be Doctor Who
Well, first of all, just the wish fulfillment that you were able to achieve in your adulthood playing one of the most famous Doctor Whos. But also, like, did you at the age of three understand that Doctor Who was an actor? Like, did you want to act as Doctor Who? Did you want to be Doctor Who? Yeah.
Fresh Air
At 3 Years Old, David Tennant Knew He Wanted To Be Doctor Who
Do you remember what was so captivating about the show to you?
Fresh Air
At 3 Years Old, David Tennant Knew He Wanted To Be Doctor Who
So where I grew up, you couldn't just get Doctor Who on the 13 channels that we had.
Fresh Air
At 3 Years Old, David Tennant Knew He Wanted To Be Doctor Who
I don't know if televisions were the same.
Fresh Air
At 3 Years Old, David Tennant Knew He Wanted To Be Doctor Who
We had three. But there was this other dial where you could – it was kind of like a radio dial where you could dial in – like farther television stations and sometimes I could dial in like the out of state public television show that did have Doctor Who and the things that I remember about it was first that it was really scary like the monsters were scary and the theme music terrified me
Fresh Air
At 3 Years Old, David Tennant Knew He Wanted To Be Doctor Who
But then the thing that I also noticed was like sometimes I would notice how cheaply made the show was. Like why are all these sci-fi futuristic characters wearing clothes that look like they were borrowed from like Masterpiece Theater? And then in all of these science fiction or futuristic sets, there are always these drapes everywhere like blocking off sections of the stage. I don't know.
Fresh Air
At 3 Years Old, David Tennant Knew He Wanted To Be Doctor Who
So those were my early memories of it.
Fresh Air
At 3 Years Old, David Tennant Knew He Wanted To Be Doctor Who
Well, let's hear you from Doctor Who. This is from your first big scene. You've just been regenerated. This would happen. It's sort of like the character would be reincarnated, which was a convenient way to have new actors play this role. And so you're reintroducing yourself to your traveling companion played by Billy Piper and some other characters.
Fresh Air
At 3 Years Old, David Tennant Knew He Wanted To Be Doctor Who
And you're also surrounded by some pretty tough looking aliens. Let's hear this. Now, first things first. Be honest.
Fresh Air
At 3 Years Old, David Tennant Knew He Wanted To Be Doctor Who
That's our guest David Tennant as Doctor Who in his first big scene. So you're asking, you're like, who am I there? One of the things that I really liked about your portrayal of of the Doctor was this unbridled enthusiasm that you brought to the character.
Fresh Air
At 3 Years Old, David Tennant Knew He Wanted To Be Doctor Who
But here you are at this point, you've been classically trained, you went to the Royal Scottish Academy of Music and Dance, and now you're playing this important British pop figure. How did all of the things that you had learned and the ways that you've trained help you sort of embody this role?
Fresh Air
At 3 Years Old, David Tennant Knew He Wanted To Be Doctor Who
Well, it's pretty remarkable how much the show has given you. Again, like it's sort of this great wish fulfillment. You also met your wife, Georgia, on the show. She actually played your daughter in an episode.
Fresh Air
At 3 Years Old, David Tennant Knew He Wanted To Be Doctor Who
She's an adult character in the show. She's an adult character, yes, exactly. And George's father, your father-in-law, was a different incarnation of Doctor Who.
Fresh Air
At 3 Years Old, David Tennant Knew He Wanted To Be Doctor Who
When you go into these interviews, like, do you have a specific agenda? Like, are you when you're like, oh, Olivia Colman, I've always wanted to know this about her? Or do you sometimes think about things in your own career which have puzzled you that gives you an opportunity to ask someone else who does the same work?
Fresh Air
At 3 Years Old, David Tennant Knew He Wanted To Be Doctor Who
Our guest is actor David Tennant. More after a short break. This is Fresh Air.
Fresh Air
At 3 Years Old, David Tennant Knew He Wanted To Be Doctor Who
You've also played a bunch of villains in your career. And one that particularly stays with me is the supervillain Kilgrave from the Marvel TV show Jessica Jones. And Kilgrave basically can have people do whatever he wants. He can just command them. He abuses this ability and Very sadistic ways, taking away consent from women, like telling people, like, if I'm late, carve your face off.
Fresh Air
At 3 Years Old, David Tennant Knew He Wanted To Be Doctor Who
And, you know, this character is charmless and like really repugnant. Can you talk about how you found a way to play him?
Fresh Air
At 3 Years Old, David Tennant Knew He Wanted To Be Doctor Who
Speaking about coping with being a celebrity, you tell a story that someone asked you for an autograph while you were naked in a shower at the gym.
Fresh Air
At 3 Years Old, David Tennant Knew He Wanted To Be Doctor Who
on three seasons of the show staged with Michael Sheen.
Fresh Air
At 3 Years Old, David Tennant Knew He Wanted To Be Doctor Who
Oh, yeah. This show largely takes place, at least it seems to, I don't know if it was filmed this way, but as a series of Zoom calls between you and Michael Sheen and your respective spouses and other people. At least in the first season, you're rehearsing this play. during COVID, hoping that when the lockdown is over, you'll have this thing ready to go.
Fresh Air
At 3 Years Old, David Tennant Knew He Wanted To Be Doctor Who
And of course, that doesn't work out so well. So how did this show come about?
