Chapter 1: What is the main topic discussed in this episode?
I'm Anne Applebaum. Over the past year, as I watched Donald Trump demand unprecedented new powers, I wondered, don't he and his team fear that these same powers could one day be used by a different administration and a different president to achieve very different goals? Well, maybe they are afraid.
And maybe that's why they're using their new tools to change our institutions, even to alter the playing field in advance of midterm elections later this year, to make sure their opponents can't win. Ultimately, destroying trust is the currency of autocrats. We could win, but we are very, very, very likely to lose if we keep treating this as business as usual.
Chapter 2: What is the significance of Jafar Panahi's film 'It Was Just an Accident'?
reporting on the sweeping changes unfolding in our country and preparing you to think about what might happen next. The new season of Autocracy in America, available now. Iranian director Jafar Panahi's latest movie, It Was Just an Accident, shot in secret in Tehran, is nominated for two Oscars.
In it, a group of misfits roam around in a white van trying to figure out what to do with the person they just kidnapped. One of the women is wearing a wedding dress the whole time. One of the men is a hothead, perpetually at 11. They bicker about what to do with their victim, who is sedated and locked in a box. It's the setup for a caper, and lots of ridiculous things do happen.
But at its core, the movie is driving towards the country's real open wound. The man locked in the box is someone they all suspect to have been their torturer in prison, a sadistic agent of the regime named Ekbal, who ruined each of their lives in distinct ways. The dig at the Iranian regime is not subtle. I'm Hannah Rosen. This is Radio Atlantic. Today, we're talking to Panahi. He's in the U.S.
in the lead-up to the Oscars, and he joins us in a moment when Iran is seeing some of the largest protests in the country's history met by some of the most violent government crackdowns. Estimates of protesters killed range from the thousands to the tens of thousands.
In recent days, the government has started arresting even moderates and extended the sentence of an activist and Nobel Peace Prize winner to 17 years in prison. Panahi's co-writer was recently arrested, and Panahi himself has been sentenced to one year in prison in absentia. His lawyer has said they intend to appeal the sentence.
It seems like once again, Iran, still potentially a nuclear power, has the world on edge. Does he like to be called by his, like, Jafar or Panahi? Whatever you're comfortable. Okay. All right. Well, Jafar... We talked to Panahi about all of this and his film, It Was Just an Accident, earlier this week, through his interpreter, Sheda Dayani. It Was Just an Accident
What did you want an audience, either Iranian or international, to understand or be thinking about when they're watching this movie? Usually these types of films are made after the fall or the change of the regime because then that's when people go back to see what happened. And based on their understanding of the past, then they make a film.
And it's also very important for people to make films in a secure fashion. But I wanted to make this film now because I wanted to have the audience think about the future. And I wanted to prepare the audience about what is about to come. For me, it was important to finally ask a question.
To me, it was very important to raise this question to the audience about whether the cycle of violence going to continue or if we can be hopeful that at some point it's going to end. Shopkeepers and market stall holders began protesting against rocketing food prices on Sunday, and today they were joined by university students demanding political change.
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Chapter 3: How does Jafar Panahi feel about returning to Iran amidst protests?
If in our own work we cannot stand against repression, it's going to get out of control. When they gave me a ban of not working for 20 years, I had two choices. Either I could just sit at home and do not work, because they had told me not to work, or I had to look for solutions.
I remember back then, a lot of students would come to me and say that the situation is very difficult, they cannot work, and they were immersed in hopelessness. I said to myself one day, should I be like them and keep nagging and keep saying it's not possible, or should I think of a solution and do something?
There was a time that when I wanted to make a film, everything was in the hands of the government. It was not as easy, but now with all the technological advances, you could even make a film on a cell phone camera. Because the authorities had told me that I cannot make a film, my friend and I started making a film in my home, and we said, this is not a film.
And then I thought to myself, what can I do if I cannot work in film? And I thought there are a number of things, including driving, that I could do as a profession. But then because I knew myself, I was sure that even if I start driving, I'm going to hide a camera somewhere in a taxi. And that's exactly what happened.
I hid a camera and started making the stories of my passengers, and that became the film Taxi. Mr. Panahi, I know you. I know all of you, Panahi. Hey, listeners, this is Hannah interrupting with a spoiler warning. If you remember, It Was Just an Accident is about a group of Iranians kidnapping a man they suspect to have been their interrogator and torturer in prison.
My next question is about how the movie ends. If you want to avoid hearing that, you can skip ahead four minutes. So I want to ask about the end of this movie, It Was Just an Accident. It has a very hopeful moment where it seems like everything's going to go back to normal. And it also, the end of the movie, suggests that the cycles of violence may continue. Is that how you feel? I mean, it...
Happiness and sorrow are part of everyday work, and this is also part of the realism sense of the film. I consider myself a socially engaged filmmaker, and I try to speak about the realities of the society. So first, my audience has to believe the film, and it has to believe that it's watching a semi-documentary. Omitting any of those elements can harm the sense of realism in the work.
The humor that you see in the film at some point was intentional, and I wanted the audience to understand move along quite comfortably throughout, at least up until the last 20 minutes of the film. And then in the last 20 minutes, I intentionally took out the humor from the film. And I wanted the audience to hold its breath and to think about the film. Umidwari
Under any circumstances, hopefulness will help people. It will help human beings to continue to live. When you hear the sound of the footstep at the end of the film, it first shocks you, and you think that the interrogator is here to arrest him. And then there is some silence. And then the sound of footsteps goes away as if it starts getting further and further. And then there is some silence.
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