Steven Belmain

So getting rid of rats

It may make an impact for some diseases that are very specific to them, but diseases are very adaptable and these viruses and bacteria and helminths that they transmit can easily move between different species.

We don't really know.

I think that's one of the alarming things as a scientist and understanding a lot about rodents and diseases.

Things like deforestation and climate change may be making things worse in some of the endemic parts of the world.

I think if we were to look at livestock farms, farmers would be very pleased.

The amount of food that is being eaten by rats in the UK is extraordinary.

And farmers wouldn't have to put out any poison to try to kill those rats.

The damage to their livestock itself in terms of disease transmission, but also just being bitten by rats.

This idea of keeping all rats out, is it cost beneficial?

I'm not quite sure.

When you're trying to create an island without rats, would it be worthwhile doing when you might just be causing more problems in its absence?

One thing to bear in mind, Rattus evolved in Asia.

So, if you went to Southeast Asia or parts of China and you said all ratists were gone, I hate to think about what would be happening because this would be almost all the rodents across the ecosystem.

We're not just talking about the absence of predators, but the impact on soil and seed dispersion and many of these ecological functions which are fundamental to making the world run.

Elsewhere in the world, they have invaded quite successfully, and removing them would open up some habitat to other rodents that are there already naturally, which may become more of a problem by doing that too.

So getting rid of rats in London, suddenly we'd have many more problems with mice.

Probably most tests nowadays, if we were to use a rodent of some kind, it would be with mice instead of rats.

We've moved away from using rats in laboratories.

Fortunately, a lot of this can now be done in cell culture, and we should see this as a good move away that we're not having to test everything on animals.