Fresh Air
At 3 Years Old, David Tennant Knew He Wanted To Be Doctor Who
Scottish actor David Tennant's list of accomplishments is as long as it has varied. Perhaps best known for playing Doctor Who, he is also considered one of the finest Shakespearean actors of his generation, as you can see now in the film of his Macbeth, which was staged in 2023, with Tennant playing the lead and Cush Jumbo as Lady Macbeth. It's now streaming on Marquee TV.
Fresh Air
At 3 Years Old, David Tennant Knew He Wanted To Be Doctor Who
He was quite funny in the show.
Fresh Air
At 3 Years Old, David Tennant Knew He Wanted To Be Doctor Who
I have to say that when I first heard about the show, I didn't think I was going to enjoy watching it. Oh, no. It sounds desperately dull.
Fresh Air
At 3 Years Old, David Tennant Knew He Wanted To Be Doctor Who
We were all living our lives on Zoom. And the last thing I wanted to do was watch a TV show about Zoom. However, it quickly won me over because it's so funny. I thought we would play a scene from the show. Oh, good. To set this up, Michael Sheehan is irritated with you at this point. That's that track. Yeah. Because originally you were going to do this play with someone else.
Fresh Air
At 3 Years Old, David Tennant Knew He Wanted To Be Doctor Who
So he was the second choice. So you guys are doing a reading. And I think we'll also hear Simon Evans in this. And he's desperate to keep things on track. But Michael Sheehan is basically trying to pick a fight with you. And you have had a line where you use the word heard. And he's questioning how you're saying that word. So let's hear that.
Fresh Air
At 3 Years Old, David Tennant Knew He Wanted To Be Doctor Who
That's a scene from the show staged with Michael Sheehan and our guest David Tennant. David Tennant, there's so many times watching that show where I just laughed out loud. You guys have such a great rapport. Can you talk about the version of yourself that you're playing in the show?
Fresh Air
At 3 Years Old, David Tennant Knew He Wanted To Be Doctor Who
He is also memorably played Hamlet and Richard II. You probably watched him as the haunted and brooding detective in the British crime drama Broadchurch, and maybe even in the American adaptation called Grace Point, where he plays more or less the same role but with an American accent.
Fresh Air
At 3 Years Old, David Tennant Knew He Wanted To Be Doctor Who
Well, it's so funny. Just your look on the show, you just look stupefied with boredom the whole time. Your mouth is hanging open. Well, it was a particular time, wasn't it? It certainly was. One of the funny sight gags is that you keep getting caught drinking out of this mug with your face on it. And they keep saying, is that you on that mug?
Fresh Air
At 3 Years Old, David Tennant Knew He Wanted To Be Doctor Who
So you said you were home. You and your wife, Georgia, have five kids. I have two kids. And it was very tough to sort of keep them busy, keep them on their schooling during COVID. What was it like with five? Like, was your house just crazy all the time?
Fresh Air
At 3 Years Old, David Tennant Knew He Wanted To Be Doctor Who
David Tennant has also been his share of screen villains, including real-life serial killer Dennis Nilsen in the miniseries Dez, Kilgrave in the Marvel TV show Jessica Jones, one of the most repugnant characters I have ever seen, as well as the smaller but memorable, lip-licking Barty Crouch Jr. in Harry Potter and the Goblet of Fire.
Fresh Air
At 3 Years Old, David Tennant Knew He Wanted To Be Doctor Who
So I wanted to talk to you a little bit about your work doing Shakespeare. Your version of Macbeth that I think was originally staged in 2023 is now available to stream on Marquee TV. And you star with Kush Jumbo as Lady Macbeth. Yeah. This is a very minimalist staging. The stage itself is pretty much like this white platform.
Fresh Air
At 3 Years Old, David Tennant Knew He Wanted To Be Doctor Who
And the audience is sort of around the stage. And I noticed watching the film of it that all the audience members were wearing headphones. Why was that?
Fresh Air
At 3 Years Old, David Tennant Knew He Wanted To Be Doctor Who
Let's hear what one of those soliloquies sounds like. This is the famous tomorrow and tomorrow and tomorrow soliloquy from the end of the play. And you have just discovered that Lady Macbeth has been killed.
Fresh Air
Folk Musician Jerron Paxton Transports Us To the '20s
And this says nylon strings rather than steel strings. Is that correct?
Fresh Air
Folk Musician Jerron Paxton Transports Us To the '20s
To me, it sounds like with the nylon strings, you can play, your sound can be mellower, but it also seems to allow for a lot more dynamics. Do you think that's true?
Fresh Air
Folk Musician Jerron Paxton Transports Us To the '20s
On the song that you play on the album, It's All Over Now, in the liner notes, you say that you play this stroke style. Can you explain what that is or demonstrate that for us?
Fresh Air
Folk Musician Jerron Paxton Transports Us To the '20s
John, that was great. We need to take a break here. We'll be back after a moment. I'm Sam Brigger, and this is Fresh Air.
Fresh Air
Folk Musician Jerron Paxton Transports Us To the '20s
When you were a kid, did you just spend a lot of time on your own just playing music, like learning how to play, like practicing and practicing?
Fresh Air
Folk Musician Jerron Paxton Transports Us To the '20s
You know, this music, especially when you were a kid, the Internet wasn't as prevalent everywhere. Like, it's not easy music to find. You have to search it out. So, like, how did you find out more about the music? Did you look for old 78s? Did you go to the library? What did you do?
