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Walter "Wally" Thurman

๐Ÿ‘ค Speaker
115 total appearances

Appearances Over Time

Podcast Appearances

Freakonomics Radio
670. Beeconomics 101

And that leads to this unambiguous theoretical conclusion that we should subsidize the production of apples and the keeping of bees.

Freakonomics Radio
670. Beeconomics 101

Well, going back even earlier than Mead, famous British economist A.C.

Freakonomics Radio
670. Beeconomics 101

Pagu said you tax those activities that generate negative externalities.

Freakonomics Radio
670. Beeconomics 101

If you have too much smoke coming out of a factory, the factory owner is senseless to the harm that the factory is doing, so you tax them per unit of output or per unit of smoke.

Freakonomics Radio
670. Beeconomics 101

That would be a pretty standard economic prescription for the problem.

Freakonomics Radio
670. Beeconomics 101

The story about reciprocal positive externalities really rests on these two parties not being able to influence each other, not being able to transact with each other, and maybe not even being aware of each other.

Freakonomics Radio
670. Beeconomics 101

What Chung found was that if you go to rural Washington state towns and open the yellow pages of the phone book,

Freakonomics Radio
670. Beeconomics 101

you would find advertisements for pollination services from beekeepers.

Freakonomics Radio
670. Beeconomics 101

So not only did apple growers and other farmers know about beekeepers in the area, they could call them up and pay them a certain amount per colony to come over and pollinate their crops.

Freakonomics Radio
670. Beeconomics 101

So I would say this was Chung's aha moment was there were transactions going on.

Freakonomics Radio
670. Beeconomics 101

So at least to him, there was a prima facie case that some of this positive externality was being internalized.

Freakonomics Radio
670. Beeconomics 101

Well, that's a great question.

Freakonomics Radio
670. Beeconomics 101

And if you fast forward to the modern beekeeping industry and modern commercial practices, bees are moved around.

Freakonomics Radio
670. Beeconomics 101

They're migratory.

Freakonomics Radio
670. Beeconomics 101

That is not by means of their flight, but beekeepers move them around in trucks.

Freakonomics Radio
670. Beeconomics 101

And there are times of the year โ€“

Freakonomics Radio
670. Beeconomics 101

when bees are placed on crops like almonds where the demand for pollination services is very high and the pollination fees run from farmers to bees.

Freakonomics Radio
670. Beeconomics 101

There are other times of the year in late summer where beekeepers will sometimes pay landowners for the privilege of putting their bees on the farmer's land because the land is such good honey forage.

Freakonomics Radio
670. Beeconomics 101

So it can and does go both ways.

Freakonomics Radio
670. Beeconomics 101

It's seasonal to start with.