ZOE Host

And Andy, this is because UPF is very complicated, isn't it?

It could be like there's all these different preservatives and all these emulsifiers and all these sweeteners.

And then there's the stuff that they don't even have to put on the label to do with just how they might take a raw material that seems normal, like, I don't know, a grain, and they can sort of smash it up and reorganize it.

And they can still call it a grain, but actually it doesn't look anything like the chemical did before.

So that's a lot to try and figure out, isn't it?

So it's going to be keeping scientists busy for a long time.

I think so, yeah.

Brilliant.

Well, look, I would like to transition now to sort of actionable advice.

I think anyone listening to this is probably saying, you know what?

I definitely wouldn't want to increase the amount of ultra-processed food I'm eating, and I'm interested in reducing it for myself and probably for my family.

But we also started by saying, well, like half the food that you're cooking at home probably has ultra-processed food in it.

So is it inevitable or is there things that people could do to reduce their consumption that don't require some completely radical change to how they live?

And when you say prepared, would taking a packet out of the fridge and putting it in the microwave and turning it on for three minutes as the meal, right?

Does that count as, is that the making it at home?

Yeah.

Got it.

Because I think one of the things that we've seen is that those sorts of ready-prepared meals could often be incredibly high in ultra-processed food, like much more than you would expect.

And I think part of this is because they're trying to sort of preserve it all and make it last much longer than it would do if you made your spaghetti and meatballs or whatever it is at home.

The fact that it looks like a sort of home-cooked meal...