Fresh Air
Folk Musician Jerron Paxton Transports Us To the '20s
It sounds like you also met people who knew some of the older musicians. Like you met people that knew the guitarist Johnny St. Cyr because I guess he died in Los Angeles when he was older. So he played with Louis Armstrong as well as Jelly Roll Morton. And I think you play one of his rags. Is that right? Yeah.
Fresh Air
Folk Musician Jerron Paxton Transports Us To the '20s
Would you mind playing a little bit of that song?
Fresh Air
Folk Musician Jerron Paxton Transports Us To the '20s
I hope you're treating that old banjo nicely.
Fresh Air
Folk Musician Jerron Paxton Transports Us To the '20s
That's great. That's Jerome Paxton playing a rag by Johnny St. Cyr, who played with Louis Armstrong and Jelly Roll Morton. More after a break. This is Fresh Air. When you were a teenager, you started having trouble with your eyesight. What was happening?
Fresh Air
Folk Musician Jerron Paxton Transports Us To the '20s
That's the song Things Done Changed from the new album by Jerron Paxson of the same name. Jerron Paxson, welcome so much to Fresh Air.
Fresh Air
Folk Musician Jerron Paxton Transports Us To the '20s
Since you were so interested in trains or you were interested in being a train driver as a kid, do you particularly like train songs?
Fresh Air
Folk Musician Jerron Paxton Transports Us To the '20s
So, as I said, you've released a few albums before, but this is your first album of your own compositions. Have you been writing all along but just recently decided to release these songs?
Fresh Air
Folk Musician Jerron Paxton Transports Us To the '20s
Would you mind playing one that you like particularly?
Fresh Air
Folk Musician Jerron Paxton Transports Us To the '20s
Before you play the harmonica, I just want to say that, like all the instruments you play, you seem to be able to make it sound like you're playing two different parts on the harmonica. So I don't know if you do that in this song, but I just wanted listeners to keep an ear out for that.
Fresh Air
Folk Musician Jerron Paxton Transports Us To the '20s
John, that was great. Thank you. That was our guest, John Paxton, playing the harmonica. Was that hard to figure out how to do?
Fresh Air
Folk Musician Jerron Paxton Transports Us To the '20s
Okay. Well, that couldn't be more cryptic if I'd asked it to be. Yeah. Yeah, I watched a video of you playing and singing a song, Hesitation Blues. All right. No, no, no. But at one point, you were singing, and then you played the harmonica with your nostril at one point.
Fresh Air
Folk Musician Jerron Paxton Transports Us To the '20s
Well, thank you for doing that. Cheers. Our guest is musician Jerron Paxton. He's got a new album of his own original songs called Things Done Changed. We'll be back after a short break. This is Fresh Air. So you said you moved to New York because in part because of the difficulty you were having with your eyesight.
Fresh Air
Folk Musician Jerron Paxton Transports Us To the '20s
But I've also read that you moved to New York in part to learn maybe and play more stride piano. Was there no real scene for that in Los Angeles?
Fresh Air
Folk Musician Jerron Paxton Transports Us To the '20s
The Jalopy Theater has a lot of old-time music in it. But tell us about Stride Piano in particular. I guess one of your heroes is Fats Waller.
Fresh Air
Folk Musician Jerron Paxton Transports Us To the '20s
Well, I wanted to play a bit of you playing sort of old-time jazz piano. And this is from a duet album that you did with a clarinetist and mandolin player, Dennis Lichtman. The album is appropriately called Paxton and Lichtman. And this is part of a song called Caution Blues.
Fresh Air
Folk Musician Jerron Paxton Transports Us To the '20s
Prior to his new album, Jerron Paxton has been entertaining audiences with his take on music that's mostly 100 years old or older. Some of the music dates back to the Civil War. He plays folk music, blues, hot jazz, ragtime, and fiddle and banjo tunes, among others. He's released several albums, but this new album, Things Done Changed, is his first where all the tracks were written by him.
Fresh Air
Folk Musician Jerron Paxton Transports Us To the '20s
And we're going to start sort of partially into the song where Lichtman's playing some clarinet, and then we'll hear you play some piano. So let's just listen to this. That's my guest, Jerron Paxton, playing from a duet album that he did with clarinetist Dennis Lichtman.
Fresh Air
Folk Musician Jerron Paxton Transports Us To the '20s
So, Jerron, when you got to New York, did you find sort of more like-minded musicians who played the kind of music that you enjoyed playing yourself?
Fresh Air
Folk Musician Jerron Paxton Transports Us To the '20s
Well, I wanted to end with a song that I think you like very much. It's written in 1928 by Irving Berlin. It's called Sunshine. I'm going to play this from the album that you did with Dennis Lichtman called Paxton and Lichtman. But before we hear it, can you tell us about the song, like when you first heard it and what you like about it?
Fresh Air
Folk Musician Jerron Paxton Transports Us To the '20s
So you wait for inspiration rather than sit down and say, today I have to write a song?
Fresh Air
Folk Musician Jerron Paxton Transports Us To the '20s
And so Vitaphone shorts are like shorts that you would play in front of movies?
Fresh Air
Folk Musician Jerron Paxton Transports Us To the '20s
Well, we'll hear the song in a second, but first, Gerard Paxson, I just want to thank you so much for coming in today to bring your instruments and playing some music for us. Thank you very much.
Fresh Air
Folk Musician Jerron Paxton Transports Us To the '20s
Can you talk about how you approach the guitar? Is there a particular guitar player that was very influential to how you play?
