Insights Unlocked
Mastering UX research: from analysis to actionable insights with Steve Portigal
Mon, 04 Nov 2024
Episode web page ----------------------- Rate Insights Unlocked and write a review If you appreciate Insights Unlocked, please give it a rating and a review. Visit Apple Podcasts, pull up the Insights Unlocked show page and scroll to the bottom of the screen. Below the trailers, you'll find Ratings and Reviews. Click on a star rating. Scroll down past the highlighted review and click on "Write a Review." You'll make my day. ----------------------- Show Notes In this episode of Insights Unlocked, we sit down with Steve Portigal, a seasoned user researcher, author, and host of the Dollars to Donuts podcast, to discuss how the field of user research has evolved over the past 20 years. Steve shares his unique perspective on the significant changes that have shaped the industry, from the rise of in-house research teams to the impact of remote work on research methodologies. He also delves into the crucial difference between analysis and synthesis in research and offers practical advice for improving research outcomes. Whether you’re a new researcher or a seasoned expert, Steve’s insights will help you navigate the dynamic and sometimes challenging world of UX research. Key Themes and Ideas: The Growth of User Research: Steve reflects on how user research has grown from a niche, obscure practice to a well-established community of professionals. This growth has led to increased knowledge sharing through conferences, books, meetups, and podcasts, creating a stronger foundation for collective learning and debate. The Shift from Agencies to In-House Research Teams: One of the biggest shifts Steve discusses is the transition from research being outsourced to agencies and consultants to now being managed by in-house teams. While this change has brought research closer to the core of business decisions, it has also altered the dynamics of advocacy and how researchers communicate findings within organizations. The Impact of Remote Work and Research: With the rise of remote work, especially during the pandemic, remote research has become the default method. While this has expanded opportunities for inclusion and collaboration, Steve cautions that the loss of in-person interactions may limit researchers' ability to fully understand user behaviors and experiences. The Importance of Synthesis in Research: Steve emphasizes the often-overlooked distinction between analysis and synthesis in research. While analysis involves breaking down information, synthesis requires recombining that data into new insights and frameworks that can drive innovation. Steve provides tips on how researchers can improve their synthesis process by allowing time for deeper exploration and collaboration. Practical Advice for New Researchers: For those new to the field, Steve encourages embracing the growing community of UX researchers. He suggests seeking mentorship, engaging in networking, and experimenting with different ways of participating in the community, whether through writing, podcasts, or small peer groups. Looking Ahead: The Future of Research-Led Companies: Steve offers a thought-provoking idea about the possibility of research-led companies emerging in the future. He imagines a world where research isn’t just a service within organizations but a driving force behind product and service innovation. Episode Links: Steve Portigal’s Books: Interviewing Users and Doorbells, Danger, and Dead Batteries Dollars to Donuts Podcast Discount Code for Interviewing Users: Use "UNLOCKED" at checkout on Rosenfeld Media for 10% off Steve's Website LinkedIn
Chapter 1: What is the main topic of this episode?
Welcome back to the Insights Unlocked podcast. In this episode, we're talking with UX research expert and author Steve Portigal about moving beyond analysis to synthesis, turning data into actionable insights that drive real change.
We'll explore Steve's tips for communicating findings that stick with stakeholders and dive into the impact of remote work and in-house teams on the future of UX research and customer experience. Enjoy the show.
Welcome to Insights Unlocked, an original podcast from User Testing, where we bring you candid conversations and stories with the thinkers, doers, and builders behind some of the most successful digital products and experiences in the world, from concept to execution.
Welcome to the Insights Unlocked podcast. I'm Nathan Isaacs, Senior Manager for Content Production at UserTesting. And joining us today as host is UserTesting's Leah Hogan, Principal for Experience Research Strategy. Welcome to the show, Leah.
Thank you. Hi, everyone.
