Susan Glasser

I take your point that geopolitics requires a certain amount of business engagement with unsavory parts of the world, but it doesn't require you embracing the bone saw murderer.

We can stipulate to that.

It doesn't require you embracing Donald Trump in such public ways.

There are ways to keep integrity that do not involve this.

And when you see, I don't know, the

CEO of Apple, whose products you use every day.

You and I and all the people are funding this, right?

He doesn't have this power, this cloud, this agency in the world that prizes high agency individuals like him.

That's, my son informs me, a Silicon Valley term.

You know, they're what are they doing?

They're giving Donald Trump millions of dollars to knock down the East Wing of the White House with no process, no sense of history and gildify his environment.

The People's House knocked down our history.

You know, I'm not sure that business requires that.

It seems to me that that's a form of rot and corruption policy.

that anyone can be against.

Because I just don't think it's wrong to do the right thing.

I think there are many people who have shown you can succeed in business, even in the Trump environment, without engaging in these things.

It means that these companies...

pay zero price for our entire, you know, kind of public space, right?

They think that the rest of us should fund the democracy part of the democracy, and they should reap its benefits and be willing to do things that are antithetical to the public commons.