Band of Traders - Together We Trade

10-15-2022: Bostic's Blackout Trades and Ethereum Deflates

16 Oct 2022

Contributed by Lukas

This week in the China Shop, Bears are bracing for more pain, while BofA is finding a silver lining in the recent selloff. Other stories include Bosti...

10-13-2022: Market Rallies on Elon Musk's Perfume

13 Oct 2022

Contributed by Lukas

Why The Markets Bounced After CPITSMC Cuts 2022 Capital Spending TargetAlbertsons to Merge with Kroger?Elon Musk Sells Perfume to Buy TwitterAdvertisi...

Andrew: In Search of @Wasatch_Squatch

13 Oct 2022

Contributed by Lukas

After coming across Andrew's frequent posts focusing on the mental side of trading on twitter, the guys had to reach out and invite him into the C...

10-11-2022: Bernanke Wins Nobel for Cathie Woods Deflation

11 Oct 2022

Contributed by Lukas

Bernanke Wins Nobel PrizeJamie Dimon wants more OilCathie Wood still pushing Deflation risksFord, GM and Other Carmakers Face 50% Profit Slump Next Ye...

10-08-22: iPhone's built by kids , US & China on the skids

09 Oct 2022

Contributed by Lukas

This week in the China Shop, we're looking at how the Fed is interpreting the latest jobs report, the latest in the US's push to limit China&#...

10-06-22: OPEC cuts supply over Kim Kardashian SEC fine

05 Oct 2022

Contributed by Lukas

U.S. Steps away from flagship lithium project with BerkshireMusk’s Twitter capitulation will be painfulWhite House says Biden’s Saudi trip wasn’...

Micah Kessel: CEO of Empathable

05 Oct 2022

Contributed by Lukas

This week in the China Shop, Micah Kessel, CEO of Empathable stops by for an interesting discussion on empathy and how it can affect the bottom line o...

10-04-22: Credit Suisse Credit Swaps Crypto Threats to Economy

04 Oct 2022

Contributed by Lukas

Credit Suisse in Spotlight Despite Moves to Calm ConcernsUN Warns of Risks Due to "Imprudent" Monetary PolicyTreasury Warns of Threat to Econo...

Trade Runners with Rich Friesen: Ep. 1, Measuring What Matters

03 Oct 2022

Contributed by Lukas

In the first installment of our newest limited series with Rich Friesen of Mind Muscles Academy, we're taking aim at improving our trading psychol...

10-01-22: Apple's Big Boobs and More Inflation News

01 Oct 2022

Contributed by Lukas

After taking a week off, the guys are back in the China Shop to discuss the latest sell-off, Hurricane Ian's potential economic impact, and share ...

09-29-22: British Bond Buying can't save Truth Social

29 Sep 2022

Contributed by Lukas

Great Britain Trying to Stabilize PoundFed Still HawkishPending Home SalesDWAC Changes Address to UPS Store, Investors PullingAdvertising Inquiries: h...

Kevin Rendino, CEO of 180 Degree Capital (TURN)

28 Sep 2022

Contributed by Lukas

This week we are welcoming Kevin Rendino, CEO of 180 Degree Capital (TURN), into the shop. Listen along as we discuss Kevin's experiences working ...

09-27-22: British Pound Sinks on Deli Fraud News

26 Sep 2022

Contributed by Lukas

British Pound Hits Record Low Against US DollarNew Jersey Deli Scheme UpdateLarry Summers Shares Outlook on the EconomySteve Forbes has the Real Cure ...

Round Table, Square Traders: Ft. Fleri and Joel

24 Sep 2022

Contributed by Lukas

In the inaugural episode of Round Table, Square Traders, Fleri is back in the shop to field questions from aspiring trader Joel. Sit back, relax and c...

09-21-22: Don't Cook Your FOMC Dotplots in NyQuil

21 Sep 2022

Contributed by Lukas

Wall Street ReactsFOMC TranscriptFOMC ProjectionsFOMC July MinutesAdvertising Inquiries: https://redcircle.com/brandsPrivacy & Opt-Out: https://redcir...

Erik Smolinski: Host of esInvests

21 Sep 2022

Contributed by Lukas

Erik Smolinski, host of esInvests on YouTube is in the shop this week to talk about his trading journey. Listen along as we discuss Erik's path: f...

