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Chapter 1: What is the main topic discussed in this episode?
What we just have to call Thomas Grant's erotica. Thomas Grant's erotica.
Corsi.
Thomas Grant's erotica. Expected goals. Thomas Grant's erotica. Dog bottle. Thomas Grant's Veronica. Russian. Thomas Grant's Veronica. PDO. Thomas Grant's Veronica.
801. On a Thursday. Happy Thursday, everybody. Halford Brough, Sportsnet 650. Halford Brough in the morning is brought to you by Sands & Associates. They're open seven days a week and open late to help you get debt-free with no judgment or upfront fees. Visit them today at sands-trustee.com. We are now in Hour 3 of the program.
As the music suggests, Thomas Drance from The Athletic Vancouver and Canucks Talk is going to join us in just a moment here to kick off Hour 3. This hour of the show was brought to you by the BC Construction Safety Alliance. Making safety simpler by giving construction companies the best in tools, resources, and safety training. Visit them online at bccsa.ca.
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Let's go now to the Able Auctions hotline. As mentioned, our next guest is from the Athletic Vancouver and Canucks talk right here on Sportsnet 650. It's Thomas Drance on the Halford and Brough show. What up, Drancer? Gentlemen, good morning. Good morning to you. Are you excited about being on this day, NHL Draft Eve?
Yeah, always. I mean, it's an exciting time of year. I'm usually looking forward to getting through it, especially by this point. But yeah, I mean, one week to go, you think about all the news that is likely to break, not just for the Canucks, but around the league. And obviously, it's already been head spinning in terms of the magnitude of the deals we've seen. But yeah,
You know, we got two days of the draft coming up tomorrow. The next day, Ryan Johnson's going to speak in. what, an hour here, always the possibility that you get additional news, signings, trades, extensions, and then qualifying offer deadline, development camp opens for the Canucks on Monday. I mean, this is the busiest part of the year. So, yeah, I mean, this is what we do it for.
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Chapter 2: What insights does Thomas Drance share about the Canucks on NHL Draft Eve?
And honestly, it's not even the guys that have say over where they go to some extent. Right. I mean, the Bowen Byram price emerges because that team had the freedom to create an auction environment, the Buffalo Sabres, and did so expertly. Kudos to them. But there's also a contractual angle there. Right. Byram wasn't eligible for an NTC NMC contract. That's what creates that sort of price demand.
And, you know, even if you're talking about Philip Ronick, yes, he is the Canucks only premium asset here. I also think you have to recognize that, you know, NHL trade values effectively set by multiple factors. One of them is quality, the quality of the player.
But another massive factor is demand, is that ability to create the sort of environment where in order to get the player, teams have to spend the sort of trade price that Chicago ultimately ponied up this week.
We were talking about this earlier in the show, and with reports that the Canucks might be willing to retain salary on Elias Pettersson, Yeah. Are, do you think they're going to operate around the salary cap floor for the next few years? And maybe that's a way to convince ownership to retain on Pedersen as in like, Hey, you got to reach this, you got to reach this level anyway.
So, you know, why not do it this way?
Maybe, maybe, you know, I do think like the value of the cap space is minimal and from the perspective of what the team could use it to do otherwise, right?
It's not like you're going to be able to go out and sign a Pew suitor caliber top nine guy with the ability to play center for one and a half million in August, because no teams have the space to offer him, you know, three and a half times three, right? Like that's, that big environment's dead. And when that environment dies, like retaining 1.5 to 3 million on Pedersen is not an issue.
For me, the far bigger issue in retaining on him is losing the retention slot. Yes. Because that's going to make it harder to sell and net the sort of value you need. And, you know, I think we've seen a lot of, signs of how the league is about to move, of how different this market's going to look.
And I think the volume of trades has been a big part of that, but I also think the volume of draft picks moved has been a major part of that. Liquid capital has been, you know, what teams are after here, right? The Florida Panthers are clearly the best example, right? Where they monetize effectively, like a young player is trending pretty well. Yeah.
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Chapter 3: What are the latest developments in Canucks trades and signings?
Yeah, I mean, they kind of have a full lineup. Yeah. And so, you know, that's regrettable because one of the issues or one of the benefits, I suppose, of existing in a world without win-now competitive pressure is that you can... place some of those, you know, what bets remain on some of those guys that like haven't quite broken through at 24, 25.
Now it's important that you don't trade like a litany of thirds and fourths for them the way that the Canucks did 10 years ago. But, you know, there's still like your Raphael Lavoie caliber guys who, you know, six foot four and fast and like he hasn't quite broken out and he's maybe nothing, but Also for you, you can just bring him to camp and see what you've got.