Fresh Air
Folk Musician Jerron Paxton Transports Us To the '20s
I was wondering if you could show us, perhaps with an instrumental, how you approach the blues. And the blues can be played lots of different ways. One of the ways that it's often played is like a simple three-chord song. But there's a lot going on in the way you play the blues. So could you demonstrate that? I know you brought a guitar with you.
Fresh Air
Folk Musician Jerron Paxton Transports Us To the '20s
And I heard when you were getting ready that this is quite an old guitar, huh?
Fresh Air
Folk Musician Jerron Paxton Transports Us To the '20s
And when you say $4.95, I think you mean $4.95. $4.95, half a week's wages. So how old is this guitar then?
Fresh Air
Folk Musician Jerron Paxton Transports Us To the '20s
So you said that when you're playing a guitar solo, you want it to sound like a bunch of instruments kind of playing together. Could you show us what that's like on the guitar? Sure.
Fresh Air
Folk Musician Jerron Paxton Transports Us To the '20s
Songs that are deeply rooted to music of the 20s and 30s and older, but reflects Paxton's contemporary feelings and observations about things like love, lost and found, gentrification, and finding yourself far from home. Paxton was generous enough to bring some of the instruments he plays to the studio today. If he had brought all the instruments he plays, he would have had to rent a van.
Fresh Air
Folk Musician Jerron Paxton Transports Us To the '20s
That's Jerron Paxton with his guitar joining us today. He's a new album of all original compositions called Things Don't Change. Jerron, thanks so much. That was really great. I love how you can do that and just explain it while you're doing it at the same time. That's not easy to do, just even playing the music.
Fresh Air
Folk Musician Jerron Paxton Transports Us To the '20s
Was there a point in your life when you were like, okay, I figured out how to do this? Do you remember when it started to make sense to you?
Fresh Air
Folk Musician Jerron Paxton Transports Us To the '20s
Geron, you grew up in South Los Angeles near Watts. What was your home like?
Fresh Air
Folk Musician Jerron Paxton Transports Us To the '20s
Guitar, fiddle, piano, harmonica, banjo, and the bones is not even a complete list. Paxton, who is 35, grew up in Los Angeles near Watts and has called himself a throwback in a family of throwbacks. He now lives in New York. Let's hear the title track from the new album. This is Things Done Changed.
Fresh Air
Folk Musician Jerron Paxton Transports Us To the '20s
Well, you've said that you're a throwback from a family of throwbacks. What does that mean?
Fresh Air
Folk Musician Jerron Paxton Transports Us To the '20s
It sounds like you were particularly drawn to the country blues. What do you think it was that spoke to you?
Fresh Air
Folk Musician Jerron Paxton Transports Us To the '20s
And you said your grandfather played the banjo?
Fresh Air
Folk Musician Jerron Paxton Transports Us To the '20s
Well, you brought a banjo with you today. It's kind of a special banjo. Can you tell us about it?
Fresh Air
Kerri Russell On 'The Diplomat'/ Remembering Dorothy Allison
This is Fresh Air. I'm Sam Brigger. If you like to distract yourself from real-world crises with the fictional kind, then you can now watch season two of the Netflix series The Diplomat. Keri Russell stars as Kate Wyler, a career Foreign Service officer with an excellent reputation for handling international crises, often behind the scenes.
Fresh Air
Kerri Russell On 'The Diplomat'/ Remembering Dorothy Allison
And at this point, it doesn't sound like you've done a lot of acting. Did you know what you were getting into? And like, was... Was one of your ambitions to be on television at that point in your life?
Fresh Air
Kerri Russell On 'The Diplomat'/ Remembering Dorothy Allison
Kerry Russell has played two iconic roles on television, the lead on the show Felicity as a young college woman in New York, and Elizabeth Jennings, a Soviet spy in the 80s living undercover in the United States in the critically acclaimed show The Americans. she received three Emmy nominations for that role.
Fresh Air
Kerri Russell On 'The Diplomat'/ Remembering Dorothy Allison
Well, if people haven't seen the show, it was a variety show. And you did some singing, you did some dancing, and then there's a lot of set pieces. So I wonder if you compare your upbringing to your kids' life. And if there was a casting for another Mickey Mouse Club, would you let your kids audition? You had a good time, but it was certainly a unique way to be a teenager.
Fresh Air
Kerri Russell On 'The Diplomat'/ Remembering Dorothy Allison
Carrie Russell, recorded in 2023. Season two of her series The Diplomat is currently streaming on Netflix. We'll hear more of my interview after a break. And later, we remember writer Dorothy Allison, author of the critically acclaimed novel Bastard Out of Carolina. I'm Sam Brigger, and this is Fresh Air.
Fresh Air
Kerri Russell On 'The Diplomat'/ Remembering Dorothy Allison
She got her start on television as a teenager on the all-new Mickey Mouse Club, with a cast that included Britney Spears, Ryan Gosling, Christina Aguilera, and Justin Timberlake. I spoke with Keri Russell in 2023 when The Diplomat premiered. Keri Russell, welcome to Fresh Air.
Fresh Air
Kerri Russell On 'The Diplomat'/ Remembering Dorothy Allison
This is Fresh Air. I'm Sam Brigger. We're listening to my 2023 interview with actor Keri Russell. She stars in the political drama The Diplomat, which is currently streaming season two on Netflix. Russell plays Kate Wyler, a career diplomat tapped by the White House to serve as the U.S. ambassador to the U.K. Russell got her start on television as a teen on the all-new Mickey Mouse Club.
