Nic McKinley is an entrepreneur, former military special operator, and ex-CIA operative who founded and led two multimillion-dollar tech companies. A pioneer in building technical solutions to protect society from predators, Nic is passionate about solving society's most pressing issues through cost-effective technical solutions. Nic grew up in Montana but left to join US military special operations as a US Air Force Pararescueman. After more than a decade in Pararescue, Nic worked in private intelligence start-ups before being recruited into a specialized unit at the Central Intelligence Agency that provided unique capabilities and expertise in response to the critical operational needs of the Intelligence Community. With 30 combat deployments under his belt in both Special Operations and the CIA, Nic experienced the power of technology during the Global War on Terror and set out to use his skills and training with that experience to combat modern slavery. In 2014, Nic founded DeliverFund, the only donor-funded solution to human trafficking that delivers proprietary data and technology to law enforcement, allowing them to take down human traffickers effectively. Along with DeliverFund, Nic founded a venture capital-backed software company and has a technology leadership consulting practice. Despite being dubbed "The Real Jack Ryan" by VICE Media, Nic's most important role is as a husband and father leading his family in a life of service and adventure in Montana. When he is not in his office, Nic can be found on a lake, on the ski slopes, camping, climbing vertical rock or ice in the mountains, with his nose in a book learning something new, or spending downtime with his extraordinary wife. Nic holds multiple degrees, one of which is a Bachelor of Liberal Arts from Harvard University. The Noah Story: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3KP8h2RchhM Safeguard App: https://apps.apple.com/app/apple-store/id6448926293?pt=125436411&ct=ClearedHot&mt=8 Montana Knife Company: https://www.montanaknifecompany.com/ LMNT: https://drinklmnt.com/?
Chapter 1: What is the focus of Nic McKinley's work?
Morning, everybody. As always, welcome back, and thank you for the support of the show. I really appreciate the feedback that I get every month and the support that people have that enables me to do what it is that I do. Today's episode is with a repeat guest, Nick McKinley.
I've had him on a few times, and I'm never gonna stop having him on because he works in a world that I opened my eyes to or was exposed to far too late in life, and that is the world of human trafficking. If you're anything like me, When I first heard that term, my brain immediately jumped. Oh, we must be talking about women specifically in sexual human trafficking.
And of course there is an aspect of that, but that's not it. And I don't even think I would have to default to Nick on this. I don't even think that's the majority. Trafficking happens every day in every state in this country. I guarantee you've encountered it, but I bet you it was invisible.
So Nick is the CEO of Deliver Fund, which happens to be an organization co-located here in Montana, I think less than 20 miles up the road. They are an anti-human trafficking organization, and Nick does a good job of describing who they are and what they do.
Chapter 2: How does human trafficking manifest in society?
And to maybe even get some more context on Deliver Fund specifically as an organization, I'll put the thumbnails up for the two previous episodes that I think I've had him on for. Those are a great starting point. Today, we lateraled it a little bit, and we were talking more about the targeting of young boys, specifically because...
As a country and as a society, we are doing a good job of educating young women to the risks of, what would be the correct word? Trafficking would be the end state of that, the steps that lead you towards the trafficking, that seduction, enticement, leverage, whatever it may be. We're not doing as good of a job when it comes to young men. So strap in for a little bit.
I mean, we drifted and I think gave our thoughts on just about everything geopolitical and world related before we got into that. But Don't close your eyes to this issue. It's important and it's everywhere. And Deliver Fund is an amazing organization doing the best that they can to step in the breach, try to stop this. Now, before we get into the episode, let's take a few seconds.
Chapter 3: What is DeliverFund and its mission?
Let's pay the bills. I am so happy and proud to say that today's episode is brought to you by Montana Knife Company. Montana Knife Company. was founded by Josh Smith, the youngest master bladesmith ever to be. And I don't know if that was in the world or just in the United States. I'm going to say in the world. And if I'm wrong, Josh can correct people, but that's what I'm going to say.
Chapter 4: What challenges do young men face regarding trafficking?
