Chapter 1: What framework has been established for U.S.-Greenland relations?
Bloomberg Audio Studios. Podcasts, radio, news. The president who is also inviting Vladimir Putin to join the board, sitting down with leaders and diplomats two by two, signing a charter, establishing the new entity. Now, today's events coming on the heels, of course, of the continued talks to end the war in Ukraine. Reports now the administration is eyeing regime change in Cuba.
And, of course, the aggressive war of words over Greenland. It has been a couple of days. The president posting on social media as he traveled back to the U.S. right now, quote, it was an incredible time in Davos. The Greenland structure is being worked on and will be amazing for the USA, unquote.
Joining us now here in our Washington bureau for a special conversation is former vice president of the United States, Mike Pence. Mr. Vice President, welcome back to Bloomberg TV and radio. It's great to see you.
Well, thank you, Joe. Thanks for having me on.
Chapter 2: How does Mike Pence view Trump's approach to NATO allies?
I hope the new year is starting out well for you. It's been a doozy already when it comes to the news cycle, especially when it comes to geopolitics. And that's where I'd like to start with you, because I believe that you are in favor of what we're seeing in Greenland. I know you had some issues with the approach that the president was taking. I did.
Now that we have the framework for a deal, was it worth the cost of upsetting our NATO allies to the extent that he apparently did?
Well, it was actually back in 2018 when I was vice president that President Trump first expressed an interest. You thought it was a good idea? In adding Greenland to the United States, either as a territory or beyond, much of the way we purchased Alaska, much of the way Thomas Jefferson purchased the Louisiana Purchase.
And I really do believe, Joe, that there is a national security case to be made. The Arctic has become much more active with regard to military incursions by China and Russia. And having that platform permanently for the United States, as well as all the mineral rights, is key. I had concerns, of course, about any suggestion that we would use military force against the territory of a NATO ally.
That would be unacceptable. I also had concerns about the president threatening more unilateral tariffs against countries
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Chapter 3: What national security concerns are associated with Greenland?
that wouldn't agree with turning Greenland over to the United States. So I, like a lot of people over there in Davos, I welcome the announcement of a framework. Sounds like there'll be additional opportunities for a permanent military base as well as mining. And I think that sets into motion a process that could well someday in the future
give way to Greenland being a part of the United States as a territory? Sure. I mean, you look at it, the U.S. Virgin Islands were a part of Denmark back in the day. Those were purchased. But to me, this should always have been a process of evolution and not... you know, anything more abrupt than that.
And so, look, I want to commend the president for finding a way forward and a framework that at least leaves open the opportunity for a future with Greenland and the United States, but also in the immediate term deals with real national security concerns and the ability to do resource development.
To the point that we cannot now? I know we're still learning what's in the deal because we actually don't have a completed deal, but we have great access to Greenland now, correct? What was it in that first term that you wanted you couldn't get?
Chapter 4: What is the significance of military presence in Greenland?
Well, quite honestly, since 1951, we've had a treaty with Denmark that's allowed us to have a... virtually unlimited military placement. We only have about 200 soldiers there today, but we've had up to 10,000 in the past. But in terms of the development of permanent bases, I think the president yesterday used the term when he was asked about the duration of the agreement, I think he said forever.
That's right. I'm not sure the previous treaty fell in that category. So, you know, if there is a new long-term arrangement that addresses our very real and ongoing security concerns in the region, as well as expands our ability to develop the resources that are there. I welcome that, but I welcome it through negotiation and not the kind of tactics that were being talked about before.
I think a lot of our NATO allies were surprised to hear the president suggest that he did not believe they would be there to defend the United States if called upon in an Article 5 violation. You, of course, were in Washington when the only one triggered ever took place on behalf of the United States.
And I think we've all heard to the extent to which the Danes were involved in responding on our behalf. That's right. To hear the Secretary General of NATO say it pains him to hear that, you don't believe that our NATO allies would not be there for us in a time of need, do you?
Well, history's a teacher.
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Chapter 5: How does Pence assess the Board of Peace concept?
I was here in Washington. I was a freshman member of Congress, Joe, on 9-11. And I watched our European allies initiate Article 5 and go to war to defend our country. And they did that. And so I thought it was regrettable. The president speculated about Europe's willingness to stand with the NATO alliance and stand with the United States. I have every confidence.
This is the greatest alliance in the history of... of the free world. And my hope is that the progress that they made in reaching an agreement over Greenland suggests that better days are ahead for the United States and our important allies in Europe. Sure.
