Steve Inskeep

Mr. President, thanks so much for your time.

Alan Garber, the president of Harvard University, who came by the studios of one of our Boston member stations, WBUR. The president has since moved on to the rituals of graduation, which will proceed as they have for centuries in a political environment like no other. This has been a special episode of Up First from NPR News. It's produced by Ana Perez and edited by Rina Advani.

Alan Garber, the president of Harvard University, who came by the studios of one of our Boston member stations, WBUR. The president has since moved on to the rituals of graduation, which will proceed as they have for centuries in a political environment like no other. This has been a special episode of Up First from NPR News. It's produced by Ana Perez and edited by Rina Advani.

Alan Garber, the president of Harvard University, who came by the studios of one of our Boston member stations, WBUR. The president has since moved on to the rituals of graduation, which will proceed as they have for centuries in a political environment like no other. This has been a special episode of Up First from NPR News. It's produced by Ana Perez and edited by Rina Advani.

Our executive producer is Jay Shaler. I'm Steve Inskeep.

Our executive producer is Jay Shaler. I'm Steve Inskeep.

Our executive producer is Jay Shaler. I'm Steve Inskeep.

Well, both the Harvard lawsuit and Alan Garber contend the administration is going after something bigger than just international students. Garber says he doesn't fully know the motives, but he does know some conservatives want to reshape elite higher education over issues like diversity, equity, and inclusion.

Well, both the Harvard lawsuit and Alan Garber contend the administration is going after something bigger than just international students. Garber says he doesn't fully know the motives, but he does know some conservatives want to reshape elite higher education over issues like diversity, equity, and inclusion.

Well, both the Harvard lawsuit and Alan Garber contend the administration is going after something bigger than just international students. Garber says he doesn't fully know the motives, but he does know some conservatives want to reshape elite higher education over issues like diversity, equity, and inclusion.

In this case, Michelle, the Department of Homeland Security says it banned international students from Harvard because the school blatantly refused to demand to give information about them. Garber insists Harvard gave information and DHS lashed out anyway. And Harvard describes that as well as the cutoff in funding as an effort to gain power over a private school.

In this case, Michelle, the Department of Homeland Security says it banned international students from Harvard because the school blatantly refused to demand to give information about them. Garber insists Harvard gave information and DHS lashed out anyway. And Harvard describes that as well as the cutoff in funding as an effort to gain power over a private school.

In this case, Michelle, the Department of Homeland Security says it banned international students from Harvard because the school blatantly refused to demand to give information about them. Garber insists Harvard gave information and DHS lashed out anyway. And Harvard describes that as well as the cutoff in funding as an effort to gain power over a private school.

He accepts a lot of that criticism. The president himself is Jewish. He says some students felt shunned on campus if they didn't take what was seen as a proper view of Israel. He's trying to correct that.

He accepts a lot of that criticism. The president himself is Jewish. He says some students felt shunned on campus if they didn't take what was seen as a proper view of Israel. He's trying to correct that.

He accepts a lot of that criticism. The president himself is Jewish. He says some students felt shunned on campus if they didn't take what was seen as a proper view of Israel. He's trying to correct that.

He accepts some of it, said he wants to encourage, for example, freer debate on campus, and then he turned that idea to make a point of his own.

He accepts some of it, said he wants to encourage, for example, freer debate on campus, and then he turned that idea to make a point of his own.

He accepts some of it, said he wants to encourage, for example, freer debate on campus, and then he turned that idea to make a point of his own.

Harvard says eliminating foreign students would erase a quarter of the student body. Now, the court order means nothing happens for now, as you mentioned, but the university faces a very uncertain court battle. Steve, thanks. Glad to do it.