Fresh Air
Kerri Russell On 'The Diplomat'/ Remembering Dorothy Allison
She became famous as the lead on the TV show Felicity and received three Emmy nominations for her role in the series The Americans as a Soviet spy in the 80s living in the U.S. pretending to be an American. So, Carrie, after your time at the new Mickey Mouse Club, you decided to move to Hollywood and try to make it as an actor.
Fresh Air
Kerri Russell On 'The Diplomat'/ Remembering Dorothy Allison
You were on a few shows that didn't quite succeed, like there was an Aaron Spelling show. You were in a Bon Jovi video. Amazing. I didn't quite follow the narrative of that video, but it seems like you had pretty bad news in it. And then you tried out for the show Felicity, which was your really big break. And Felicity is about a girl who graduates from high school in California.
Fresh Air
Kerri Russell On 'The Diplomat'/ Remembering Dorothy Allison
She's planning to go to Stanford. And to pursue a medical degree. But she changes her plans because this boy, Ben Covington, who she's had a crush on but never really talked to, writes like a compelling note in her yearbook. And so she decides to bail on all her plans and follow him.
Fresh Air
Kerri Russell On 'The Diplomat'/ Remembering Dorothy Allison
to New York and he's going to the University of New York which I have to say I always thought was weird like they can name Stanford Stanford but it's you can't have NYU like that's kind of weird but that's besides the point well let's hear a scene from Felicity this is from the first episode where the very earnest and honest Felicity confronts her crush Ben Covington played by Scott Speedman in a college stairway and reveals to him why she's in New York
Fresh Air
Kerri Russell On 'The Diplomat'/ Remembering Dorothy Allison
It's an honor to be here. Well, it's great to have you here. I just wanted to ask you first how you were pitched the show The Diplomat and the character Kate Wyler.
Fresh Air
Kerri Russell On 'The Diplomat'/ Remembering Dorothy Allison
Okay. That's a really hard scene to listen to.
Fresh Air
Kerri Russell On 'The Diplomat'/ Remembering Dorothy Allison
But, you know, you're really good in that, though. Like, you're taking all these awkward pauses, and it sounds really natural. But I have to say that she finds out, I think in that episode or the next episode, that he, on his college essay, he totally made up that his older brother died and that it was his dream all along to go to this school.
Fresh Air
Kerri Russell On 'The Diplomat'/ Remembering Dorothy Allison
And I have to say, Felicity should have totally left him at that point. Yeah. That's a bad sign.
Fresh Air
Kerri Russell On 'The Diplomat'/ Remembering Dorothy Allison
So when Felicity ended, you decided to take a break from acting. Can you talk about that decision?
Fresh Air
Kerri Russell On 'The Diplomat'/ Remembering Dorothy Allison
Well, Keri Russell, it's been such a pleasure talking with you today. Thank you so much for coming to Fresh Air. Thank you so much. I spoke with Keri Russell last year. Season two of her show, The Diplomat, is currently streaming on Netflix. Coming up, we remember writer Dorothy Allison, who wrote with painful honesty about the experience of being physically and sexually abused as a child.
Fresh Air
Kerri Russell On 'The Diplomat'/ Remembering Dorothy Allison
This is Fresh Air. I'm Sam Brigger. When the book was published, George Garrett wrote in the New York Times Book Review, The literary territory that Allison has set out to explore is dangerous turf, a minefield. It is a great pleasure to see her succeed, blithe and graceful, as Baryshnikov in performance. The book was a finalist for the National Book Award for Fiction.
Fresh Air
Kerri Russell On 'The Diplomat'/ Remembering Dorothy Allison
Allison also wrote a collection of short stories called Trash, a second novel called Cave Dweller, and a memoir titled Two or Three Things I Know for Sure. Terry Gross spoke with Dorothy Allison in 1992 when Bastard Out of Carolina was published. Allison said she tried to avoid the pitfalls of the literature of victimology by being as honest as possible.
Fresh Air
Kerri Russell On 'The Diplomat'/ Remembering Dorothy Allison
That honesty meant describing the disturbing, confusing thoughts of the victim. Here's a reading from a third of the way into the book. And please note, this interview includes a difficult discussion about child sexual abuse, and you may consider not listening further.
Fresh Air
Kerri Russell On 'The Diplomat'/ Remembering Dorothy Allison
Her husband Hal, played by Rufus Sewell, is also a diplomat and former ambassador. Let's hear a clip from the current season. But first, a little exposition. Last season, Kate Weiler and her British counterparts had been investigating the terrorist attack of a British aircraft carrier.
Fresh Air
Kerri Russell On 'The Diplomat'/ Remembering Dorothy Allison
So the show's creators called your character itchy. What does that mean to you?
Fresh Air
Kerri Russell On 'The Diplomat'/ Remembering Dorothy Allison
We're listening to Terry's 1992 interview with Dorothy Allison, the author of the best-selling novel Bastard Out of Carolina. More after a break. This is Fresh Air. Thank you. Remember, if you or someone you know may be considering suicide or is in crisis, you can reach out to the Suicide and Crisis Lifeline by calling or texting 988.
Fresh Air
Kerri Russell On 'The Diplomat'/ Remembering Dorothy Allison
Yeah, she's much more comfortable behind the scenes, right?
Fresh Air
Kerri Russell On 'The Diplomat'/ Remembering Dorothy Allison
Thank you. Dorothy Allison recorded in 1992. She died last week at the age of 75. On Monday's show, actor and stand-up comic Jimmy O. Yang. He co-starred in the HBO show Silicon Valley and the film Crazy Rich Asians. Now he's the star of the new television show Interior Chinatown, based on the National Book Award-winning novel of the same name. I hope you can join us.