And a lot of American blood and treasure was spent to build that alliance, as we know. Enter the Board of Peace. We just saw some images of President Trump at the signing ceremony earlier today. This is an interesting assembly of world leaders, 20 nations, many of them not considered allies, including Lukashenko, Vladimir Putin.
Chapter 6: What role does Russia play in current geopolitical discussions?
Are these men of peace?
Joe, well, let's take a half step back and say I've walked through the communities in Israel that were struck on October the 7th.
And I want to give President Trump great credit for standing with Israel as they did what needed to be done to take down Hamas and to secure a ceasefire that continues to hold to this day, even taking action against Iran's nuclear program that was historic and important. The Board of Peace as a concept for the future of Gaza I think is a welcome one.
I was disappointed to see the addition of Russia and the presence of other representatives of authoritarian regimes and the absence of European allies on the Board of Peace. We all hope for a future with Gaza that is peaceful and prosperous and that Hamas is utterly disarmed and no longer a threat to the people of Israel and to the region.
But I think the Board of Peace itself ought to first be comprised of nations that have a demonstrated commitment to freedom and to peace.
And Russia doesn't make that list. Well, it's important that you went back to Gaza in your answer because that was supposed to be the charge of this board. It seems that it will be. potentially used on a global level, and that the president's chairmanship will outlive his presidency.
We're not going to be in a world in which a board of peace with Vladimir Putin is helping to set the way forward in Ukraine, for instance, are we?
More than three years ago, Vladimir Putin launched a brutal and unprovoked invasion against Ukraine that rages to this day. I thought President Zelensky's remarks today in Davos were important and on point.
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Chapter 7: What actions does Pence suggest for supporting Ukraine?
And I, for my part, think that whatever these structures are, I've always been someone dubious of all these different committees at the United Nations, and now we've got a board of peace. What we need is the free world to be locking arms together against Ukraine authoritarian regimes that would seek to redraw international lines by force.
And my hope is that nations in Europe will heed Zelensky's call to take even more decisive action. And I think the time has come for the United States Senate to pass those strong secondary sanctions against nations that are fueling the Russian war machine through the purchase of oil. President Trump, I am told, informed Senator Graham that he would support the bill now more than two weeks ago.
I don't know what the holdup is. I think it's time that we put even more pressure on. The way to peace is not through boards. The way to peace is through strength. and showing Vladimir Putin that the free world will not stand idly by while he wages this unprovoked invasion against Ukraine.
Well, as you and I speak, Steve Witkoff and Jared Kushner are having a late-night meeting with Vladimir Putin. And after what you just mentioned, the comments from President Zelensky earlier today in Davos, how you rationalize these parallel negotiations that are underway. And if, Mr. Vice President, is there any reason why we should expect anything different from Putin this time?
Chapter 8: How does Pence critique the current administration's economic policies?
Vladimir Putin doesn't want peace. So is this a waste of time? He wants Ukraine.
Yeah.
And I have met Vladimir Putin. I've stood closer than I am to you. I've told him things he didn't want to hear. And I have never had any illusions. about the man. Vladimir Putin has made it clear for now more than a quarter century that his ambition in life is to reassert that old Soviet sphere of influence. And Ukraine is a part of that. Crimea in Ukraine was a part of that.
But his ambitions don't stop there. And I hold the view that now is not the time for more talk, more summits, more conversation. It's time for action. And having nations free up those frozen Russian assets, as European powers are discussing, make them available to Ukraine, but also, again, passing those strong secondary sanctions.
President Trump has said he would sign out of the United States Senate, sending it to the president's desk, putting real constraints on the energy industry in a Russia that fuels their war machine is the way to go. Peace through strength has always been the American path in my adult life. And it's still the answer today.
It doesn't sound like you expect a breakthrough tonight either at the same time. This was quite a day in Washington to see the former special counsel Jack Smith testify on Capitol Hill. I don't know if you had an ear on his remarks, but he was pretty straightforward, warning that there are potentially catastrophic ongoing threats to U.S.
democracy because of the failure to hold President Trump accountable for what he called his criminal attempts to overturn the 2020 election. Is he right?
Well, I didn't have the opportunity to watch the hearings today, but I know what happened that day. You sure do. And I'll always believe, by God's grace, I did my duty to see to the peaceful transfer of power. But with regard to our democracy as a whole, it's... It's important to remember that every Republican and Democrat on Capitol Hill also did their duty that day.
After the Capitol Hill police quelled the riot, Joe, we reconvened the very same day, Republicans and Democrats alike, and completed our duty under the Constitution of the United States. I've said that it's a day of tragedy, but it ultimately became a triumph of freedom.
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