And our guest today is Steve Portigal. Steve is an experienced user researcher who helps companies harness the strategic power of insights. He's the author of two books, the classic Interviewing Users, How to Uncover Compelling Insights and Doorbells, Danger and Dead Batteries, User Research War Stories.
He's also the host of the Dollars to Donuts podcast, where he interviews people who lead user research in their organizations. Welcome to the show, Steve.
Hi, everyone. Thank you so much for having me.
Great. I'm so thrilled to be getting a chance to have this conversation with you, Steve. And where I really wanted to start is just. Actually, because of where it is that you've been in the world of UX, user research, over the past more than 20 years, you've had, I think, a unique perspective on how the industry has changed, how the practice has changed from earlier on until now.
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Chapter 2: How has user research evolved over the past 20 years?
And now I think that that change has even accelerated, if possible. I'd love to hear your thoughts about what do you think the most significant changes have been and how those changes have really impacted how we understand users today and maybe how that might change.
Yeah, I can think of three that I'd want to mention today. You know, so when you kind of got at this, right, we were few in numbers when I started. And, you know, I was the field precedes me. So even fewer in the earliest days, kind of an obscure practice, fewer people. And now we are a much more established practice. community of practice, it's a field, it's a discipline that's larger in scope.
So that means there's more of us and the point of more of us means there's more knowledge sharing, there's more communities, there's more meetup groups, there's more books, There's more conferences, there's more podcasts. And so this community of practice means we share things, we document things, we collectively argue and debate and align or not about how to do things.
We have examples of what's worked that constantly get updated as circumstances change or new things are being tried. And so that idea of a community of practice that has knowledge that shares it is not something that we relied on maybe as strongly as we do today. I think that's one change.
Another that, you know, and speaking as someone who's spent his whole career in consulting, you know, with my own agency and working in other agencies, you know, I feel this very directly, this shift from a previous time that people may not know about where if anyone was doing research, it was work that was being done by agencies. It was work that was being done by consultants.
And just to be pedantic, I don't mean freelancers. Freelancers are often people that come into a company that work in a way that's similar to how an employee might work. finely slice them in a language. So when I think about agencies or consultants, it's separate entities, separate businesses that are contracted for a piece of work. There were not in-house research teams.
There were not in-house researchers. Often there were none. There was not research leadership inside organizations that would advocate for resources, would advocate for how research should be done, would form peer relationships with heads of other disciplines, and figure out how research could be integrated at the right time.
And so this change, I think, is really dramatic, although invisible to people that maybe only have X years in the field. But what I see is that's really changed kind of the politics and culture of research. And some of those changes are enormously positive, like research leadership being part of the organization. I feel there's things that have been lost or that are that are different.
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Chapter 3: What are the significant shifts from agencies to in-house teams?
I think when research is a corporate function as opposed to kind of an external advisory function, it changes kind of the dynamics of truth to power, which is a big part of what we do as researchers. So, yeah, I think that's been a shift and most shifts have pluses and minuses to them. The last one I might bring up today is how COVID led to such a shift in remote work overall.
And so remote work changes how we collaborate and the things that we do as researchers outside of research, having workshops, forming relationships that are kind of supporting this creative work are different. And then, of course, research, we've had remote research for a very, very long time. Nate Bolt wrote this book about remote research in 2010.
So it had been around long enough that there was a book about it. But now remote research is the default. And I think people don't even necessarily consider that there are other modes of doing research. It's sort of a presumptive approach. And again, that has positives, greater possibilities for inclusion in a lot of cases geographically, if not otherwise, as well as team participation.
But for sure, things are being lost when we don't ever at all go out into the world and see people and breathe the same air as them and have experiences that change us as researchers. So I'm trying not to be the like, everything is terrible because this has changed. But let's be more measured and balanced about these changes.
But it seems like you had this last one that remote work being a default, remote research being a default has been just so dramatic in how it's shifted what research looks and feels like for all of us, participants, researchers, people who do research, stakeholders, all of us.
