Tony James

in much more detail and you appreciate its nuances much more.

So that connectivity to nature has been an antidote to the rest of my existence, which has always been so, so driven and analytical.

I don't know if you ski or anything, but if you're going down through bumps, whatever concerns are in your head, you're not thinking about that.

You're just thinking turn, turn, turn.

And fly fishing is the same way.

You can't worry about anything else while you're out there doing that.

But it's not stressful intellectually, but it unplugs you from intellectual stresses.

So I think those elements have always really appealed to me.

Well, first of all, there's a lot of luck in that.

And I never really planned, but I reacted.

But I would say some of the attributes you're looking for, or some of the attributes that I looked for, maybe is a better way to put it.

First of all, I wanted an unstructured opportunity where someone didn't tell me how to do something, then expect me to do it, where I could figure out what and how to do.

and do it my way.

And so that was non-hierarchical, non-structured organizations.

I wanted something where I could change the paradigm because that's how I felt, frankly, intellectually engaged, but it's also where the upside comes from.

I think an opportunity that really provides a lot of

economic, firm, personal and professional growth.

Growth is very important.

What not to do is worry about, I'm going to move over to the next firm because they're going to pay me another $100,000 next year.

I wouldn't do that at all.