He's been making knives for 30 years. Montana Knife Company was born and bred in his breathing vision into where this company wants to go with its roots deeply into Montana. Made in the USA, locally manufactured. I'm sitting in Kalispell, Montana. They're just down the road about probably 110 miles from where I'm sitting right now in Frenchtown, Montana. Designed, tested, and built by hunters.
Montana Knife Company has their roots and is first and foremost a hunting knife company. They sell sharp knives right out of the box. Their innovation in the last year has been unbelievable. So this is a mini speed goat. My original favorite knife of theirs was the Speed Goat, slightly larger than this.
And I also love the paracord handle, not because I am going to use it for anything, but it's super lightweight. Just in 2024, they started releasing their tactical line. And honestly, off the top of my head, I can't remember exactly which version this is. It's one of the goats though. And this is my everyday carry. These knives are unbelievable.
The quality, it's of course impossible to tell just listening to me talk about it or looking at it on the video. They're amazing. But what I'm gonna add to that is these are hard to get. They sell out quickly. The demand for these knives is outstripping their ability to produce them, even though they are continuing to order more and more and more.
So Thursdays is often when they do drops, but Saturdays, starting in 2025, they're gonna be doing those as well. Here is my ask. If you want to support an amazing American-founded, American-made brand, head on over to MontanaKnifeCompany.com and see what they have to offer. And my only ask to you would be this.
If you end up buying something at some important time in their payment portal, it's going to ask you, How you got there? Who sent you there? Do me a favor. If it says either Cleared Hot Podcast or Andy Stone, just click on that button so they know that you found them through this show. And that's all I have to say on that. An amazing brand founded by an amazing person with an amazing community.
Yep, the trifecta. Let's get into today's episode. Okay, got the red smoke. Ah! North or south? West of the smoke. West of the smoke. Okay, copy. West of the smoke. I'm looking at danger close now. Come on, win it, baby. Give it to me. I need it. Get cleared hot. Copy. Cleared hot.
First off, that's where we're starting. I'm jealous. First off, you shouldn't kill people. Why not? Okay. As that came out of my mouth, I was thinking that I'm a liar. That's self-condemning, isn't it? So I'm a hypocrite, but... You shouldn't kill health care CEOs and then celebrate it. Correct. But I'm jealous of the fact they're calling him an assassin.
Kind of because we worked for years to get that title and never made it. I didn't know it was an option. I would have self declared myself an assassin immediately upon graduating buds because I was assassin trained, right? Assassin tan, like tangential. No, that first off, what are your thoughts on that? The old CEO getting murked? One, uh,
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Chapter 5: What are the differences between military and civilian operations?
Meanwhile, the half is like probably still on shore, you know, in my mind, eating pop tarts around a campfire as I'm in a fucking dry suit, just cursing my career occupational choices. And then I'm the lead climber. So I got to go. God, it was nightmare. And so the helo assault force comes in and how can I talk about this broadly?
There are certain areas in the ship that we will dedicate our energy towards, you know, where the capitan of the ship is. Sometimes that's a good place to go and spend some effort, but it's easier for the helicopters to get there. So there's these bridge wings and we'd have the little birds come up. And they would only rope on one side.
So that means people are crawling through the internal behind the pilots inside of Little Bird, which it's a very small platform. That's a small platform and you're wearing gear.
Makes sense to you. I don't know. I mean, somebody could look up what an MH6 looks like. Plus you got the gear hanging in the back. Totally. Yeah. So there's a fast rope down. The last guy gets ready to go. And as he's fast roping down, the helicopter starts losing station a little bit and drifts off. Oh. Drift the rope off the wing?
Drift the rope off the wing. And this is fucking night. The last thing we see is legitimately a man holding on to the bottom of a fast rope as a fucking little bird is like ripping through this right-hand turn, and then he lets go.
And we're talking full recovery, stretcher, put them onto the boats, get closer to shore to throw them back in a helicopter so we could cross deck them so we could take them to the hospital. Helicopters are awesome until they're not.
