Trita Parsi

Yeah, exactly.

And I think on the Israeli side, there's just been a transition to a completely different type of a security thinking.

This happened long time ago, but it's just become more blatant.

I remember it was actually David Ivry, the legendary Air Force general in Israel, who was actually the lead pilot that struck the Osirak reactors in Iraq in 1981, who explained this to me.

He said, look, on the Israeli side,

All of the countries, they define a threat as being a combination of intent and capability.

On the Israeli side, we assume that intent to destroy us is always there.

So we only focus on capability, which means that regardless of whether a country is disposed negatively towards Israel or not,

Israel's only way of surviving in the region is to always outgun everyone in the region and every other combination of countries in the region, keeping them weak, keeping them at a much lower level.

That's deranged.

It's military hegemony on crack.

That's crazy.

So look, there's been an experience that they've had that I think has contributed to it.

I agree with you that I don't think it's healthy.

I don't think it's good.

And also historically, I don't think we can see any examples of any country, particularly a small country, being able to pursue that doctrine successfully for a very long time.

It's not a good survival strategy.

Now they think it is the only way to survive.

But what this has done, and this goes back to your earlier question.

I remember speaking to another Israeli,