Chapter 1: What is the main topic discussed in this episode?
This is an iHeart Podcast. Guaranteed human. Crime Stories with Nancy Grace. Savannah Guthrie's mother, Nancy Guthrie, missing day 41. The very latest in the search for Nancy Guthrie, an 84-year-old beloved grandmother. Plus, do we have a motive? If we have a motive, can we ID the kidnapper? Straight out to Dave Mack, Crime Stories investigative reporter. What about it, Dave?
Nancy, we know that over the last couple of weeks, there have been zero press conferences done by Sheriff Nanos.
Chapter 2: What is the latest update on Nancy Guthrie's disappearance?
But he has talked to some media one on one, not really having to answer questions, just softball stuff for him to share what he's thinking. And he actually Sheriff Nanos actually came out with some stuff on the NBC nightly news that. was actually pretty scary, scary for the community, scary for all of us who have been watching this story unfold. But here is Sheriff Nanos on NBC Nightly News.
We believe we know why he did this and we believe that it was targeted, but we can't, we're not 100% sure of that. And so it'd be silly to tell people, yeah, don't worry about it. You're not his target. Don't think for a minute that because it happened to the Guthrie family, you're safe. No, keep your wits about you. So Nanos is now saying we believe he was targeted.
Chapter 3: Is there a motive behind Nancy Guthrie's kidnapping?
We know the motive. Nobody is safe. But that's it. Not giving us any specifics. I guess the biggest problem we have with all of this is... Why is it that after this long of a period of time are we just now telling everybody you're not safe?
We thought from the very beginning targeted going after Nancy Guthrie, the obvious connection to her daughter Savannah being very high profile with the Today Show, being local in Tucson for a number of weeks prior to the kidnapping.
Chapter 4: What insights does the investigative reporter provide about the case?
I mean, there was a lot going on here that was all very, very specific information. to Nancy Guthrie. Now, even though Sheriff Nanos is not telling us there's anything specific, but saying that others could be at risk, that's a shocking beginning to the news.
One has to wonder if Nanos is using this as an opportunity to take some of the attention away from the resume and why he left El Paso back in the day. It's all I can think of.
Now to Brian Fitzgibbons joining us, Director of Operations, USPA, Nationwide Security, leading a team of investigators around the world, including extractions from Mexico, finding missing people, former Marine, Iraqi War vet. Brian, weigh in. I like to separate signal from noise, meaning on radio traffic, you get good signal and then you get noise that clutters that message from coming in.
I have to interpret this as noise coming from Sheriff Nanos. He's made statements in the past that have gone hot across the presses and then he's walked them back time and again. This isn't yet another one that's very confusing to say we have a motive. The public isn't safe. Yet earlier he said this was targeted. directly to Nancy. So if we take it at face value, this is very concerning, right?
Because it means that there's an individual or a group of individuals that are directly targeting wealthy, elderly citizens in the greater Tucson area. I don't believe that that was Nanos' intention. My hope is that he misspoke and that this didn't come across correctly, but hey, there's no playbook for what Nanos has been saying here.
It seems like he's shooting from the hip in these press releases and in these media engagements and causing quite a bit of confusion with the public. And Brian, one of the things that we have been following all along,
blood deposition on the front entryway and inside the house but the security of this site from the very beginning we know that uh when nancy guthrie's family shows up to check on her okay they came going to assume they came into the home they didn't just stand outside in the driveway and say oh we don't see mom so we know that they went into the house we probably can assume a neighbor or two was there as well you know as they were trying to figure out where she was but
The scene was not secured after 24 hours. We even know that a pizza delivery guy showed up at the front door. How corrupt is the DNA or how usable will it be as this investigation moves forward? Because Nanos is suggesting the case will be broken by DNA. Chain of evidence on the DNA on the front porch. What's going to happen with all of this?
You know, I have to, if we take a step back, you know, most crime scenes aren't secure for some period of time. Uh, after a crime's committed, right? Until police arrive and actually get a hold on that scene and put up a perimeter to keep the public out. Now, in this case, you're spot on, right? They had the scene. They released the scene. Then you had days of nobody there.
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Chapter 5: How secure was the crime scene during the initial investigation?
Because there's a lot easier ways to get in that house than that front door, which had a double gate on the front, the side door, the back door, around the pool. There's a lot of other ways to do this than actually going in that front door. That was covered very well. Robin Dreek, behavioral analysis expert and former FBI.