Yeah. I wasn't in the helicopter when this one crashed. I had slid down the fast rope and you know, you usually slide down the fast rope and you get out of the position you're supposed to move to. Cause you don't want the next guy coming down on top of you or the helicopter sometimes. Yeah. It's the, uh, the last man I, I hit the deck. And as soon as I hit the deck,
Half a second later, the rope goes, and I was like, whoa, that's abnormal. And then watch the helicopter crash into a canal. Fuck.
You know, there have been two accidents, two fatal accidents in the SEAL teams where the number one guy sitting in the door was kind of holding onto the rope. And as it deployed, somehow it released, but they had their grip on it and it ripped him out of the bird at like 60 feet. Two fatal incidents like that. That's a heavy rope. It's a heavy rope.
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Chapter 6: How do traumatic experiences affect veterans?
Chapter 7: What role does technology play in modern intelligence?
Yeah. I mean, let's put some context into what you're saying, doc. Yeah. So they, they gave me some, some herbs, some prescription drugs. And then the thing that really was the big, big game changer was they gave me a prescription for a hyperbaric oxygen chamber. So I have my own oxygen chamber in my office and I'm about 80 hours into treatments, life-changing.
00,00,00,00,00,00,00,00,00,00,00,00,00,00,00,00,00,00,00,00,00,00,00,00,00,00,00,00,00,00,00,00,00,00,00,00,00,00,00,00,00,00,00,00,00,00,00,00,00,00,00,00,00,00,00,00,00,00,00,00,00,00,00,00,00,00,00,00,00,00,00,00,00,00,00,00,00,00,00,00,00,00,00,00,00,00,00,00,00,00,00,00,00,00,00,00,00,00,00,00,00,00,00,00,00,00,00,00,00,00,00,00, I've actually had that experience. It's just all bad news.
I would wake up and feel relatively chipper and I'd look at my watch or whoop and it would just say, you're a piece of shit. Like you suck. You can't even sleep right. You're prepared for nothing. Your battery's at zero. I'm like, fuck. I'd rather just go through my day not knowing that.
And that's why I don't wear it anymore. Yeah. So. Anyway, I'd say about probably 20 hours into the hyperbaric oxygen. And it's only, dude, it's only diving you down to one and a half atmospheres. Pure O2? Yeah, you're breathing pure O2, but it's pressurized with ambient air. Okay, makes sense.
Because it turns out that you actually don't have to be in 100% oxygen environment, which is a bomb if things go wrong. So it's great, I can sit in there, I can, I can do emails. I've even done a couple of Zoom calls. No shit. Hey, yeah. Yeah. Okay. Yeah. I agree. Right. It's actually great for productivity because you're locked in there. Nobody can bother you.
I do about 90 minutes to two hours at a time. How often? So the first 60 hours, you crank it out as fast as you can. I had a bunch of travel and whatnot, but for the most part, I was doing four hours a day. Could you sleep in that thing if you wanted to? Or is that too much? This is not medical advice at all.
I have a very good friend of mine, PJ, I went through PJ school with, who bought his own chamber. And he actually was the first of the two of us to buy one. And he may have, he's a pilot now, an experimental pilot, and he may have used that to get over jet lag by sleeping in the, sleeping at one atmosphere in a 50% oxygen environment. All right. And said it absolutely was awesome.
I mean, so think about when we used to, allegedly nurse, a hangover with oxygen masks or a drag or whatever that worked really well. So now, now do that is part of kind of your general daily life. And about 20 hours into it, I started dreaming. I hadn't had a dream in 20 years, at least not that I could remember. Again, my whoop was like, you got zero REM sleep.
Like, congratulations, you suck at life so bad you can't even sleep right. And then all of a sudden I'm getting dreams. And so I put the whoop back on, just started using it at night and my sleep scores were I think it's like zero to a hundred is your sleep score. My sleep scores were in the eighties, high eighties. Sometimes they were in the nineties. What'd you start dreaming about?
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