09-20-22: Your Guide to Nvidia Sanctions and BYND Cannibalism

20 Sep 2022

Contributed by Lukas

UAE Pushing to Produce 5M BPD by 2025NVDA Rushing to Deliver Orders Before SanctionsBYND COO Arrested for Biting Man's NoseDeFi Trader Nets $500k+...

09-17-22: While Do Kwon Flees, Will There be a Silver Squeeze?

17 Sep 2022

Contributed by Lukas

This week China Shop, inflation is back in the headlines, Citi claims the only safe investment is the dollar and shop friend Jared Bibler sends Dan an...

09-14-22: Cathie Wood Deflates TSLA shorts

15 Sep 2022

Contributed by Lukas

The Fed Could Crash the Housing MarketCathie Wood Contrarian Deflation Call Gets Endorsed by ElonTSLA Dethroned as Biggest Short BetJim Cramer Says Wa...

James Woodall: CFP and Founder of Woodall Wealth Management

14 Sep 2022

Contributed by Lukas

Joining us in the shop this week is James Woodall, CFO and founder of Woodall Wealth Management. Listen along as we discuss everything from learning f...

09-13-22: Insider Crypto Trading the Railroad Strike

13 Sep 2022

Contributed by Lukas

Railroads Cutting Services as Union Talks FailCOIN Employee Mired in First Insider Trading CasePTON Cofounders Stepping DownWells Fargo to Pay $145 Mi...

09-09-22: 2 Bulls Podcast: BofA Revises Recession Forecast while Traders are Holding in Natural Gas

10 Sep 2022

Contributed by Lukas

This week China Shop the guys try to make sense of all the Fed speakers from the past week, traders are hoarding Natural Gas in the sea and Bank of Am...

Shlomo Freund: Creator of Free Financial Self

08 Sep 2022

Contributed by Lukas

Shlomo Freund, digital nomad and creator of Free Financial Self is in the shop this week to talk about his investing journey. Join us as we learn more...

09-06-22: Instagram fined for doxing kids over OPEC output

06 Sep 2022

Contributed by Lukas

News update for 09-06-22:Ireland Fines Instagram $400+ MillionThings Looking Rosier in AUSBinance to Stop Supporting RivalOPEC Makes Small Trim to Out...

Back to the Futures with OrderFlow Labs: Ep. 4, Building a Plan ft. Leo

05 Sep 2022

Contributed by Lukas

In the fourth installment of our limited series with OrderFlow Labs, Leo is in the shop to talk about putting all the pieces together into an actionab...

09-03-22: Slowing Sales of Homes, Pelosi's Skills Overblown

03 Sep 2022

Contributed by Lukas

This week China Shop, Kyle returns from vacation to lay down a challenge to all of Random's supporters before diving into the latest Jobs report. ...

09-01-22: Big Crypto Refund won't save Bed Bath & Beyond

01 Sep 2022

Contributed by Lukas

News update for 09-01-22:Crypto.com Sends $10.5 Million to Woman by MistakeQualcomm Server and Laptop Ambitions in JeopardySam's Club Raising Annu...

Phil Muscatello: Host of Stocks for Beginners

31 Aug 2022

Contributed by Lukas

This week in the China Shop we are joined by Phil Muscatello, creator and host of Stocks for Beginners. Listen along as we discuss everything from opt...

08-27-2022: Powell brings the Pain, Biden makes it Rain

27 Aug 2022

Contributed by Lukas

This week China Shop, Jason from the “Completely Off The Rails” podcast fills in for Kyle and he and Dan discuss the latest Powell talk out of Jac...

CC Lagator: Founder of Options AI

24 Aug 2022

Contributed by Lukas

This week in the China Shop we are joined by the founder of Optionsai.com, CC Lagator. Listen along as we learn about his experiences as an options ma...

08-23-22: Starbucks Kidnaps Ryan Cohen from a Bed Bath & Beyond

23 Aug 2022

Contributed by Lukas

News Update for 08-23-22:Markets Fall as Investors Question Fed Pivot ThesisChina Cuts Lending Benchmarks (Again)SBUX Employees Accused of Kidnapping ...

08-20-22: Buffett Splurges, Ethereum Merges

20 Aug 2022

Contributed by Lukas

This week China Shop, JPM stands by a bold end of year prediction, CEOs are using the term "Elasticity" and the internet can't decide if t...

