Stephen Dubner

So I'm glad you used the specific.

I'll have a conversation with anybody, anytime about anything.

It's what I like to do.

Especially in the last 10, 15 years, or maybe 20, I've met types of people that I never thought I would have met.

Just because of the nature of what I've ended up doing professionally.

And then I became a golfer.

Oh.

And that introduced me into a world that I had these preconceptions about and I was so wrong.

But when someone comes at me with a binary, you're for us or against us.

What I try to do, what I probably do do mostly is I say, first of all, let's define terms.

And that's a trick I think I learned from academia.

Let's take it away from the fascism.

If you're going to call someone in economic terms a communist or a socialist, let's define terms.

Are we talking about the socialism of 2025 Denmark?

Yeah.

Right.

Not the socialism of 1925 Vienna.

It's a big difference now.

What do you mean by that?

So this goes back to, I wonder if you've ever come across this in talking with Angela or anyone else in that realm.