In this week’s Flightless bird, David looks at the American prison system, attempting to understand why the US has the largest prison population in the world - with around 1.9 million people incarcerated here. He interviews Bianca Tylek of national advocacy group “Worth Rises” about problems in the prison system, and meets Robert Craig, associate director at Abolish Private Prisons. He then travels to San Diego to meet Alana McMains, an attorney who mainly focuses on federal criminal defense. Farrier also talks to Jared Klickstein about his book “Crooked Smile”, as well as Rob’s dad! LIVE SHOWS: -Portland on April 13: https://www.etix.com/ticket/p/80185968/flightless-bird-with-david-farrier-portland-revolution-hall -San Fransisco on April 18: https://www.ticketmaster.com/flightless-bird-live-with-david-farrier-san-francisco-california-04-18-2025/event/1C0062589BAC1D9F Links: Worth Rises: https://worthrises.org/ Abolish Private Prisons: https://www.abolishprivateprisons.org/ Jared Klickstein and his book: https://www.jaredklickstein.com/ Feedback and suggestions: [email protected] Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices
Chapter 1: What are the main issues with the American prison system?
I liked it too. I'd put like True Blood in a similar place. True Blood had like a bit more class. No, it didn't. You don't think it did? Well, I don't know. How much do we want to shit publicly on a show?
Oh, well, we're not here to show, but I mean, we can, I mean, that can take it. Also, can I just say True Buds starred New Zealander Anna Paquin. I didn't realize she was New Zealander. Actually, she is. I'm sure she is. She better not be Australian. I'm just double checking this. Let's see. She's a Canadian-born New Zealand actor. Wow. Wow.
I couldn't stop watching it, but also, like, I don't look back at that being, yeah, great. But Prison Break was the same. I watched, I was really into Prison Break when it came out.
Prison Break, just quickly, just on True Blood, was that Alan Ball who did, I believe, Six Feet Under? Yeah. I'm just going to check because Six Feet Under is my favorite show of all time. Yeah. So he created True Blood and Six Feet Under. Wow. One of the most amazing shows and one of just a very different style. Yeah.
But Prison Break I loved because the end of every episode, every episode was a cliffhanger. And that was unreal. Do you remember the premise? He went into prison. He got locked up so he could break his older, bulkier brother out. And he tattooed a map of the prison on his back and like a very elaborate tattoo that wasn't a map. But it was a map.
That's the gist, right? Yeah, that's exactly what I remember from it.
And it was on his back. How did he reference the map? Like, he looked in the mirror? I can't even remember.
I don't either, but I do remember the tattoos. And spoiler alert.
They get out. They get out, but then... They get arrested in, like, Mexico? Yeah, and locked up in another prison. Yeah, yeah. That tattoo is no good in the Mexican jail.
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Chapter 2: Why does the US have the largest prison population?
And I assume I can't take this recording device in, or can I sneak it in?
I do not believe so.
At least we'll find out. Yeah. We check in with the guard, then go through a metal detector. I get a stamp on my hand, just like I'm going into a concert. Weirdly, I can't see any marking and wonder if it's out of ink. I think for a moment I'm going to be able to record inside, but no.
No, okay, we can put that in the locker. Okay, just a laptop. Thank you.
Okay, thank you. No worries. Okay, no recording devices. That's okay.
It's like a security blanket saying goodbye.
It is. Goodbye, recorder. Recording gear, phone, wallet and key stored in a locker. We wait for about 20 minutes before they fetch a client. We sit in a narrow, unglamorous corridor before being called in. Then it's more corridors, and I scan my hand under a sensor. Turns out the stamp was infrared. We're buzzed through one door, then that door locks behind us and another door opens.
We're directed to a room where we sit and wait for Jeff. When he enters, he's uncuffed and in prison scrubs. I've never visited anyone in prison before. We have our own private room, it's just us. A million TV shows and true crime podcasts flood into my head because that's my only point of reference. We talk to Jeff for about 30 minutes.
That's mostly me asking dumb questions, but there's also some time where Alana discusses the case. I'm not sure what I expected, but Jeff is polite, informed, and really funny. He's missing his girlfriend and his kid. He's aware he fucked up. Now he's just waiting for his court date. Towards the end, the walls do feel like they're closing in, and by the time we're outside, I'm glad.
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