Chapter 1: What is the main topic discussed in this episode?
It's very seldom I run into someone who I really think is just kind of a piece of shit. For the most part, everybody's just at their job, whether they're wildly famous or not. And they're just trying to do the job and then go home and hang out with their family. It's just kind of our universal situation. Well, you know what that means, Rory? That means you're the piece of shit. Oh, my God. Shit.
Shit. This is an iHeart Podcast. Guaranteed human. You know Roald Dahl. He thought up Willy Wonka and the BFG. But did you know he was a spy? In the new podcast, The Secret World of Roald Dahl, I'll tell you that story and much, much more. What? You probably won't believe it either. Was this before he wrote his stories? It must have been. Okay, I don't think that's true. I'm telling you.
The guy was a spy. Okay. Listen to The Secret World of Roald Dahl on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Marsh Madness is here, and if you're trying to keep up with everything happening on and off the court, we've got you covered on the podcast, Flagrant and Funny. You want to start with the first question for the Big Ten Coach of the Year? Oh, whatever.
Would you like to? So you're a Spartan, is that what I'm getting? Exactly. On Flagrant and Funny, we're giving our unfiltered takes on the biggest moments, the conversations everyone's having. So whether your bracket is busted or you just want the latest on the tournament, we got you.
Listen to Flagrant and Funny with Carrie Champion and Jemele Hill on the iHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Presented by Capital One, founding partner of iHeart Women's Sports. In 2023, Bachelor star Clayton Eckerd was accused of fathering twins, but the pregnancy appeared to be a hoax. You doctored this particular test twice, Ms. Owens, correct?
I doctored the test once. It took an army of internet detectives to uncover a disturbing pattern. Two more men who'd been through the same thing. Greg Gillespie and Michael Marancini. My mind was blown. I'm Stephanie Young. This is Love Trapped. Laura, Scottsdale Police.
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Chapter 2: Who is Ivan Boesky and what is his significance in Wall Street history?
As the season continues, Laura Owens finally faces consequences. Listen to Love Trapped podcast on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.
Hello, and welcome to Snafu, your favorite podcast about history's greatest screw-ups, or if we're being completely honest, a show about the spectacular hubris of humanity, the epic disasters it creates, and the lessons we like to pretend we can learn from them. I'm your host, Ed Helms, and my guest today is a very funny comedian, actor, writer, and podcast host.
He released his first comedy album, Dilation, in 2011 and pumped out not one, not three, but six albums. Different stand-up specials, the most recent of which, Religion, Sex, and a Few Things in Between, you can find on HBO Max. He's appeared in a variety of film and television programs with a particularly standout performance opposite Rose Byrne in Apple TV's Physical, which...
is a fucking awesome show, by the way. Yes, indeed. And he's set to appear in a new ABC show called Do You Want Kids? And I think I also just saw a trailer that had you in it for my buddy Steve Carell's new show, Rooster. That's right. So please welcome to the pod the amazing Rory Scovell. Thank you very much for having me. I...
I've got to say, Ed, I have waited to see you face to face because this was the only way to tell you this. But Vacation is potentially one of the funniest movies that I have seen in, I do not, I don't know how long, but I have not seen a comedy where literally every five minutes I sort of need to pause the movie to collect myself and
And I have shown so many people that movie and I tell them you will cry laughing. And it's so true. I love that movie so much. You are this. You're going to make me cry right now. You're really touching me. And I'll tell you why. Because I and the writer directors of that movie have long felt that that movie like we are so proud of it. It is. It's a movie we loved making. We love the product.
And it just didn't capture the audience that we that we hoped for. And so when I get these little nuggets of affirmation like that, I really appreciate it. That really means a lot. You guys should absolutely be proud of it. But just given the fact that it's not comedically predictable, it's not hacky, it's not like The cringy comedy that you can find out there, which is fine.
The fact that it actually is just so moments of that car is so stupid. The car is so funny. There's a key fob with a million buttons on it. And Christina Applegate goes, is that a swastika? And I just say, yeah, we won't use that. It's great. All right. Well, enough about me. We're here to talk about you. First of all, I've actually known you a long time. Not well.
