Tony Birch

And I think if you've had nothing, sometimes if you can afford to be indulgent, you are.

And you should be able to do things of value, even material value, without guilt.

So one of the issues that was brought home to me is I'm a writer who's published 10 books now.

I'd never bought a new book in a bookshop until I was well into adulthood, maybe at university.

All the books I'd had before that I'd bought in op shops or swap shops.

And for many years, when I went into a bookshop and bought a new book, I would feel enormously guilty about the extravagance of that.

And it took me a long time to get over the fact to say, no, actually, I work hard.

I have an income.

I do other good things with my money.

I'm not wasteful.

And buying books is something I should be able to enjoy.

But it took me a long time to accept that I could enjoy buying a new book.

Oh, thank you, Richard.

It's been lovely to talk to you again.

This story's right, this story's true

I would not tell lies to you Like the promises they did not keep And how they fenced us in like sheep Said to us, come take our hand Set us up on mission