08-18-2022: Cramer says Crypto Hacking a buy

18 Aug 2022

Contributed by Lukas

News update for 08/18/22:Wall Street Down, But Indexes Briefly Cut Losses After Fed MinutesTGT Profit Plunges 90%Ryan Cohen Files 144 with SECRetail I...

Joe Saul-Sehy: Host of the Stacking Benjamins Podcast

17 Aug 2022

Contributed by Lukas

This week in the China Shop we are joined by Joe Saul-Sehy, host of the Stacking Benjamins podcast, for a laid-back conversation that covered everythi...

08-16-22: Interest rates hit 69% in Argentina, and it isn't a sex joke.

16 Aug 2022

Contributed by Lukas

News update for 08-16-22:Homebuilders Say US in a RecessionWhat Does China's Dismal Economic Report Mean for Commodities?Argentina Hikes Rates to ...

08-13-22: Crypto for BlackRock, Delisting for Chinese Stocks

13 Aug 2022

Contributed by Lukas

This week China Shop the guys are discussing contradicting Bear/Bull market signs as some news indicate the bottom is in while others claim the worst ...

08-11-22: Musk Sale Brings Down Google Search

10 Aug 2022

Contributed by Lukas

News Update for 08-11-22:CPI Data Shows Cooling InflationYield Curve Indicates No Recession Until 2024Musk Sells $6.9 Billion TSLA GOOG Outage Brief b...

Sammie Ellard-King: Founder of Up the Gains

10 Aug 2022

Contributed by Lukas

This week Sammie Ellard King, founder of Up the Gains, stops by the shop to talk about his investment journey. Listen along as we discuss how he got s...

08-09-22: AMZN Robots Spying on Your Chicken Consumption

09 Aug 2022

Contributed by Lukas

News update for 08-09-22:AMZN Wants to Scan Every Inch of Your Home?Demand for Chicken Drives Price IncreasesNo EV on the Market Today Qualifies for N...

08-06-22: INTC Denies Delays, Nomad Asks to Parlay

06 Aug 2022

Contributed by Lukas

This week China Shop the guys are discussing the latest jobs report and what impact that will have on the next FOMC before digging into a new tax on s...

08-04-22: AMC Earnings fall faster than Mortgage Rates

05 Aug 2022

Contributed by Lukas

News update for 08/04/22:AMC Earnings Released, Issues Special DividendSEC's Gensler Accused in Citadel MM ManipulationMortage Rates Fall for 2nd ...

Lance Belline: CFP and Author of More Wealth, Less Taxes

03 Aug 2022

Contributed by Lukas

This week in the shop we are joined by Lance Belline, Certified Financial Planner and author of the upcoming book, More Wealth, Less Taxes. Join us as...

08-01-22: Pelosi Investigates Massive Crypto Ponzi Scheme in Taiwan

02 Aug 2022

Contributed by Lukas

News update for 08-01-22:US Warns China Not to Turn Pelosi's Taiwan Trip into CrisisJPMs Gold Secrets Spill Out in CourtUS Manufacturing Slows Mod...

Back To The Futures with OrderFlow Labs: Ep. 3, Volume Profile

30 Jul 2022

Contributed by Lukas

In the Third episode of our limited series with OrderFlow Labs, Job steps in for a discussion on Volume and how it relates to the Auction process. Lis...

07-30-22: Recession gets Redefined, AAPL's Revenue Continues Climb

30 Jul 2022

Contributed by Lukas

This week China Shop favorite Fleri from OrderFlow Labs fills in for Dan to discuss the major stock market news from the past week. Listen along as he...

Jason Lawhorn: Day Trader and Host of Completely Off the Rails

27 Jul 2022

Contributed by Lukas

This week in the shop we are joined by Jason Lawhorn, aspiring day trader and host of the podcast Completely Off the Rails. Listen along as we discuss...

07-27-22: Slowing Home Sales Spook Walmart Earnings in Ukraine

26 Jul 2022

Contributed by Lukas

News updates for 7-27:Ukraine Pursuing War-Crime Charges on Western Bank LeadersUS Consumer Confidence Declines for 3rd Straight MonthWalmart Earnings...

07-26-22: Employment Up... But it's also Child Labor.