Yeah, I think those are really All of those things are also trends that I've tracked over time. And I think, you know, just in response, it's been a wonderful thing to see Kate Towsie's book come out because I feel like that is a real signal that
just the discipline and the organization and the structure, logistical coverage that spinning up a new operation, relatively new operation in the business environment really requires. And so I'm thrilled to see that that happened, especially, but I think you're right about the speaking truth to power becomes a lot harder when you're getting paid by the people who
may be challenged by what it is you have to bring to the table. And then also, user testing is obviously remote first, but I definitely see still situations where it makes sense to get out there in person. And the remote part and kind of just recording that experience is very secondary to the impact that just having your mindset change because you have been in that same room is important.
So that's great. Shifting gears a little bit, this is a topic area that's very close to my heart because I have used your book interviewing users in classes and with in a lot of conversations with folks over the years.
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Chapter 4: What impact has remote work had on user research?
Things that go in a two-by-two are interpretive and creative, and they're produced by us, and you have to explore different ways of combining information to find one that's meaningful, that highlights something that we can do something with. And so you're asking, like, how do we do this? How do we get better at this? And I think so, first of all, doing it.
I had a boss that would say, like, the best way to increase your chances of winning the lottery is to buy one ticket. Right. And then you get diminishing returns after that. But I think the point there was like. doing it makes you better than not doing it. So sort of acknowledging this and taking some time to do it is gonna make tremendous improvements for anybody.
But again, alchemical is a liberating lens. I'm gonna try to claim that here. It's a creative skill. And I think like lots of creative skills, You can try them on your own, but I think it's great if you can work with a mentor or a coach, have some guidelines. And yes, these are things that I've written about, other people have talked about.
There's kind of recipes that you can follow to take you into this mode of some different kind of thinking. But being in an environment, and whether that mentor or a coach or peers, I think this can also be something that you can do together.
making sure that you reflect back and get feedback and, and not just kind of charge ahead without, you know, paying some kind of attention to what does this feel like? What does this produce? What have other people kind of produced doing this, you know, to, to kind of level set on this, um,
But again, I just think, you know, setting yourself the intention of not just reporting what people said, but creating a new framework or structure or model that kind of encapsulates that and points the way forward. You know, I think having that intention is going to take you into a different way of working with the data that you've got if you're not currently doing that.
Well, that's, I think, a very powerful response to that because I think to me it suggests a couple of things. The first is, you know, and I've said this myself, we often go into projects with an idea about what the output needs to look like. And I think that what it is that you're saying is Yes, there needs to be that.
And you also need to be open to the high probability that there's going to be something that's really unique that's going to come out and you need to give yourself the time and space to get there. And I think, you know, it's real challenge in this environment where we're being asked to go faster to carve out that time to get the space to do that work.
so yeah what are your thoughts about like how do we how do we do that how do we win that time you know it's a perpetual challenge and i think um i think we always feel like the time that we're in now is the time where it's hardest for resources and hardest for time and hardest for influence the hardest for buy-in and
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Chapter 5: Why is synthesis important in UX research?
and this is harder to do right it's not just one one thing that you output and tada everybody is kind of engaged but how do you want to work with different people some people are more patient some people want to see how the sausage is made some people want to have a conversation some people want to read something and then have a conversation
You know, if we're in the business of collaborating with those people, do we have bandwidth or can we be kind of flexible about the ways that we share stuff? And I think you're kind of getting at this well, right? It's all the way along the process. To to share stuff. And, you know, when I sort of started out, I was definitely enamored with the big reveal, the aha.
You do something, you come back and say, here's this thing which is going to blow your mind. And that doesn't really work at all. So, you know, what are these ways that we can engage with people all along the process? And, you know, we're creating new knowledge together. We're not trying to sell someone on something.
But so thinking about the relationship, thinking about touch points, thinking about, you know, quick updates and designing a bunch of occasions, many of which can be super lo-fi.