And maybe you can build value out of that. And especially if he takes advantage of the opportunity, the Canucks just kind of aren't set up to do these sorts of things. I guess the other example that I'd use would be like the penguins, you know, where you like do those tear down things like they did with Jari and Skinner.
And then you keep getting paid for the asset or what the sharks did with Jake Wallman would be another one. Now in the case of the Wallman deal, that was like free. That's, that's a cap. constraint issue that's a path that's not going to exist, but the logic of gambling on a guy out of favor with another organization.
Because your roster's lean, you have opportunity to plug him into a bigger role. Because he's better than the other team valued him as, he will build XYZ value, and then you turn that into an asset. That's the path that I think the Canucks need to be conscious of trying to open up here. It's not necessarily about finding your version of that right now, but I do think you need to...
subtract from this roster in part because you'll want to be able to speculate in that market if you're going to create value what is the value of having um veteran defensemen playing with a younger defenseman because i think a lot of people yeah do like the idea of zeve bullion being paired for example with a guy like philip haronic and um heck yeah You know, it's one of those things.
I mean, we have talked about, and I know I believe you have written about, you know, how important player development is going to be. You know, the drafting has become more efficient than it was 10, 15, 20 years ago. Like, there's more information out there. People are getting better at...
deciphering that information so it's going to be harder and harder to find those diamonds in the rough and in the fifth and the sixth round there's they'll still be some but i think it's going to be yeah tougher to find those so maybe not we're the only scouts that saw pavel datsuk play because there was a storm yeah exactly that's that that doesn't exist anymore yeah i mean with the even just the the streaming capabilities i mean you can stream whatever game you want in in the world and
including like the Seafair U11 team, right? Like you can do whatever you want, right? So teams are going to have to separate themselves with player development. And, you know, part of player development is putting these young guys, once they get into the NHL, in a position to succeed. So, you know, you don't have them out there, two young guys together on a pair or a young player with...
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Chapter 4: How is the Canucks' strategy evolving in the current NHL landscape?
You've got to make sure you're an appealing place to stay and commit to and associate with.
Especially going forward. Especially going forward now with...
Like, oh, you can just ask out? I didn't know that. You can ask out coming off your ELC, like Nemech was just like, guys, no. No more of this. Byram's 25. We're not talking about your 28-year-olds. We're not talking about your pending UFAs anymore either. Kachuk had two years left on his deal. Quinn Hughes had a year and a half left on his deal. Like,
Dylan Larkin has five years left on his deal. I mean, yeah, this is a new sort of partnership that you have to make with your players. And at least to some extent. in time, once you've got the blue chip face of the franchise level guys, you're on the clock immediately once you're lucky enough to land that player.
I want to put this to you because then it becomes a very delicate situation because you have to be brutally honest with yourself about the young players that you've got in your lineup. are these the guys? Right. Are these real, are these really the guys or are you just making them the guys because they're the guys that you have? Yeah.
And I mean, I think you're seeing that with like Carolina indication, right? Like the ruthlessness that you have to bring to the table. in terms of self-evaluation, I think, yeah, I think there's a huge premium to that now, uh, breath. Like, I think that's a really, a really good point.
And, and just to circle this back and sort of tie it up with a bow in terms of the heronic leadership mentorship conversation, right? Like fundamentally the cost benefit analysis, I think you have to ask is like, do we have the guys now? If no, what's a reasonable timeframe we're going to need to accumulate those guys, right? Let's say three to four years, maybe five, right. In terms of the right.
So, okay. So if we're coming out of this cycle in year five, six, seven, what age is Philip Ronick going to be? And is he going to be a more useful piece to accelerate what we're doing then, right? When it really starts to matter for us, or is the assets that we can get for him now more likely to be those guys, right? And to me, that's the question.
Because while I hugely value the mentorship of star players, you know, at least to some extent, I think you have to be clear-eyed about... the fact that that mentorship is going to be at a premium in like three, four years, as opposed to right now.
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Chapter 5: What challenges does the Canucks organization face in their rebuild?
So there's a huge range of outcomes when you look at sort of the top three guys that are still very, very possible. So I would say like, what I don't think you'd necessarily have, what I think is likely you do not have is the dude capital D, right? Like, I don't think you have your, I don't even think you have your stank open, right. Or, or, or something like something at that tier.
And I certainly don't think you have your like Barkov analogy. So it's like, for me, that's sort of the level of player you still need to go get in this rebuild. You still need to identify and acquire, but I think you've got some guys who could be like the third or fourth best player
player on a really great team down the line so you know they're not bereft i'd call their prospect system slightly below average today but after they make 10 picks including four in the top 41 they'll probably be on the fringes of the top 10 something like that in the nhl so work to be done but um they're not bereft it's just that they don't have the top end guys yet they'll get one on friday
All right, Drance, very exciting time in the world of sports. Do you have time to get into the World Cup?