26 Jul 2022

Contributed by Lukas

News update for 7/26: JPM Thinks Inflation Has PeakedBiden Doesn't Think US Recession is LikelyInsider Trading ProsecutionsMore ProsecutionsH...

07-23-22: TWTR Blames Musk, DOGE Reduces Dust?

23 Jul 2022

Contributed by Lukas

This week in the China Shop, the banking issues in China are getting worse as the government sends in tanks to stop people from accessing their money,...

Kira Turner: Professional Stock and Options Trader at T3 Live

20 Jul 2022

Contributed by Lukas

This week in the shop we are joined by Kira Turner, professional trader and moderator of the Inner Circle at T3 Live. The Inner Circle is T3 Live’s ...

07-16-22: Go Big! Says Bullard, Crypto Not Insured

16 Jul 2022

Contributed by Lukas

After taking last week off, the guys are back and looking at stories about bank protests in China, Canada's surprising 100bp rate hike and what so...

Roger Khoury: CEO of Market Forecasting Academy

13 Jul 2022

Contributed by Lukas

Joining us in the Shop this week is Roger Khoury, founder and CEO of the Market Forecasting Academy. Listen along as Roger tells us about his training...

Stephen Mathai-Davis: Founder and CEO of Q.ai

08 Jul 2022

Contributed by Lukas

Joining us in the Shop this week is Stephen Mathai-Davis, founder and CEO of Q.ai, a Forbes backed Artificial intelligence powered investing app for e...

Kyrill Asatur: CEO of Centerfin

06 Jul 2022

Contributed by Lukas

Joining us in the Shop this week is Kyrill Asatur, CEO of Centerfin. Listen along as we learn about Kyrill's journey into the markets, from his de...

07-02-22: SEC Ethics Fine, Uganda Hits The Gold Mine

02 Jul 2022

Contributed by Lukas

This week in the China Shop, we've got some manufacturers data and Euro inflation to look at, along with a major gold deposit found in Uganda and ...

Back to the Futures with Orderflow Labs: Ep. 2, Auction Theory

30 Jun 2022

Contributed by Lukas

In the second episode of our limited series with OrderFlow Labs, Fleri returns for an in-depth lesson on auction theory and how the markets move. Buil...

Paul Halme: Former Stockbroker and 2x Bestselling Author

28 Jun 2022

Contributed by Lukas

Joining us in the Shop this week is Paul Halme, former stockbroker and 2x bestselling author. Listen along as we discuss his all of his past experienc...

06-25-22: Bullard calms, Consumers got qualms

25 Jun 2022

Contributed by Lukas

This week in the China Shop, Fed testimony and inflation revisions help add to the relief rally, while JPM predicts another 7% increase in equities ah...

Joseph Hogue: CFA and Host of Let's Talk Money

22 Jun 2022

Contributed by Lukas

Joining us in the Shop this week is Joseph Hogue, CFA and creator of Let's Talk Money. Listen along as we discuss Joseph's trading journey and...

6-18-22: Call it a Recession Not a Crash, Amazon Burns through Staff

18 Jun 2022

Contributed by Lukas

This week in the China Shop, the guys look at the latest from the FOMC and PMI report before digging into stories about Europe's natural gas suppl...

Designated Quizzers Become Stock Market Wizards

15 Jun 2022

Contributed by Lukas

Joining us in the Shop this week are Jason and Lisa Marks, beginner investors and creators of Designated Quizzers. Listen along as we do our best to e...

06-11-22: Inflation Just Won't Quit, Tesla Can't Help but Split

11 Jun 2022

Contributed by Lukas

This week in the China Shop, a surprising CPI report chops the legs off a bear market rally even as imports fall off, while the SEC looks to challenge...

After Hours: Guests get pulled for Ask A Bull

08 Jun 2022

Contributed by Lukas

After a string of no-call no-shows, this week Dan and Kyle decided to close up the shop early and take some questions from the listeners. We answer pr...

6-4-22: Biden shifts blame, Meta still Lame

04 Jun 2022

Contributed by Lukas

This week in the China Shop, the top stories revolve around economic data and Biden's rare meeting with Fed chair Powell in what looks to be a mov...

Gordon Stein: Author of the Cashflow Cookbook

01 Jun 2022

Contributed by Lukas

Joining us in the Shop this week is Gordon Stein, the author of the Cashflow Cookbook. Gordon's book is a collection of recipes designed to save t...