Fresh Air
Kerri Russell On 'The Diplomat'/ Remembering Dorothy Allison
For Terry Gross and Tanya Mosley, I'm Sam Brigger.
Fresh Air
Kerri Russell On 'The Diplomat'/ Remembering Dorothy Allison
So, as you said earlier, the job of the American ambassador to the UK has a lot of ceremonial aspects to it. And you said that the job is often a reward to like a big political donor or bundler and Kate's supposed to attend all these parties and teas. She's supposed to wear dresses and do photo shoots. And she really bristles against that. Like she just wants to do the diplomacy.
Fresh Air
Kerri Russell On 'The Diplomat'/ Remembering Dorothy Allison
And I was just wondering if that's something that you relate to as an actor. Like do you enjoy movie openings and galas or would you just prefer to do the work?
Fresh Air
Kerri Russell On 'The Diplomat'/ Remembering Dorothy Allison
She had been told that a Russian mercenary named Lenkov was behind the attack, but that it was secretly planned by someone within the British government, and she suspects the prime minister. Last season ended with a cliffhanger. A car bomb went off, severely injuring Kate's husband, her deputy steward, and another staff member named Ronnie.
Fresh Air
Kerri Russell On 'The Diplomat'/ Remembering Dorothy Allison
Right. Well, let's just take a short break here. Let's talk about your last TV show, The Americans. The show ran for six seasons on FX. It ended in 2018. It was critically acclaimed. The show won two Peabody's and you were highly praised for your performance and you were nominated for three Emmys. So for people who don't know the show, I guess there are some people out there.
Fresh Air
Kerri Russell On 'The Diplomat'/ Remembering Dorothy Allison
The show takes place in the 80s during the Reagan administration and you play Elizabeth Jennings, a Soviet spy posing as an American. You're in a KGB arranged marriage to another spy played by Matthew Rhys. And when the show starts, you've been living in the United States for 15 years. You have two American-born kids, which was initially just like part of your disguise.
Fresh Air
Kerri Russell On 'The Diplomat'/ Remembering Dorothy Allison
And you've thought of your relationship to your husband as more of a work relationship rather than a romantic one. Although at this point, you're starting to have real feelings for him. So could you just tell us how this role came to you?
Fresh Air
Kerri Russell On 'The Diplomat'/ Remembering Dorothy Allison
Well, I'd like to play a scene from the show. This is from season three. So your daughter Paige is a teenager at this point. Well, I guess she was a teenager all along, but she's getting a little older. And your handlers, the KGB, want to recruit her for the cause. And Philip is strongly against this. He wants Paige to have a normal American life.
Fresh Air
Kerri Russell On 'The Diplomat'/ Remembering Dorothy Allison
Your character, Elizabeth, is more resigned to the idea. And this is a real rift in the marriage at this point. But Paige has been suspicious of your behavior for a while. And in this scene, she confronts you both. And you decide to tell her the truth. And Paige here is played by Holly Taylor.
Fresh Air
Kerri Russell On 'The Diplomat'/ Remembering Dorothy Allison
In this scene, Kate meets the embassy's lead CIA agent, Idra Park, at the hospital and fills her in on the investigation. Park is played by Ali Ahn.
Fresh Air
Kerri Russell On 'The Diplomat'/ Remembering Dorothy Allison
So that's a scene from The Americans. That's a real turning point in the show. And it's ironic. You finally telling your daughter the truth about their lives just lays bare all the dishonesty that they've been living with and that their family is based on a foundation of lies.
Fresh Air
Kerri Russell On 'The Diplomat'/ Remembering Dorothy Allison
It's interesting because parents, whether they're Soviet spies or not, they conceal things from your kids all the time for all sorts of reasons, like to maintain their innocence, to simplify things, and just to keep the parents' lives private. And that even continues as the kids age. One of the things I found really fascinating with your relationship with Paige is that even –
Fresh Air
Kerri Russell On 'The Diplomat'/ Remembering Dorothy Allison
When Elizabeth reveals that she's a spy, like she still can't tell Paige about all the stuff she does, like all the honey traps and the murders. Because she doesn't want Paige to think she's a monster. Yeah.
Fresh Air
Kerri Russell On 'The Diplomat'/ Remembering Dorothy Allison
Watching the show last week, I was just thinking about how much fun it must have been for an actor because there's so much acting in it. First, you're acting as a Russian spy who's pretending to be an all-American mom. And then you have all these side missions where you're disguised as other characters. You're seducing people. You're killing people.
Fresh Air
Kerri Russell On 'The Diplomat'/ Remembering Dorothy Allison
It just must have been really fun to go in and have all this stuff to work with.
Fresh Air
Kerri Russell On 'The Diplomat'/ Remembering Dorothy Allison
Yeah, you wear a lot of wigs. You probably wear like 100 wigs during the show.
Fresh Air
Kerri Russell On 'The Diplomat'/ Remembering Dorothy Allison
That's like exactly how it shows.
