Whitney Pennington-Rogers

I'm Whitney Pennington-Rogers, and I'm your host for this conversation.

These days, it's virtually impossible to watch the news and not see stories about migration.

It is and has always been the defining force of humanity.

Around the world, people are on the move for an array of reasons, from climate change to conflict to economic shifts and, of course, the enduring human pursuit of opportunity and safety.

And yet, the headlines often reduce migration to crisis and controversy, leaving out the bigger picture that movement is a natural, even necessary part of who we are.

As borders tighten and debates intensify, it's more important than ever to understand what's really driving migration today, how it's shaping our global future, and what it means for all of us.

To help us make sense of this moment, I'm thrilled to be joined today by two big thinkers in the space of human migration.

Journalist Sonia Shah, who is a past TED speaker and an author whose most recently released book, The Next Great Migration, unravels our historical understanding of migration and its impact on the present moment.

and Zeke Hernandez, who is a professor at the University of Pennsylvania's Wharton School and the author of The Truth About Immigration, which examines immigration's impact on the economy and beyond.

Hello to you both.

Hi, thanks for having us.

Thank you both so much for being here.

Well, we have so much to get into, so I'm just going to dive right in.

And I think one of the bigger questions around this issue when we think about migration is looking around to understand whether or not this moment feels different and actually whether it is different from others we've seen in history.

So that will actually be my first question.

I'd love to maybe start with you, Sonia.

In the work that you've done, you've sort of looked at the history of how we've migrated.

How does this moment compare to others in history?

So you're suggesting then Sonia that we're not actually seeing people migrate more than in the past.

It just feels like it based on the way the media is covering it.