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Chapter 1: What challenges do freelance artists face in the current economy?
Thank you. You're listening to the Art Problems Podcast, Episode 108. I'm your host, Patti Johnson. This is the podcast where we talk about how to get more shows, grants, and residencies. And I want to introduce today's podcast by talking a little bit about the YMCA. Now, this is a nonprofit organization that is probably best known for its gyms and pools. I use them, I'm sure,
You've used them too. A couple of years ago, I learned that they have an emergency assistance fund that their employees pay into and can access in the case of accidents, illness, the death of a loved one, et cetera. And they also offer health benefits and have a retirement fund employees can access when they retire on top of their 401k.
Chapter 2: How does Yancey Strickler define the A-Corp?
And the reason I mentioned this is that I really love that they take care of the people who work for them in this way. And I've always wanted to see something similar made available to arts workers. But the YMCA model only works if you have an employer. If you're a freelance artist, there's no employer to set any of this up for you.
So in the art world, you're on your own, but for a few emergency grants. There's no HR department. We have no healthcare for self-employed artists or emergency funds, or any easy way to collect and distribute money to large groups of arts workers. Today, I talk with someone who thinks that this, and really much, much more, can change.
Chapter 3: What benefits does the A-Corp provide to artists and collaborators?
Yancey Strickler, who's probably best known as the co-founder of Kickstarter and now MetaLabel, has a new project. It's called the A Corp, a new business designation for artists that's designed to give artists legal protection, the ability to share ownership with collaborators, and eventually access to group benefits like health insurance.
It's currently a bill before the Colorado Senate, and if it passes, it could be a model for the rest of the country. This is genuinely exciting stuff. So let's dive into it. Yancey, welcome to the show.
Hey, Patty, thanks for having me on.
Well, thanks so much for being here. I think the first thing I want to do is just have you give our listeners a little bit of background on some of the things you've done, because I know that they are aware of a lot of the projects that you've done, but they might not know that you are behind them.
My name is Yancy Strickler.
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Chapter 4: How is the A-Corp bill progressing in Colorado?
I grew up on a farm in Southwest Virginia. My father was a country singer. My mom is a secretary. And I was initially a writer, and I was one of the first writers for Pitchfork. I wrote for the Village Voice about music for many years. and started a tiny record label here in New York, putting out bands I saw at shows in Brooklyn.
And around that time, also co-founded Kickstarter with Perry Chen and Charles Adler, Kickstarter which launched in 2009. I eventually became CEO of Kickstarter, created the Creative Independent, which is a wonderful resource for wisdom and emotional truth, still running today.
We use that a lot over in Network.
TCI is the best.
Chapter 5: What research has been conducted on artists' economic situations?
Honestly, of everything I've done, TCI is genuinely, I think, the thing I feel most proud of. It's so pure and wonderful.
And for those of you who might not know, The Creative Independent is an online magazine and resource that provides emotional and practical guidance for creative people, something that I have contributed to in a lot of different writers over the years.
I've written three books. This Could Be Our Future, which is an economics philosophy book, On the Creative Life, which is a creative practices book that I did with Josh Citarella, and then a book called The Dark Forest Anthology of the Internet with a bunch of great people.
And in the past few years, I've been focused on a project called Meta Label, which is we're a studio of a small group of people who release projects that help creative people cooperate. That's always the focus. How do we make it easier to do things together?
And through that, we've released books and zines and podcasts, as well as software, different kinds of tools, in-person events, and now a law. And through all these projects, I'm just a writer, creative person in my heart that's just driven by curiosity and always trying to figure something out by doing it.
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Chapter 6: How does the A-Corp structure facilitate collaboration among artists?
And I've been fortunate to get to do that with some great people working on some interesting things. And right now I'm in the midst of a bunch of them.
Yeah, now one of the things that I think really interested me is that as you do a lot of these projects, it seems like you do a lot of research. And so one of the things that got me put MetaLabel on my radar was actually your survey that you released. I think you've done two now. And it's all about how artists are faring in this economy.
And tell people a little bit about that and how it's informing what you're doing.
Yeah, I think just first, my primary form of research really, I think, is. looking inward and reading old books. I feel like both of those things are so much of what allow me to see the present more clearly, or probably differently is the better word.
Chapter 7: What legal protections does the A-Corp offer to artists?
But there's a lot in that happens. But specifically what you're talking about, we have done three big surveys of artists the past couple of years at Meta Label. Two are this anonymous creative futures, it's called, where we have just reached out to year one, it was 75 artists. This past year it was 300 artists. with an anonymous questionnaire that's just, what are you scared of?
What are you feeling? Are you feeling more secure economically, less secure? And we just take the temperature. And in 2025, what we found was that someone had a line about how everything was dissolving into air, something like that.
Chapter 8: How can the A-Corp change the future of the art industry?
And so people could feel the free fall, but they were optimistic. And this past year's survey, the free fall is undeniable and there is not a lot of optimism. And instead, what I saw was the determination that we're going to do this anyway. Like, I realize it might be dumb. I realize the machines are fast.
I realize all these objections, all the reasons the world says exploring your feelings, making art, not acting as a capitalist value creator is wrong. Despite all those things, I'm still going to do it, because actually maybe that makes it even more meaningful. But those have been helpful, just like, what's the pulse of things?
We also did a survey we haven't yet published, we're about to, with Artist Corporations Foundation, where we had an online survey that 1,600 artists answered. It's very deep about the financial situation of their practice, what's hard for them, what they're trying to do, how they're structured. And that revealed something pretty stark results. About half of people were working alone.
Half of people were part of multiple people working on a project together. About half the people had no legal structure for their work. They were just operating as an individual. Half the people had tested out some sort of form. No one, most people struggled to get access to money. Most projects were self-financed or through debt.
Extreme pessimism about philanthropy, a great desire to move beyond that. And really what emerged was like, we had one question, which was like, would you like to see, you had to rate these different things. And one was, do you want a special tax break for artists? Very few people chose that. Instead, what they chose was they want a way to share ownership with collaborators.
They want it to be easier to find sources of investment or funding. They want to have health care. Like what came out was that they want to feel empowered and like they have agency and not that they are dependent. And so all of these, it's even just going to therapy, it's great to be asked what you think, to be given a chance to speak.
And I think in all of these, we have heard feelings that certainly resonate with me of a lot of existential questioning, a lot of doubt, a lot of struggle, but still it's, if you do this, it's in you. It's not really a choice. Maybe it's a question of how much of your life it can take up and in what way, but if it's in you, it's in you.
And I think those of us that it's in us, we are a specific group of people and it's interesting to see where we are. And undoubtedly, we're going to do this. We're going to make and explore because we have to, not because we're trying to do something. It's just there and it's always there.
So how does the ACORP really connect to all this? Because we've talked a little bit about, we've talked a lot about feelings and we've talked a lot about struggles. And I want to know how the ACORP has arisen from this.
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