What do you make of the porch guy, the perp's behavior on the front porch and how that relates to an Internet outage in the neighborhood? would he be able to tell that was still connected to Wi-Fi or just connected to power? Because if he's trying to take down the Wi-Fi in the neighborhood, it's still, again, it's a hard thing to assess on the front step.
And here's the other thing that I think is important for people to also take in. You're looking at limited data from the neighbor who said they lost connectivity to their own ring camera that night at that time. Okay.
Have they looked at the pattern of behavior, how often that ring camera loses connectivity over the course of a day, a week, a month to see if it actually fit a pattern or if it was an enigma or a blip.
So data points are great if you're actually doing them and looking for an arc of behavior between technology as well as human behavior, because if it's a blip, then it's something to pay attention to. If it's just another data point that is completely normal, it might not pan out. Robin Drake, I hear what you're saying right there.
And while you were talking, I was reassessing what you said about the perp going into Nancy Guthrie's home, A, as retribution against Nancy Guthrie. I still think that's completely bogus. That's crap right there. Forget that. Just mark that off my list of possibilities. But you did say going in for a specific item and that they spent 41 minutes looking for the item.
And I took it to mean some secret item nobody else knew about. But actually, you might be right. What if a granny nanny told her son, the black sheep's son, that Miss Guthrie has jewelry hidden in a certain spot in her home or keeps, you know, $10,000 cash taped to the bottom of the bed? I don't know. Something like that. An item of value in that home. and it leaked to someone.
I can go with you that far, Robin, that they went in for a specific item, but then taking Nancy Guthrie with them, they were in full disguise. So taking Nancy Guthrie with them, she can't walk over 50 yards. She has all sorts of health issues. They should just go in and get it and leave. With that scenario, that's where you lose me. Why would they take her with them if this were not a kidnapping?
Kidnapping for ransom. And the whole retribution thing as a motive against her for what? She screwed up the knitting circle? No.
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Chapter 6: What role does DNA evidence play in the investigation?
And retribution against Savannah Guthrie or her husband? This is pretty far-fetched. I'm going to kidnap your mom. Because you said X during the Today Show or because your husband worked for fill in the blank and then never take credit for it and explain why it's retribution. None of that makes any sense to me. It's very fantastical. But everything's on the table tonight.
Crime Stories with Nancy Grace. Tonight, a vandalized, cracked, wide-open utility box is taking center stage. Straight out to Dave Mack, Crime Stories investigative reporter. Dave, why?
because this utility box that shows really vandalism, it shows a lot of vandalism, but Nancy, this utility box right there, you got to realize this brings in phone, fiber optic cable, which by the way, that's how many of us use the internet. This box is being tied to possibly an internet outage that was happening in the neighborhood At the time, we believe Nancy Guthrie was kidnapped.
This utility box is just around the corner from her home next to the neighbor's home that sees into Nancy Guthrie's backyard. Nancy, we've got a lot going on with this box and the possibility that internet connectivity was blacked out for a brief period of time the night Nancy Guthrie disappeared.
The video we're showing you right now is from our friends at WCNC, this utility box near Nancy Guthrie's home. Okay, straight out to our guest, an all-star panel, James Bass joining us. James is a digital forensic analyst, expert witness with Evidence Solutions, Inc. there in Tucson. James Bass, thank you for being with us. What do you make of it? Let's take a look at this video again.
A utility box. pried open and vandalized at the time Nancy Guthrie goes missing, what would this have to do with the blackout experienced by, we know, two neighbors of Nancy Guthrie's? By the way, this video from our friends at WCNC. What about it, James? Well, not exactly sure that these two could be connected.
Looking at the utility box, the way it's set up and the wires that are in it, they appear that they are likely just your regular telephone wires, your telephone infrastructure. That would not affect your Wi-Fi. I would assume that most folks now interact. Put him up, please. I want to see the utility box. James, granted, I'm just a trial lawyer. You're the digital expert.
How can you look at this tangle of wires and tell me, oh, it's nothing but phone wires. And then to me, I don't understand how you know that by looking at that. that it's just phone wires. I mean, doesn't a lot of fiber optics include phone, your cable, your Wi-Fi connection? And again, thanks to WCNC for this. But what do you mean they're just phone wires?
I didn't think there even were just phone wires anymore. Well, the wires are still there and the infrastructure is still there. It still supports a lot of what we do today. Your fiber optic... is a fiber optic cable. Your phones would have three or four pairs that are connected in that junction box. It looks like spaghetti.
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