Just Fly Performance Podcast

312: Rob Gray on Higher Athletic Ceilings with Differential Learning and Optimized Variability Training

23 Jun 2022

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Today’s episode welcomes back to the show, Rob Gray, professor at Arizona State University and host of the Perception & Action Podcast. Rob Gray has been conducting research on, and teaching courses related to perceptual-motor skill for over 25 years. He focuses heavily on the application of basic theory to address real-world challenges, having consulted with numerous professional and governmental entities, and has developed a VR baseball training system that has been used in over 25 published studies. Rob is the author of the book “How We Learn to Move: A Revolution in the Way We Coach and Practice Sports Skills”. You cannot separate the world of athletic development, even pure “power” training, from concepts on motor learning. If we look at interest in athletic performance topics by “need”, speed training will typically be first on the list. At its core, sprinting, lifting (and every other athletic skill) has its roots in how we learn. The great thing about motor learning knowledge, is that it can both allow you to have a better training session on the day, as well as month to month, and year over year. Training done only on the level of raw “power” as a general quality, and explicit instruction will create early ceilings for athletes in their career. Understanding motor learning allows for more involved daily training sessions, and better flourishing of skills that grow like a tree, over time. Whether you work in sport, in the gym, or as a parent/athlete, understanding how we learn goes a massively long way in becoming the best version of one’s self athletically and from a movement perspective. In episode 293, Rob got into the constraints-led approach to movement vs. “teaching fundamentals”, and in this episode, he goes into CLA’s counter-part: differential learning. Rob will get into the nuances of differential learning on the novice and advanced level. In the back end of the show, we’ll talk about “stacking constraints”, games, exploration, using the “velocity dial” as a constraint, and finally, the promising results of Rob’s research showing the effectiveness of a variable practice model. Today’s episode is brought to you by SimpliFaster and Lost Empire Herbs. For 15% off your Lost Empire Herbs order, head to lostempireherbs.com/justfly. To try Pine Pollen for FREE (just pay for shipping), head to: justflypinepollen.com View more podcast episodes at the podcast homepage. Timestamps and Main Points: 5:07 – How differential learning is different than the constraints led approach in athletic development 12:10 – Using differential learning as a recovery tool from intense training means 15:51 – Using constraints within the scope of differential learning and vice versa 21:28 – If and how differential learning or the CLA led approach can be too “widespread” vs. focused towards a movement goal 25:02 – Some games Rob would specifically utilize in training tennis players using constraints and differential learning 28:11 – The advantage of free flowing sports with limited rules and setups for children in the process of youth sports 36:05 – How performing exploratory movements in the weight room can fit with differential learning concepts 41:55 – Rob’s take on the innate ability of athletes to figure out movement on their own, and when to dig into constraints more deeply to help determine why they may not be solving a problem well, and the integration of analogies into the process 44:23 – Thoughts on manipulating velocity and time as a constraint, and the relationship between intensifying constraints, and the amount of movement solutions 53:30 – How using variable learning and constraint led approaches can improve players ceilings in long-term development 59:52 – The specifics of Rob’s landmark study with baseball players and long-term development “The constraints led approach is a bit more focused… you have a rough idea of where they want to be, and you want to help guide them” “Differential learning has the same goals (as the CLA), but instead of adding a constraint to push you a certain way, we are going to have you do a different thing every trial. So maybe I’ll get you to do different stances, feet close together or far apart, different shaped barbells, different surfaces… we are trying to get you try a bunch of different things with the hope that you will find the solution space on your own, rather than trying to push you a certain direction” “Differential learning is more variability for variability’s sake” “Learning a skill (in a differential manner) actually reduces the incidence of injury” “You would never do differential learning where you did a task on a computer screen” “I would add differential learning on top of (the constraint of trying to hit a ball over a fence) by using different bat weights” “Now what I do is start (learning) with games, and if you do it right, that stroke will come along on its own” “There are certain key variants that have to be there, if not, you have to step in as a coach” “We’re doing this with the idea that we are all moving towards an elite sport endpoint… why can’t we teach kids that moving around is fun? Not everybody can be elite” “When you really ramp up the constraints, short times, high force, it really amounts of the amount of solutions you can do… so when a person is really struggling how to do something, there is really not that many options… increasing velocity can really push people, but not beyond what they can handle” “Once you work with an athlete who has the basic pattern, then you are adding in variability to optimize it” “So the group that got more variable conditions, they did better in the tests after the study, they did better their next season of high school, and they got drafted more often” About Rob Gray Rob Gray is a professor at Arizona State University who has been conducting research on and teaching courses related to perceptual-motor skill for over 25 years. He received his MS and PhD from York University in Canada with a focus on the visual control of movement. An important aspect of his work has been applying basic theory to address real-world challenges which he has done in positions with Nissan Motor Corp, the US Air Force, serving as an expert witness for driving accident cases, and consultant roles with several sports teams and organizations. In 2007 he was awarded the Distinguished Scientific Award for Early Career Contribution to Psychology from the American Psychological Association. Rob is the author of the book “How We Learn to Move: A Revolution in the Way We Coach and Practice Sports Skills”. One of the accomplishments he is most proud of is the baseball batting virtual environment/virtual reality that he developed over the course of several years and which has been used in over 25 published studies. In 2017 (Gray, Frontiers in Psychology) he published the results of a 10-year study using a virtual reality training protocol which led to clear evidence of transfer of training to real performance. In his career, Gray has strongly emphasized the communication and dissemination of scientific knowledge. In 2015, he started the Perception & Action Podcast (perceptionaction.com) to help bridge the gap between theory and the field. With over 350 episodes and 2 million downloads, it has become a critical resource for individuals working in areas including coaching, talent development, training and rehabilitation.

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2ª PARTE | 06 ENE 2026 | EL PARTIDAZO DE COPE

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3ª PARTE | 22 ENE 2026 | EL PARTIDAZO DE COPE

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3ª PARTE | 04 MAR 2026 | EL PARTIDAZO DE COPE

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El Partidazo de COPE

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Just Fly Performance Podcast

312: Rob Gray on Higher Athletic Ceilings with Differential Learning and Optimized Variability Training

This episode hasn't been transcribed yet

Other recent transcribed episodes

13:00H | 21 DIC 2025 | Fin de Semana

10:00H | 21 DIC 2025 | Fin de Semana

12:00H | 20 DIC 2025 | Fin de Semana

2ª PARTE | 06 ENE 2026 | EL PARTIDAZO DE COPE

3ª PARTE | 22 ENE 2026 | EL PARTIDAZO DE COPE

3ª PARTE | 04 MAR 2026 | EL PARTIDAZO DE COPE

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