Back to the Futures with Orderflow Labs: Episode 1, Building the Foundation

30 May 2022

Contributed by Lukas

In this first episode of our new limited series with OrderFlow Labs, Fleri joins us to help lay a solid foundation for successful futures trading. Mu...

05-28-22: Strippers Calling Recession, FED Shows QT Progression

28 May 2022

Contributed by Lukas

This week in the China Shop, we look at the recent Fed meeting notes and latest inflation readings and look for confluence with exotic dancer predicti...

Joe Cecala: Founder and CEO of Dream Exchange

25 May 2022

Contributed by Lukas

Joining us in the Shop this week is the CEO and founder of the Dream Exchange, the first majority black-owned stock exchange in the history of the Uni...

05-21-22: Citadel Blames Retail, Bullard's Bulls Prevail

21 May 2022

Contributed by Lukas

This week in the China Shop, we look at the comments by uber hawk Bullard on Friday before moving on to stories about Melvin Capital and Citadel's...

Dr. Bruce Liu: CEO of Esoterica Capital

18 May 2022

Contributed by Lukas

Joining us in the Shop this week is the CEO of Esoterica Capital, Dr. Bruce Liu. Listen along as we learn more about why Esoterica was founded along w...

05-14-22: Under New Management

14 May 2022

Contributed by Lukas

This week in the China Shop, new hosts Anthony Fatseas and Sarah Glass discuss the latest CPI data and puzzle over BofA's interpretation of Po...

Matthew Murawski: Financial Planner at Goodstein Wealth Management

11 May 2022

Contributed by Lukas

Joining us in the Shop this week is Matthew Murawski, a Financial Planner at Goodstein Wealth Management. Listen along as we discuss Matthew's unu...

05-08-22: In Search of Bottom Fisher

08 May 2022

Contributed by Lukas

This week in the China Shop, Sarah Glass of TRADEPRO Academy fills in for Kyle as he fills in for Anthony who was filling in for Dan. Listen along as ...

Cody Willard: Founder of SKTLS Crypto

04 May 2022

Contributed by Lukas

This week we are pleased to have former CNN and Fox anchor and hedge fund manager Cody Willard in the shop to discuss his upcoming cryptocurrency laun...

04-30-22: The Day the Bulls Died

30 Apr 2022

Contributed by Lukas

This week in the China Shop, Anthony Fatseas, host of WTFinance, fills in as the shopkeeper while Dan enjoys himself across the pond in Ireland. Liste...

Jared Bibler, Iceland's Secret pt. 2

27 Apr 2022

Contributed by Lukas

Jared Bibler, author of Iceland's Secret returns to the shop this week to continue our discussion on the events before and after the collapse of I...

04-23-22: Powell Still Hawking while the Markets Keep Dropping

23 Apr 2022

Contributed by Lukas

This week in the China Shop, a slew of Fed speakers leaves the guys with much to discuss in relation to rising interest rates. Russian oil and the eff...

Derrick Oldensmith: Vice President of Trading and Education

20 Apr 2022

Contributed by Lukas

This week in the shop we are joined by Derrick Oldensmith, VP of Trading and Education at T3 Live. Listen along as we discuss all things trading, from...

04-15-2022: Musk Insinuates Dump, Woods Prefers Pump

16 Apr 2022

Contributed by Lukas

This week in the China Shop, much of the discussion is centered on the latest CPI report and whether or not inflation has peaked, before moving on to ...

Herald van der Linde: Author of Asia's Stock Markets from the Ground Up

13 Apr 2022

Contributed by Lukas

Joining us in the shop this week is Herald van der Linde, Head of Equity Strategy for Asia Pacific at HSBC and author of Asia's Stock Markets from...

04-09-22: The Recession Progression

09 Apr 2022

Contributed by Lukas

This week in the China Shop, while most of the focus is on the increasing threats of a recession, Russia's looming default and Congress's oppo...

Leo and Fleri, OrderFlow Labs Returns

06 Apr 2022

Contributed by Lukas

Leo and Fleri from OrderFlow Labs return to the shop this week to chat about volatility and liquidity, poker crossovers with trading and to give Dan a...

