Shumita Basu

It's an assessment that depending on who you stop on the street in any town USA, someone might completely agree with and share the alarm of these academics. Or someone might disagree entirely, even say that President Trump is saving our country. I decided to call up NYU professor Ruth Ben-Ghiat.

It's an assessment that depending on who you stop on the street in any town USA, someone might completely agree with and share the alarm of these academics. Or someone might disagree entirely, even say that President Trump is saving our country. I decided to call up NYU professor Ruth Ben-Ghiat.

She's a historian and expert on authoritarianism and the author of the New York Times bestseller, Strongmen, Mussolini to the Present, which tells the history of authoritarianism over the last 100 years. And I asked her to start, what would she say to these two groups of people, the people who deeply believe that we're already in the throes of an autocracy and the people who say the opposite?

She's a historian and expert on authoritarianism and the author of the New York Times bestseller, Strongmen, Mussolini to the Present, which tells the history of authoritarianism over the last 100 years. And I asked her to start, what would she say to these two groups of people, the people who deeply believe that we're already in the throes of an autocracy and the people who say the opposite?

She's a historian and expert on authoritarianism and the author of the New York Times bestseller, Strongmen, Mussolini to the Present, which tells the history of authoritarianism over the last 100 years. And I asked her to start, what would she say to these two groups of people, the people who deeply believe that we're already in the throes of an autocracy and the people who say the opposite?

So let me ask you, as we approach the 100-day mark of Trump's second term here, what specific actions are you observing that concern you?

So let me ask you, as we approach the 100-day mark of Trump's second term here, what specific actions are you observing that concern you?

So let me ask you, as we approach the 100-day mark of Trump's second term here, what specific actions are you observing that concern you?

Mm-hmm. A lot of people are quick to pin this to Trump and characterize this as a Trump v. Democrats or even Trump v. Democracy issue. But to what extent is the deterioration of democratic norms in the U.S. something that can be tied directly to Trump? And to what extent is it connected to other longer standing trends that we've seen in our politics?

Mm-hmm. A lot of people are quick to pin this to Trump and characterize this as a Trump v. Democrats or even Trump v. Democracy issue. But to what extent is the deterioration of democratic norms in the U.S. something that can be tied directly to Trump? And to what extent is it connected to other longer standing trends that we've seen in our politics?

Mm-hmm. A lot of people are quick to pin this to Trump and characterize this as a Trump v. Democrats or even Trump v. Democracy issue. But to what extent is the deterioration of democratic norms in the U.S. something that can be tied directly to Trump? And to what extent is it connected to other longer standing trends that we've seen in our politics?

So from your experience writing about how these moments in history have played out in other countries, can this kind of backsliding be stopped? And if so, who would need to play a role in that?

So from your experience writing about how these moments in history have played out in other countries, can this kind of backsliding be stopped? And if so, who would need to play a role in that?

So from your experience writing about how these moments in history have played out in other countries, can this kind of backsliding be stopped? And if so, who would need to play a role in that?

But, you know, Ruth, what I keep thinking about is you're right to point out that the United States is unusual in many ways when comparing to other countries. It's hard to do. But we're also unusual in that President Trump served a first term, was not voted back into office. And was reelected then to come back and serve a second term, disjointed from the first. So I don't know.

But, you know, Ruth, what I keep thinking about is you're right to point out that the United States is unusual in many ways when comparing to other countries. It's hard to do. But we're also unusual in that President Trump served a first term, was not voted back into office. And was reelected then to come back and serve a second term, disjointed from the first. So I don't know.

But, you know, Ruth, what I keep thinking about is you're right to point out that the United States is unusual in many ways when comparing to other countries. It's hard to do. But we're also unusual in that President Trump served a first term, was not voted back into office. And was reelected then to come back and serve a second term, disjointed from the first. So I don't know.

I take value in looking back at history, obviously, and trying to see the parallels and learn the lessons. But at the same time, there's clearly something completely different happening here, too. There's an unprecedented element.

I take value in looking back at history, obviously, and trying to see the parallels and learn the lessons. But at the same time, there's clearly something completely different happening here, too. There's an unprecedented element.

I take value in looking back at history, obviously, and trying to see the parallels and learn the lessons. But at the same time, there's clearly something completely different happening here, too. There's an unprecedented element.