Fresh Air
Kerri Russell On 'The Diplomat'/ Remembering Dorothy Allison
midnight and Matthew would come in to the trailer with some crazy mustache and we would just laugh our heads off it was it was so fun so Carrie I wanted to talk to you a little bit about your childhood and how you got your start in acting when you were cast on the all-new Mickey Mouse Club and this was in the early 90s I think you were on the show for three years is that right
Fresh Air
Kerri Russell On 'The Diplomat'/ Remembering Dorothy Allison
It was a long time ago, but yes. Yeah, it started when you were like 15. And the show's famous as the launching pad for a lot of talented young actors and musicians, including yourself, Ryan Gosling, Justin Timberlake, Christina Aguilera, and Britney Spears. So there was a big casting call in Colorado. And so you decided to try out.
Fresh Air
Best Of: Folk Musician Jerron Paxton / Lyricist Ira Gershwin's Legacy
From WHYY in Philadelphia, I'm Sam Brigger with Fresh Air Weekend. Today, folk musician Jerron Paxton brings some instruments to play for our conversation. He plays guitar, banjo, and harmonica. Paxton is known for performing music from the 1920s, but he just came out with an album of his own songs called Things Done Changed.
Fresh Air
Best Of: Folk Musician Jerron Paxton / Lyricist Ira Gershwin's Legacy
What's your eyesight like now?
Fresh Air
Best Of: Folk Musician Jerron Paxton / Lyricist Ira Gershwin's Legacy
Well, I think because of your eyesight, you had to reconsider what you wanted to do for work. Is that correct?
Fresh Air
Best Of: Folk Musician Jerron Paxton / Lyricist Ira Gershwin's Legacy
Since you were so interested in trains or you were interested in being a train driver as a kid, do you particularly like train songs?
Fresh Air
Best Of: Folk Musician Jerron Paxton / Lyricist Ira Gershwin's Legacy
Would you mind playing one that you like particularly?
Fresh Air
Best Of: Folk Musician Jerron Paxton / Lyricist Ira Gershwin's Legacy
Guitar, fiddle, piano, harmonica, banjo, and the bones is not even a complete list. Paxton, who is 35, grew up in Los Angeles near Watts and has called himself a throwback in a family of throwbacks. He now lives in New York. Let's hear the title track from the new album. This is Things Done Changed.
Fresh Air
Best Of: Folk Musician Jerron Paxton / Lyricist Ira Gershwin's Legacy
Before you play the harmonica, I just want to say that, like all the instruments you play, you seem to be able to make it sound like you're playing two different parts on the harmonica. I don't know if you do that in the song, but I just wanted listeners to keep an ear out for that.
Fresh Air
Best Of: Folk Musician Jerron Paxton / Lyricist Ira Gershwin's Legacy
I am playing two different parts.
Fresh Air
Best Of: Folk Musician Jerron Paxton / Lyricist Ira Gershwin's Legacy
John, that was great. Thank you. That was our guest, John Paxton, playing the harmonica. Was that hard to figure out how to do?
Fresh Air
Best Of: Folk Musician Jerron Paxton / Lyricist Ira Gershwin's Legacy
Okay. Well, that couldn't be more cryptic if I'd asked it to be. Yeah, I watched a video of you playing and singing a song, Hesitation Blues.
Fresh Air
Best Of: Folk Musician Jerron Paxton / Lyricist Ira Gershwin's Legacy
No, no, no. But at one point you were singing and then you played the harmonica with your nostril at one point.
Fresh Air
Best Of: Folk Musician Jerron Paxton / Lyricist Ira Gershwin's Legacy
Well, thank you for doing that. Cheers. Jerron Paxton, I just want to thank you so much for coming in today to bring your instruments and playing some music for us. Thank you very much.
Fresh Air
Best Of: Folk Musician Jerron Paxton / Lyricist Ira Gershwin's Legacy
Jerron Paxton's new album is called Things Done Changed. Disney+, which already gave us the three-part Beatles documentary Get Back and the restored version of their Let It Be film, has another new Beatles documentary to present called Beatles 64. It covers a very short but significant period in the group's history. Our TV critic David Bianculli has this review.
Fresh Air
Best Of: Folk Musician Jerron Paxton / Lyricist Ira Gershwin's Legacy
Good evening, ladies and gentlemen.
Fresh Air
Best Of: Folk Musician Jerron Paxton / Lyricist Ira Gershwin's Legacy
David Bianculli is professor of television studies at Rowan University. He's at work on a book about the visual artistry of the Beatles. He reviewed Beatles 64, now streaming on Disney+. Coming up, Terry talks with author Michael Owen about Ira Gershwin, the lyricist behind some of the most enduring songs in the great American popular songbook. We'll hear plenty of great Gershwin music.
Fresh Air
Best Of: Folk Musician Jerron Paxton / Lyricist Ira Gershwin's Legacy
I'm Sam Brigger, and this is Fresh Air Weekend. Our next guest, author Michael Owen, talks with Terry about the life and enduring lyrics of Ira Gershwin. His new book is called Ira Gershwin, A Life in Words. Here's Terry.
Fresh Air
Best Of: Folk Musician Jerron Paxton / Lyricist Ira Gershwin's Legacy
That's the song Things Done Changed from the new album by Jerron Paxson of the same name. Jerron Paxson, welcome so much to Fresh Air.
Fresh Air
Best Of: Folk Musician Jerron Paxton / Lyricist Ira Gershwin's Legacy
So, as I said, you've released a few albums before, but this is your first album of your own compositions. Have you been writing all along but just recently decided to release these songs?
