Decriminalising drugs will we see this happen?
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What is the main topic discussed in this episode?
The Clare Byrne Show on Newstalk. With Aviva Insurance.
An Oireachtas committee has recommended the decriminalisation of possession of all drugs for personal use. To discuss this, I'm joined by Professor Colin O'Gara, addiction psychiatrist at St John of God's Hospital and clinical professor of psychiatry at UCD. Professor, you're very welcome to... to the programme. I know you and many other clinicians and many other people who've worked within this field have recommended this health led approach for some time. But can you just explain to people this morning what the difference is between the decriminalisation of drugs for personal use and the legalisation of drugs for personal use?
Yeah, good morning Ciara.
What is the recommendation from the Oireachtas committee regarding drug decriminalisation?
Essentially decriminalisation takes away the idea that if you suffer from an addiction primarily that you're going to be treated as a criminal. So up to this point if you were caught in possession of drugs you would go down a criminal route. The proposal here from the committee is that you would be put into a health system as opposed to a criminal system. So that is a huge change and it's a huge change in terms of stigma A lot of our patients, Ciara, who attend here to see me, for instance, in the outpatient setting, do not want to come into hospital because of the stigma. We've got a massive issue in terms of access to services. Some of the figures, for instance, are that only one in 10 people with the more rare forms of addiction will actually...
attend for treatment because of stigma. So one of the key issues in terms of driving stigma is saying to a person when they're at their lowest ebb, in addition to being an addict, you're also a criminal. And I think that has to stop.
What about those people who take drugs and never end up in front of you or never have to access addiction services? What does a health led approach mean for them and look like for them?
Yeah, so for some people Ciara, they will use drugs in a hedonistic fashion, meaning they will go out They will take drugs and they will go back to work on a Monday morning. The estimates for, say, ecstasy, cocaine, stimulants, probably 1.5 million people. You know, 20 years ago, we used to use the figure of a million people in the UK, one and a half million people in the UK using these drugs, some of whom will go to work on a Monday morning as if nothing happened. My experience is that people take drugs for a whole host of reasons. They take drugs because they're lonely. They take drugs because they were bullied in school. They take drugs because they were traumatised, be it physical, emotional or sexual abuse.
And they really on one level would not want to be taking drugs. So if you put these people into a health system, some, not all of course, but some will benefit from that. You will have a cohort of people as well. who will take drugs, go through the health system and get off and won't be criminalised, of course. But I think the big picture here is that we have to move towards supporting people who are using drugs and who can be helped.
I'm just wondering, though, what that approach in really practical terms looks like. Let's say you're at a festival, you are found using cocaine. This health led approach is what's adopted and recommended for you. What do you do? What happens?
What is the difference between decriminalisation and legalisation of drugs?
Well, the international model is that you would be in front of what's called a dissuasion committee. So you would essentially enter, instead of going down the route of a court appearance, you would be engaging with a committee, some of whom will be health professionals, and you'll be offered the opportunity to engage in treatment of some sort. So obviously, if you don't want to engage in that treatment, that would be, you know, that's not going to be useful. But again, it comes back to, you know, this idea that really when people are using, you know, are you going to give somebody a criminal record, for instance, for the future? They're not going to be able to travel because they have been using drugs at this particular time.
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Chapters
5 chapters
1
What is the main topic discussed in this episode?
0:01–0:52
2
What is the recommendation from the Oireachtas committee regarding drug decriminalisation?
0:52–3:48
3
What is the difference between decriminalisation and legalisation of drugs?
3:48–8:24
4
How does stigma affect individuals with drug addiction?
8:24–13:04
5
What does a health-led approach to drug use look like?
13:04–15:01