They don't have to have sort of formal names, but you know ways that you're making information available to people that they can kind of dip into, or they can just see that information is accumulating, and that is already awareness. versus here's a report, here's a workshop, here's a deck. I think there's sort of these small things that set up that communication part of relationship.
And I would encourage people to flex their storytelling muscles and be creative. And again, this idea of we're not in the business of quoting people and what their asks are. Um, and so I think, and again, there's just, I'm cycling back to think sometimes people have a less sophisticated view of what value research can bring, um, and, and doing that. Yes.
And, and, and, and saying, Hey, we learned these things that you asked for and we have something else. Um, You know, I think there's a pushback against researchers. Oh, researchers tend to, you know, not get to the meat quickly enough. I think that's a thing that we're sort of accused of that, you know, here's all this stuff about process that no one cares about.
So give them the action items and then, you know, put your process in appendix. I think that might be generally true, but again, thinking about storytelling as muscles that you can flex in different ways, there might be times in which you want to build up a narrative. That doesn't mean that the document itself has to have that, but maybe that's the relationship you want.
You build up a narrative over time, you share process artifacts, and that creates a case where you can share conclusions in a document that doesn't have to rehash that because people have already kind of been there with that. I think these are just, they're storytelling things.
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Chapter 6: What practical advice can new researchers follow?
Maybe I said something like what neighborhood they live in. And this woman could not have been less interested and was kind of, I read it at the time, and I'll walk this back, but I read it at the time as unfriendly. to me and we had the interview and the interview was fine and good and I learned a lot and it was, you know, great stuff for what we were trying to accomplish.
But I was ruminating over it for a few days. I was kind of like, just picture me like muttering to myself, why didn't that woman come? I was telling her I was friendly and she was not. And at one point, I heard myself kind of complaining, again, not, this was just to myself, but kind of complaining about how I was treated and how I felt. And it dawned on me, I mean, this is just,
It feels kind of dumb, but I will share this. It dawned on me that, of course, why would this person possibly care? They were having a meeting. I was meeting with them. They were asked to come. Their expertise was requested. Why was I possibly talking about myself?
And so I kind of had a slap the forehead moment, one, in that realization, and then two, because I conjured up the slide that I cover in every workshop and the stuff that I've written about in my books that tells researchers, people learning from me in my teaching, explicitly not to do that. There's a whole protocol that I kind of advise on
about not talking about yourself and the naive researcher thinks that the way that you build rapport is by sharing about yourself but i'm a firm believer and advocate in that the best way to build rapport is focus on them and not share about yourself unless it's somehow going to be helpful and um You know, it was just, it was a kind of a funny moment.
Like, who's the person that's written about this? And who's the person that has absolutely failed to follow that advice because they gave into some other, you know, other person? That's me. I'm going to hold up my two thumbs and point at myself. I'm the guy that did that. And, you know, it was sort of, I had to kind of laugh at myself and think, well, that makes my teaching better.
because I can tell people to do this, and I can tell them that I have failed to do that. I think it makes it more tangible to be able to illustrate it, and I think it makes the advice more accessible if even, quote, Steve Portigal, who wrote this book, unquote, is also making these mistakes. And your question is, how does that make me a better researcher?
Well, there's nothing like making a mistake, seeing it go wrong, realizing the mistake, and then even slapping your forehead a couple of times. That increases my own mindfulness or my own resolve to be careful about when and how I share about myself.
Yeah, I mean, I think I like to have my own mistakes where I can sort of see the principles that I'm teaching and the principles that I'm talking about and writing about and kind of have it all inform each other. And sometimes you figure out something on the page or in the classroom or in a slide deck.
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Chapter 7: How can researchers effectively communicate findings?
And so they write or they do podcasts. And I've come across podcasts from people with heartache. hardly any experience in the field. And that's a valid approach. That's making something that's engaging and so on. But some people are not interested in being public. And what they're interested in is relationships. And people do networking. And networking is not a bad word. Networking is a good word.
