Chapter 1: What is the main topic discussed in this episode?
This is an iHeart Podcast. Guaranteed human. Crime Stories with Nancy Grace. Savannah Guthrie's mother, Nancy Guthrie, missing day 38. This, as we learn, an alleged sighting has been reported. And we find out the latest on Annie Guthrie's car online. Annie Guthrie, Savannah's sister, and Nancy Guthrie's daughter, has been subjected to a lot of torment and accusations online.
About where is her car? Well, tonight, maybe we have an answer. This as Nanos, Sheriff Nanos, is hit with a $1 million lawsuit. Between that and his reality show, is he a little too distracted to find Nancy Guthrie?
Chapter 2: What is the current status of Nancy Guthrie's disappearance?
And can her hearing aids be tracked? Good evening. I'm Nancy Grace. This is Crime Stories. I want to thank you for being with us. She would not wrap her arm around a guy that she suspected in her mother's kidnap? This brother-in-law would not even be living with the family. He would be somewhere else. That family loves him. I think it is tragic. that the family has had yet another assault.
Tonight, we are learning about an alleged sighting of Nancy Guthrie south of the border. Is it real? It cannot be discounted. Joining me, an all-star panel, but first, straight out to Dave Mack, Crime Stories investigative reporter. Dave Mack, what do you know? Nancy, remember when we got the ransom notes that were sent to TMZ? There was the fourth ransom note.
They gave us certain, from TMZ and law enforcement, certain information was given to the public, but not all of it. Now we're finding out that in the fourth missive sent to TMZ, there was an actual claim by the person sending the email that they saw Nancy Guthrie south of the border in Mexico with her alleged kidnappers. This was not a proof of life.
It was merely something added to the email, and it was sent in an effort to get money. Now, TMZ offered to be the go-between, the mediator between this person and law enforcement, and nothing else came from it. But this person claims that he or she saw Nancy Guthrie in Mexico. so many questions about the alleged sighting.
And of course, in every case, when someone goes missing, there are sightings. Sometimes they're true. I recall distinctly a case I had been working and reporting on. It was the case of Dylan and Shasta Groney. They were kidnapped from their home there in Coeur d'Alene.
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Chapter 3: How is Sheriff Nanos's lawsuit affecting the investigation?
Their entire family wiped out and killed because some perv was driving along. And from the highway, Dave Mack, remember this, from the highway, he sees them at an above ground pool that they had in, I guess, their backyard. Pulls over. Who would have thunk it? Lies in wait.
Wipes out the whole family and takes Shasta and little brother Dylan, who he kills after torturing in front of the little girl. And then a sighting occurs like a quick trip or a convenience store. And it's her. She had seen Shasta and Dylan on our show and called it in. and saved Shasta's life. So that's just a true life experience, and there have been many, many others.
This sighting, let's go out to the panel, straight out to Brian Fitzgibbons joining us. Brian is a Director of Operations, USPA, Nationwide Security. Why am I going to him?
Chapter 4: Can Nancy Guthrie's hearing aids be tracked?
Because he leads a team of investigators that are dedicated to finding missing people, including extractions in Mexico, around the world. He is a former Marine and an Iraqi war vet. Okay, we cannot discount this. Obviously, Nanos can't find her in the Catalina Foothills area. Could this be true? What do you do when you get a tip like this? For those of you just joining us, a tip has come in.
Spotting Nancy Guthrie south of the border. Okay, tell me, Brian, what do you do? The first thing that's going to happen here, Nancy, is they're going to try to trace Nanos. to find the source of this tip, whether it came in via email or a cell phone or submitted on a website form. They're going to do everything that they can to find the source and the person that submitted this tip.
Now, I will point out one thing. This tip demanded one Bitcoin, which to me raises an immediate red flag. It was similar to previously reported information asking for one Bitcoin. There's a 1.2 plus million dollar reward out there. Genuine tips at this stage of an investigation are generally asking for that full reward. They're not shortening it down to 50, $60,000 versus 1.2 million.
Law enforcement still will track down the source of this. They'll treat it very seriously, of course. But, you know, I have to say there's a major red flag here in light of that. Well, yeah, there's a red flag. Put up put up his givens. Of course, there's a red flag. Who do you think the kidnapper hangs around with? Nuns and priests and virgins? No, somebody just like him.
So who would have seen Nancy? Likely a cohort, a compatriot of the kidnapper. That said, As you know, Brian, when you get information, you have to take it wherever you get it. I mean, I put people on the stand that I had to explain away an opening statement because of their rap sheet, because of who they are, because of what they did.
It could be any number of things wrong with the informant, but... I've got a problem with going to a news outlet as opposed to police. But, you know, unlike you and I, some people don't like police, believe it or not. As of right now, one Bitcoin is $69,954.
sixty nine thousand nine hundred and fifty four dollars that ain't shabby but back to my original question at the risk of having to repeat myself Fitzgibbons, what do you do when you get a tip? Right. You do something.
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Chapter 5: Is the alleged sighting of Nancy Guthrie in Mexico credible?
