Tristan Harris

And for anybody who says it's not possible, have you spent a week dedicated in your life fully trying?

If you say it's impossible, if you're a leader of the lab and say, well, never going to be possible to coordinate, well, have you tried?

Have you tried with everything?

If this was really existential stakes, have you really put everything on the line?

We're talking about some of the most powerful, wealthy, most connected people in the entire world.

If the stakes were actually existential, have we done everything in our power yet to make something else happen?

If we have not done everything in our power yet, then there's still optionality for us to take those actions and make something else happen.

And the fact that... Your podcast...

Having Jeff Hinton and Roman on talking about these things, having the friend.com, which is like that pendant, the AI companion on your pendant.

You see these billboards in New York City that people have graffiti on them and saying, we don't want this future.

You have graffiti on them saying AI is not inevitable.

We're already seeing a counter movement just to your point that you're making.

Well, I'll invoke Jaron Lanier when he said in the film The Social Dilemma, the critics are the true optimists because the critics are the ones being willing to say, this is stupid.

We can do better than this.

That's the whole point is not to be a doomer.

Doomer would be if we just believe it's inevitable and there's nothing we can do.

The whole point of seeing the bad outcome clearly is...

is to collectively put on our hand the steering wheel and choose something else.

A doomer would not confront it.

You would just say, then there's nothing we can do.