Oh, yeah, always.
Okay. What did you think about the loss?
We were exchanging texts, Drance and I, in the wake of the Ismail Kone injury.
Oh, okay.
I was trying to come up with an adequate replacement.
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Chapter 6: How does the team plan to create value during the rebuild?
Oh, God, this is always dead.
It's what we learn, time. It's what we learn time. It's what we learn time. On the show.
831 on a Thursday. Happy Thursday, everybody. Halford Brough, Sportsnet 650. Halford Brough for the morning is brought to you by Sands & Associates. They're ready to give you the financial fresh start you deserve. With no judgment or upfront fees, visit them at sands-trustee.com. We are in Hour 3 of the program. It is what we learn time. Hour 3 is brought to you by the B.C.
Construction Safety Alliance. Making safety simpler by giving construction companies the best in tools, resources, and safety training. Visit them at bccsa.ca. Not bad. Not bad. You got what we learned. I got what we learned.
Yeah, I do. This might be a funny way of saying it, but what I learned is that Connor McDavid has provided consent to have Mike Babcock coach the Edmonton Oilers. He had an exclusive interview with Mark Spector of Sportsnet.ca, and McDavid said, the definition of insanity is trying the same thing over and over again and expecting a different result. Babs is different.
He gives us a different personality, a different approach to our group, an approach that we probably have never had. We've tried it the same way for a really long time. Let's try it different.
And I really look forward to him judging my amateur photography.
You're still trying to make that one happen, are you? Sort of make that a bit. McDavid went on to say, everybody in that room is going to have to sacrifice themselves. I think it just means, not to the gods of Mike Babcock, but just sacrifice. Everyone's got to take a little bit less so everybody can take a little bit more. Now, it's interesting because Speck noted that Babcock was,
told the media, if you're going to have success, all you have to do is watch what happened in this year's playoffs. Everybody on that team's got to be important. Right down to the guys that don't play every single night. And the more depth you create, and the more they feel important, the better chance you have to have success. So...
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Chapter 7: What lessons can be learned from past Canucks management decisions?
We want to push those guys, and we want him lifting up everybody else. That's what he's here to do. Very interesting dynamic in Edmonton, and I will be fascinated to see if it works. Muka.
Well, I learned that Minnesota Wild owner Craig Leopold has guaranteed that they're going to re-sign Quinn Hughes. I might be overstating it a tad, but let's go now to Minnesota Public Radio. This is from Wednesday's interview with MPR. What? Minnesota Public Radio. That's what it's called.
And now we're going to welcome Minnesota Wild General Manager Bill Guerin to the program.
You messed up the bit. The bit would have been because it's MPR, Minnesota Public Radio. How should you have delivered that line?
Don't force me to do an accent.
Do it. Do it.
I can't do it. I'm not on the spot. Do it. Do it. Just play the clip.
First of all, Quinn Hughes is an extraordinary player and an extraordinary person. We had to give up a lot to get him in this past year. We are going to re-sign him. The question will be for how long. We would like to go as long as we could. He would probably want it to be a little shorter, shorter being maybe three years. We hopefully will end up at five. I don't know.
And the reason I can openly talk about this is that I'm not doing the negotiating.
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Chapter 8: What are the prospects for the Canucks' young players moving forward?
I mean, it's a good hockey market and it's a big market, but always been a very boring kind of an afterthought team that has really changed over the last four or five years. And if Hughes locks on now, you did hear in that clip, Leopold did say, you know, Hughes probably wants to go shorter term, like a three-year deal. We would like him to go longer.
So we're not any guarantee of how long this is going to be. But if Hughes does re-up in Minnesota, it's, I wonder if that gets the potential of getting the brothers in Minnesota as opposed to New Jersey, where we already thought. And I do wonder if other guys will jump on board and decide they want to be in Minnesota and join the Minnesota Wild. Anyway, not done yet.
Do you think Quinn and Jack would just be like, yeah, we got another brother, but he's okay.
Yeah.
Yeah.
We don't have to get them to the same team. We don't all have to play. You can get some of us together. They had two stalls in one place before. They didn't need all three stalls in one place. So, yeah, I don't know. I'll be curious to see how that turns out. Anyway, mook out. Bye, I'm The Dot Matrix.
Humanite submissions for what we learned brought to you as always by AJ's Pizza on East Broadway. From corporate events to special events, there's no order too large. Order online at ajs.pizza.
This one's from Tyler. What we learned. How many players are getting a burner phone that they can show Babcock preloaded with stock family portraits? It's just happy family portraits. He's like, all of these have a Getty watermark. That's weird. Paul in the Okanagan.
I noticed everyone has a different race than you as well. I don't think you guys... You didn't select very well. You got to be more patient.
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