Poetry Unbound in Conversation — Rachel Mann and Yomi Ṣode
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What is the main topic discussed in this episode?
Hi friends, Padraig O'Tooma here. Thanks very much for listening to Poetry Unbound. In between Poetry Unbound seasons, and we have season 11 that'll start later in 2026, we have a whole host of interviews that I've done with poets over the last two years. Poetry Unbound in conversation, we call them. I've loved the opportunity to talk to poets about their craft, how they see the world through the lens of poetry, and what this art form does for them. These Poetry Unbound in Conversation episodes deepened my curiosity about language and art. I trust they will for you too. Today you'll be hearing not from one poet, but two. First, you'll be hearing from the priest, teacher and poet Rachel Mann about her most recent collection, Eleanor Among the Saints, which offers meditations on Eleanor John Reichner, a 14th century trans woman, a seamstress, sex worker and religious figure.
You'll also hear from the brilliant writer, broadcaster and teacher Yomi Shoda about his debut collection, Mannerism, where he interrogates the biography of Caravaggio, the 17th century Baroque painter. I interviewed Rachel Mann and Yomi Shoda in March of 2024 at the Stanza Poetry Festival in St. Andrews in Scotland. Yomi and I were on stage. Rachel joined us via video link. A special thanks to the staff, volunteers and attendees at the Stanza Poetry Festival, especially Ryan Van Winkle and Susie Kirk-Dimitru. Thanks as well to Rachel Mann and Yomi Shoda, as well as their publishers, Carconet and Penguin Press. Welcome to Poetry Unbound in Conversation. Here I am with Rachel Mann and Yomi Shoda. Thanks very much, Ryan, and good morning, everybody.
It's lovely to have you here. Thanks to Ryan, as well as to Susie Kirk, Dimitriou and James Boyer-Smith, everyone at Stanza here in St Andrews in Scotland, all the volunteers, everybody who gives so much time to make this an extraordinary poetry festival. I've wanted to come to this festival for years, so I was delighted to have the opportunity to come across. I'm Padraig O'Tooma from On Being, and we're going to be having some conversations today with two extraordinary poets. Yomi Shoday, who's sitting near me here, and also then Rachel Mann, who'll be joining us via video link. What we'll do is hear some poems from Rachel and then I'll have a conversation with her. And then we'll hear some poems from Yomi and have a conversation with him.
And then we'll have a conversation together, all three of us. So Rachel Mann, we're going to bring her up on the screen. Let me introduce her. She is a priest and a writer and a broadcaster, the author of 13 books. And those books span fiction and literary criticism and theology and commentary and poetry. She's a visiting teaching fellow at the Manchester Writing School. And her most recent collection of poetry, titled Eleanor Among the Saints, was published by Carconet in January 2024. Andrew Macmillan wrote this about the book. Nobody else could have written this. Poems formed in the space where divinity, the body, trans identity and history fold together. So please give Rachel Mann a very warm stanza welcome and we'll hear some poems and then have a conversation with her.
Rachel, it's great to see you.
enabling me to join via video link. I fell ill on my way to Stansea yesterday. Who knew the body contained so much shit and water? And gosh, I discovered that in the last 24 hours.
What themes do Rachel Mann and Yomi Ṣode explore in their poetry?
So I'm going to read some poems from the new collection. starting off with some poems from the section called Eleanor Among the Saints. This is a book which seeks to recover a trans woman, Eleanor Reikner, from obscurity, a woman who lived in the late Middle Ages, a seamstress, a sex worker, someone who, as a trans person myself, I find great solidarity with. The opening poem makes reference to a Hebrew word, masake, or masaket. It means literally warp and weft, but it also means an intense focus of meaning. Eleanor, in the beginning, sew me, sew me weird, stitch me fingers, teeth, my lids and legs too, sew me new, together, apart, stitch me skill and fright,
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Chapters
8 chapters
1
What is the main topic discussed in this episode?
0:02–3:40
2
What themes do Rachel Mann and Yomi Ṣode explore in their poetry?
3:40–5:43
3
How does Rachel Mann's work reflect on historical figures?
5:43–10:17
4
What personal experiences shape Yomi Ṣode's poetry?
10:17–19:33
5
How do Rachel and Yomi discuss the concept of grace in their work?
19:33–22:25
6
What role does historical research play in their poetry?
22:25–25:06
7
How do both poets address grief and loss in their writing?
25:06–28:33
8
How do Rachel and Yomi perceive the impact of their public roles on their poetry?
28:33–55:15
Speakers
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