It's a thing that we It doesn't mean to be inauthentic or to be pitching people or to be being needy from people. It means about engaging with the community. And for some people, that's reading what other people have to say, or sometimes that's commenting on other people.
Or sometimes that's, you know, seeking out a group of people to form your own little, you know, tiny navigable group with or joining in groups that are there. And that can be at people that are at the same level as you or maybe just slightly ahead of you.
So I think it's interesting just to look at what you see other people doing in networking and how they're being, seeking out information and influence and inspiration for themselves and trying different things, you know? So if, yeah, if you're, you know, listening to this or watching this, you might think, oh, I should be following Steve Portigal.
He wrote this book and, you know, I should be following Indy Young and so on. And yes, there are, you know, people, I don't know, people like us that have been around and that are, you know, have written books. Yes. Please follow us. You know, please follow Leah, right? We're all, we all have things to say and we want to engage and we want your attention, but yeah,
If you're newish to the field, who are the people that have two years more experience than you do? And who are the people that don't post a lot, but maybe they want to hang out every week on a Zoom chat or join a Slack or a Discord, I guess, and talk about stuff and compare notes? So I think that's untapped. That takes a little more effort. People like Leah and I, we're making...
us available and you know we're sort of an easy obvious follow uh but i can't i don't have you know 18 months more experience than you i have decades more if you're new um so the relatability of what i have to offer and the tangibleness of it is like
Yeah, you want to sort of diversify, I guess, who you have access to in your community and seek out some things and find what's going to work for you and experiment. And that will change over time as well. I think there's just so many ways to seek this out that is kind of going to be valuable to you specifically.
Yeah. And I have to say, like, just to amplify a little bit on that, it's the also embracing the fact that you can't do all the things all at the same time. And that's OK.
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Chapter 8: What does the future hold for research-led companies?
Yeah, I think that's a really provocative point because I think that there's a lot of energy potentially about in this space to kind of move in the direction of being more entrepreneurial. I think the biggest challenge that I perceive is getting the capital to do it and the business acumen to do it.
And that's where I think there's probably some opportunity for growth for people who want to go in that direction. But I can totally see that being a direction. So I think that's a great answer and probably likely.
actually just given some of the signals that i'm seeing out there maybe that's a conversation we can continue in the future well um thank you so much for this really enlightening conversation i just you always have i think a very interesting perspective that's informed by so much experience
And I would love to hear more about what you are doing and how people can learn about your thought leadership activities and kind of, you know, maybe obtain copies of your books or listen to your podcast. So just would love to hear a little bit more about that.
Sure. And I mentioned networking and I mentioned LinkedIn. So I'm on LinkedIn. So people are welcome to follow me there, link to me there. And you can see me post about stuff that I'm doing. I'll post about that. this podcast when it comes out into the world and other things like that. My own website is portugal.com.
And there's a, so you can see what services I provide to clients, a little bit about my work and my workshops and some of my speaking and my own research work. And there's a page there for my books. And there's a page there for my podcasts. I've done quite a few interviews with research leaders in 2024.
I'm probably taking a little hiatus right now, but there's a lot of episodes there to catch up for people that are new. And if people want to buy interviewing users, then we have a discount code, which is tied to the name of this podcast. The discount code is the word UNLOCKED. And it's good for 30 days from now for 10% off the purchase of the second edition of interviewing users.
Only if you purchase it from the publisher, Rosenfeld Media. And you should support small businesses anyway, I think. So it's a good place to buy all of your UX books is from the publisher. So yeah. Yeah, I encourage people to check that out. And there's some samples and some resources there that people can get a little taste of and see if it's something that they want to buy.
Yeah, I cannot more highly recommend checking out Rosenfeld Meet. If you are a UX researcher or designer, you need to know about the books and the conferences that Lou and his team curate. They're awesome. So again, thank you so much for your time.
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