There's a tradition around many Thanksgiving dinner tables that's as consistent as stuffing and pumpkin pie: the family stories that get told year after year. Sometimes these stories are funny; sometimes they make us roll our eyes. No matter how we feel about these tales, we rarely pause to consider how they shape who we are and how we view the world. This week, we talk to psychologist Robyn Fivush about the profound impact that family stories can have on our lives. If you enjoyed today's conversation, here are more Hidden Brain episodes you might like:Healing 2.0: Change Your Story, Change Your Life The Story of Your LifeRewinding & RewritingThanks for listening!
Chapter 1: What family story shaped Shankar's view of life?
Today's episode is brought to you by T-Mobile for Business. This is Hidden Brain. I'm Shankar Vedantam. Many years ago, when I was a child, my mother told me a family story. It had to do with her brother, my uncle. He was an extremely creative man with varied interests in books and music and art. He could also be a little, how shall I put this, disorganized.
My uncle was the kind of person who was always ready to reminisce, and he was an amazing storyteller. He could spin the tiniest events into funny stories that had you laughing until you cried. Anyway, the story my mother told me had to do with my uncle's wedding day.
On his way to the wedding venue, my uncle suddenly remembered he had forgotten to invite a dear friend and fellow storyteller, his barber. So he took a detour and went to the barber shop to make sure his friend came to the wedding. When he got to the shop, the barber was busy with his customers and asked my uncle to wait while he finished.
My uncle happily settled down and he and the barber traded funny stories as the scissors went snip-snip. All this time, of course, the guests at the wedding and the prospective bride were getting increasingly alarmed. Had something happened to the groom? Had he gotten cold feet? Was the marriage called off?
When my uncle finally showed up, his barber triumphantly in tow, he had no idea why everyone was upset. I've always loved that story because it perfectly captured my uncle's attitude toward life. Live in the moment, be present. Deadlines and appointments can wait.
This week on Hidden Brain, we explore the world of family stories, how these stories shape who we become, and the fascinating science that demonstrates why telling certain kinds of stories can make us happier, healthier, and better people. Cultures around the world have occasions that are designed for people to gather, chat, and reminisce.
This can happen on birthdays, on anniversaries, and at funerals. Family members remind each other about the ties that bind them together. Disputes break out over half-remembered events from decades ago. At Emory University, psychologist Robin Fyvush studies the psychological effects these stories can have on our lives. Robin Fyvush, welcome to Hidden Brain.
Thank you. I'm so privileged to be here. I really am looking forward to this interview.
Robin, when you were very young, your family was struck by two terrible tragedies, more or less simultaneously. It changed the course of your life. Can you tell me what happened?
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Chapter 2: How do family stories influence our well-being?
Dave was 14, and he talked about this story where his mother was also in junior high or middle school, and she was at the school bus stop, and she overheard one kid bullying this other little boy. And she went up to him, and this is the story that Dave tells.
She went up to him, and she said, stop bullying that kid, even though she was really scared herself and was afraid of what the bully would do to her. And the bully said, what's it to you? And she said, it's not right. And so the bully hauled off and hit her. And then he comes back. He said, but my mother, you know, she didn't even realize her nose was broken.
But she went to the hospital and indeed her nose got broken. And that was just such a courageous thing for my mom to do, to stand up to a bully like that. And the coda of the story, and this is really critical, too. is, and it really taught me how important it is to stand up to bullies. So Dave is putting himself in his mother's shoes, in her head. What is she thinking? What is she saying?
How is she feeling? And that even though she was scared, she did it anyway. So it really is this lovely model of what it means to be morally courageous, that he's internalizing.
I mean, he's essentially saying, my mother could be courageous when she was 14. I can too.
The developmental age matching, I think, is important because every child that age thinks their parent doesn't understand them and never went through anything like this. But this is she's like me. And of course, parents are identity figures. I'm like her.
Stories are not just stories. They are sophisticated tools that humans use to pass on values, norms, and the complex contours of relationships. In family settings, stories can be engines of meaning, identity, and purpose. When we come back, how we can start to tell better stories. You're listening to Hidden Brain. I'm Shankar Vedantam. This is Hidden Brain. I'm Shankar Vedantam.
Robin Fyvush is a psychologist at Emory University who studies family stories. She's found that intergenerational storytelling has a wide range of psychological benefits that range from increased resilience to higher self-esteem.
Robin, you and your colleague Marshall Duke have theorized that there are three types of family stories and that one of these three is the most predictive of positive outcomes. What are these three types of stories, Robin?
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