Fresh Air
Best Of: Folk Musician Jerron Paxton / Lyricist Ira Gershwin's Legacy
Michael Owen's new book is Ira Gershwin, A Life in Words. Fresh Air Weekend is produced today by Thea Chaloner. Fresh Air's executive producer is Danny Miller. Our technical director and engineer is Audrey Bentham. Our interviews and reviews are produced and edited by Phyllis Myers, Anne-Marie Baldonado, Lauren Krenzel, Teresa Madden, Monique Nazareth, Susan Ikundi, and Anna Bauman.
Fresh Air
Best Of: Folk Musician Jerron Paxton / Lyricist Ira Gershwin's Legacy
Our digital media producers are Molly C.V. Nesper and Sabrina Seward. For Terry Gross and Tanya Mosley, I'm Sam Bricker.
Fresh Air
Best Of: Folk Musician Jerron Paxton / Lyricist Ira Gershwin's Legacy
Can you talk about how you approach the guitar? Is there a particular guitar player that was very influential to how you play?
Fresh Air
Best Of: Folk Musician Jerron Paxton / Lyricist Ira Gershwin's Legacy
Also, Terry talks with author Michael Owen about Ira Gershwin, the lyricist behind many of the most enduring songs in the Great American Popular Songbook. Songs like Fascinating Rhythm, I Got Rhythm, Swonderful, Embraceable You, Let's Call the Whole Thing Off, and They Can't Take That Away from Me. He has a new book about Gershwin.
Fresh Air
Best Of: Folk Musician Jerron Paxton / Lyricist Ira Gershwin's Legacy
I was wondering if you could show us perhaps with an instrumental like how you approach the blues. And the blues can be played lots of different ways. Like one of the ways that it's often played is like a simple three-chord song. But there's a lot going on in the way you play the blues. So could you demonstrate that? I know you brought a guitar with you.
Fresh Air
Best Of: Folk Musician Jerron Paxton / Lyricist Ira Gershwin's Legacy
And I heard when you were getting ready that this is quite an old guitar, huh?
Fresh Air
Best Of: Folk Musician Jerron Paxton / Lyricist Ira Gershwin's Legacy
And when you say $4.95, I think you mean $4.95. $4.95, half a week's wages. So how old is this guitar then?
Fresh Air
Best Of: Folk Musician Jerron Paxton / Lyricist Ira Gershwin's Legacy
So not yet a century yet. So you said that when you're playing a guitar solo, you want it to sound like a bunch of instruments kind of playing together. Could you show us what that's like on the guitar?
Fresh Air
Best Of: Folk Musician Jerron Paxton / Lyricist Ira Gershwin's Legacy
And TV critic David Bianculli reviews a new Beatles documentary on Disney+. That's coming up on Fresh Air Weekend. This is Fresh Air Weekend. I'm Sam Brigger. Prior to his new album, Jerron Paxton has been entertaining audiences with his take on music that's mostly 100 years old or older. Some of the music dates back to the Civil War.
Fresh Air
Best Of: Folk Musician Jerron Paxton / Lyricist Ira Gershwin's Legacy
That's Jerron Paxton with his guitar joining us today. He's a new album of all original compositions called Things Done Changed. Jerron, you grew up in South Los Angeles near Watts. What was your home like?
Fresh Air
Best Of: Folk Musician Jerron Paxton / Lyricist Ira Gershwin's Legacy
Well, you've said that you're a throwback from a family of throwbacks. What does that mean?
Fresh Air
Best Of: Folk Musician Jerron Paxton / Lyricist Ira Gershwin's Legacy
You're going back pretty far.
Fresh Air
Best Of: Folk Musician Jerron Paxton / Lyricist Ira Gershwin's Legacy
It sounds like you were particularly drawn to the country blues. What do you think it was that spoke to you?
Fresh Air
Best Of: Folk Musician Jerron Paxton / Lyricist Ira Gershwin's Legacy
He plays folk music, blues, hot jazz, ragtime, and fiddle and banjo tunes, among others. He's released several albums, but this new album, Things Done Changed, is his first where all the tracks were written by him.
Fresh Air
Best Of: Folk Musician Jerron Paxton / Lyricist Ira Gershwin's Legacy
When did you start playing banjo?
Fresh Air
Best Of: Folk Musician Jerron Paxton / Lyricist Ira Gershwin's Legacy
And you said your grandfather played the banjo?
Fresh Air
Best Of: Folk Musician Jerron Paxton / Lyricist Ira Gershwin's Legacy
Well, you brought a banjo with you today. It's kind of a special banjo. Can you tell us about it?
Fresh Air
Best Of: Folk Musician Jerron Paxton / Lyricist Ira Gershwin's Legacy
On the song that you play on the album, It's All Over Now, in the liner notes, you say that you play this stroke style. Can you explain what that is or demonstrate that for us?
Fresh Air
Best Of: Folk Musician Jerron Paxton / Lyricist Ira Gershwin's Legacy
Songs that are deeply rooted to music of the 20s and 30s and older, but reflects Paxton's contemporary feelings and observations about things like love, lost and found, gentrification, and finding yourself far from home. Paxton was generous enough to bring some of the instruments he plays to the studio today. If he had brought all the instruments he plays, he would have had to rent a van.
Fresh Air
Best Of: Folk Musician Jerron Paxton / Lyricist Ira Gershwin's Legacy
Ah, that's called Brand New Shoes. Jaron, that was great. Our guest today is Jaron Paxton. His new album is called Things Done Changed. We'll hear more of the interview after a short break. I'm Sam Brigger, and this is Fresh Air Weekend. When you were a teenager, you started having trouble with your eyesight. What was happening?