04-02-22: House Votes on Grass, While Biden Taps That Gas

02 Apr 2022

Contributed by Lukas

This week in the China Shop, March inflation spikes in Europe while President Biden looks to tap into the strategic oil reserves to drive down US gas ...

Anthony Fatseas, Host of WTFinance Returns!

30 Mar 2022

Contributed by Lukas

This week Anthony Fatseas, host of WTFinance and shop favorite, returns to chat about a variety of subjects, including Marijuana legislation, emerging...

03-26-2021: MJ Getting Legislated while Florida Man Gets Educated

27 Mar 2022

Contributed by Lukas

This week in the China Shop, Russia and Ukraine continue to make headlines, a new MJ bill looks to have more promise and a surprising state takes fina...

03-23-2022: Anthony Vicino, Invicitus Capital

23 Mar 2022

Contributed by Lukas

Anthony Vicino, co-founder of Invicitus Capital, stops by the shop to talk about investing in commercial real estate. Join us as we discuss the windin...

03-19-2022: Rate Hike Inline, AMC Buys Gold Mine

19 Mar 2022

Contributed by Lukas

This week in the China Shop, Dan and Kyle look at the recent Fed decision to raise rates for the first time since 2018, as well as the pullback in oil...

Eric Mason: Economist, CFO

16 Mar 2022

Contributed by Lukas

This week the China Shop gets its first economist as Eric Mason, CFO of Quincy, MA stops by. Listen along as we ask him to explain all the difficult c...

03-11-22: Meme Stock Surge and the Dreaded "R" Word

12 Mar 2022

Contributed by Lukas

This week in the China Shop, talks of recession dominate the headlines as inflation numbers stay elevated and oil prices continue to surge. In Stocks ...

2 Bulls in a China Shop - 2022 Trailer

12 Mar 2022

Contributed by Lukas

Market moving news, stocks and options!New episodes every week!Special guest episodes every Wednesday!Advertising Inquiries: https://redcircle.com/bra...

Rich Friesen: Author of A Private Conversation with Money and Founder of Mind Muscles for Traders

09 Mar 2022

Contributed by Lukas

Rich Friesen returns to the shop to give an update on his book launch, A Private Conversation with Money. Join us as we discuss what makes Rich's ...

03-05-2022: Fed wrong again & War doesn't make friends

05 Mar 2022

Contributed by Lukas

This week in the China Shop, we finally get to talk about something other than the Ukraine invasion (although that still heavily dominated the discuss...

Kevin White: The SPY Trader with Tegrity

03 Mar 2022

Contributed by Lukas

This week in the China Shop, Kevin White stops by to talk about his trading strategies, influences and his honest approach to social media. Listen alo...

02-26-22: 2 Bulls Podcast: Friday's Market Tear, Musk Pokes the Bear

26 Feb 2022

Contributed by Lukas

This week in the China Shop, we're still talking about Ukraine, from the effects on oil and the Fed's decision to raise rates in March to the ...

Ian Fraser, Author of Shredded: Inside RBS, The Bank That Broke Britain

23 Feb 2022

Contributed by Lukas

Ian Fraser, author of the bestselling book Shredded, stops by this week to discuss the events that led to the collapse of the Royal Bank of Scotland. ...

02-19-2022: Cathie Woods Gets Mad and the Glut of Crypto Ads

19 Feb 2022

Contributed by Lukas

This week in the China Shop, Ukraine retains its top spot in relevant news... Also of interest, shale oil producers plan to limit production even if o...

Jonathan Baird, The Global Investment Letter

17 Feb 2022

Contributed by Lukas

Jonathan Baird joins us in the China Shop this week to discuss his Global Investment Letter, a monthly journal that comments on capital markets around...

02-12-2022: Inflation Rises and the Ukrainian Crisis

12 Feb 2022

Contributed by Lukas

This week in the China Shop, the release of the latest CPI numbers has one notable economist bracing for another mistake in Fed policy. All that, howe...

Fleri and Leo: OrderFlow Labs

09 Feb 2022

Contributed by Lukas

This week in the shop we are joined by two very special guests, Leo and Fleri from OrderFlow Labs. Listen along as we chat about Fleri and Leo's t...

02-05-22: Earnings Report Fails while The Jobs Report Sails

05 Feb 2022

Contributed by Lukas

This week in the China Shop, the recent NFP report takes center stage, as good news actually isn't so good... We also look at the latest developme...