You don't ignore it. You have to follow through with it. And what is step number one? Hey, you know what? I have a JD. I have an LLM, but I don't know how to pull teeth. But Jackie, if you could get me a set of pliers, maybe I can right now. What's your first course of action? Explain it.
Yeah, the immediate course of action is going to be a technological search to try to find the source of this tip, to identify the individual, be it an IP address, email, however they're going to go through that, however that tip came in. We don't know the specifics of the method in which it was received, but that's going to be the first Okay, hold on. Maybe we do. Maybe we do.
And if that will help us in our discussion, let me go straight to Dave Mack. We know it was sent to TMZ in email form, correct? What else do we know about it? Was it paired with any other information? Just tell me everything you know. This is one of those things where this is information that we leave out to us of the content of the emails that TMZ was able to retrieve, that was sent.
We know that it was part and parcel of the demand for the ransom money. Remember the Bitcoin, the $6 million? This is the last email TMZ got from the alleged, well, not the kidnapper. This is a sidebar to the kidnapper. This is somebody who claims to know who the kidnapper is and is willing to out that kidnapper, but has yet to do so.
This is that guy or that woman claiming that somehow thinking by saying, yeah, I saw Nancy Guthrie in Mexico is enough proof of life for them, TMZ or law enforcement to cop up a Bitcoin. That's what we know is that there's more information in these notes that have been received by television and TMZ that we don't know yet. There's plenty more. They paraphrased everything.
Well, specifically, it states, quote, I know what I saw five days ago south of the border, and I was told to shut up. So I know who he is, and that was definitely Nancy with them. Now, again, TMZ offered to act as an intermediary. I don't know how the FBI would feel about that. Straight out to the rest of our all-star panel joining us. Hold on. Is there anything else Dave Mack—
you need to tell me before the panel weighs in, anything else about the missive? Was the location narrowed in any way other than just south of the border? And what would south of the border be? But do we know anything else about the missive? No. What we know is that south of the border, it's an assumption that it's just over the border, which is not a good assumption, Nancy.
Somebody crosses the border, they can take off in any direction they want to go. This is merely a vague representation of what this individual claims they saw in an attempt to get some money. That's all it is. And again, there's more to the email that we don't know. We don't know all of the information. This is just another sentence in that email received by TMZ. Okay.
From looking at the map, to me, if you're in Arizona, directly south of the border, of course, is Mexico. Specifically, Sonora to the south, Baja California to the southwest. That's what I am assuming they're referring to. There's also Rocky Point. That's Puerto Penasco. And I'm just looking along the border to see what else they could possibly be referring to. Straight out to...
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Chapter 6: What challenges do investigators face with tips and sightings?
Crime Stories with Nancy Grace. To Scott Eicher joining us, former FBI, now at Precision Cellular Analysis. They have to break down the car. By the way, thanks, Fox News, for this video. They have to break down the car. Basically, take it apart. Take out the seats. Look under the seats. They have to wet. They have to vac.
The carpet, the upholsterer, I'm talking about MVAC for DNA, looking for DNA that is invisible to the naked eye. They're looking for fibers. They're looking for hair. They're looking for minuscule amounts of blood or some other sort of DNA. They may even be looking for soil, soil where Nancy may have been sitting. We don't know what they were looking for.
But I do know the car has to be totally broken down. Explain about breaking down a car and performing that type of search. It's meticulous. It is meticulous. And you have to think about, all right, what type of case are we looking at? Are we looking at a car that has compartments that you're hiding drugs in it? Well, you've seen that all the time is they tear up that car pretty bad.
I mean, they're ripping out the dashboard, they're ripping out everything. In this case, I wouldn't think they're doing that much damage to the car. They might get under some of the door panels, break some of those little plastic things when they're taking off the door panels to make sure they get everything, the DNA, the hair, the fibers, everything.
But it shouldn't be that much damage to this type of car if all we have is that she was later brought home in that car before she went missing. So it gives me a red flag that they've kept this car so long. It does not give me a red flag because look how long the DNA analysis is taking.
When you take down, when you take apart a car like that, for all I know, they were using the tires to make casts. If you look at some of the original photos, I know the driveway is gravel, partially gravel, but a couple of aerial views did show tracks right after the kidnapping. This is from our friends at 12 News.
For all I know, they were making casts of those tracks, comparing them to the vehicle. Just a lot goes into that. And isn't it true, Brian Fitzgibbons joining us Then in order to make casts, think of your arm being put in a cast, right? How long that takes and it has to solidify. That's very much like making a cast of a tire. You have to surround it.
Just pretend paper mache, that's an easy way to describe it, or clay. Then you have to remove it, let it dry, and then start comparing it. If they decide there's anything to it, if there is a lead, if it matches, for instance, or possibly matches, you have to keep the vehicle. You can't give it back because it is now going to be state's evidence.
So a lot goes in to analyzing a vehicle in a situation like this because if you miss something, technical legal term, you're screwed. Yeah, absolutely. And, you know, as you're mentioning, these things all take time and may require specialized teams to come in and actually assess and analyze the evidence or potential evidence that's inside that vehicle. And I'll add one thing.
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