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Chapter 3: How did Ivan Boesky rise to prominence in the 1980s?
We've bumped into each other over the years. But I have a very borderline offensive question for you, which is, do you say your last name Scovel or Scovel? I say Scoville, which I'm going to go and say is correct, but I get so many versions of it. Skovel. Yeah. Skovel. Skovel. Skovel. Skovel. Skovel. Skovel. Good, because I am Southern, so I have all these little contractions.
I say things like my friend Eleanor, I say Eleanor. Yes. And Skovel. Yeah. And that sort of thing. But I'm always conscious that I'm probably doing it wrong as well. Where are you from originally? The South from South Carolina, Greenville. Oh, right on. Eleanor is exactly right. Even though it's spelled with an O, it's pronounced with an I or even an apostrophe, an apostrophe R. Eleanor.
Yeah, Eleanor. Yeah, that R comes in quick. You're rapidly becoming an American treasure. Thank you. I love to see it. This is the best podcast I've ever been on. We should just do this the whole time. This is called Butter Us Up. We just compliment each other in abusive ways. The Butter Boys. The Butter Boys. How great are you? That's what this is called.
No, but it's fun when I have people on that I think are awesome like you. Cool. Thank you. You have a new podcast also. You're getting into this space. You're starting to horn in on my space a little bit. What is it? Tell me more. It's a show called Crimeless.
Chapter 4: What is arbitrage and how did Boesky utilize it?
I do it with journalist Josh Dean. And yeah, he basically... Not so unlike this show, just in the world of crime stories and stupid criminals throughout history and throughout the world. Josh kind of reads me a story about, can you believe this bonehead criminal...
story and i'm just hearing it for the first time and and commenting on it and uh and i love it i i'm shocked every time that i mean i'm not shocked and i am shocked that 95 of the stories are from florida but that is just that's just the reality of it uh but yeah it's uh it's out now and it's it's been super fun to do and josh is a great co-host Cool. I am psyched to check that out.
And it's also a perfect segue into what we're about to do. I'm about to talk to you about this snafu. And in this particular case, it is also a crime. Perfect. Have you seen the movie Wall Street? I've seen the movie Wall Street. Okay, with Michael Douglas and Charlie Sheen and Daryl Hannah. It's an Oliver Stone movie. It's phenomenal.
So the guy that Michael Douglas plays in that movie who's like a corporate raider and like a Wall Street tycoon, he's based loosely, but he is based on a real guy. Does this ring any bells for you? No, I don't think I was aware of this, no. OK, so this is a Wall Street legend of sorts.
It's just one of those really epic stories about a man who rose from rags to riches and then plummeted from riches to an orange jumpsuit. Our man of the hour is Ivan Boski, and he was considered widely thought to be the direct inspiration for Michael Douglas's very slippery 80s villain Gordon Gekko. We have a we have a photo of Mr. Boski here.
It just seems like I think that I've seen other pictures of him where his eyes look normal. So I'm just going to guess that's a weird. He's either he's either winking or or it's just one of those weird, weird moments that the cameras get. But there's a slickness to this guy. And look at his skin. He's got game show host vibes. He does. He kind of looks like he'd be fun to have a beer with.
I'll be honest. That's right. Well, we're going to learn why he might not be somebody that you wanted to hang out with. Also, funny footnote, he's wearing a black suit and a white shirt in this picture. And that was his go-to every single day. And someone asked him at one point, why do you wear the same ā suit and shirt every day. And he said, I have enough big decisions to make every day.
This is one I can just take off the list, which is funny because Einstein is also famous for that. Albert Einstein always wore the same suit and shirt for the same reasons. Just like, take it off your plate, right? It makes sense. I don't know if you do that. I don't do it for those reasons. When I wear the same clothes, it's clearly like a lazy sort of...
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Chapter 5: What led to Ivan Boesky's downfall?
When I wear the same clothes every day, it's problematic. It's a bit of a red flag. There's stains. It happens a lot. That you have to explain. Right. Here is Michael Douglas' famous piece of dialogue from Wall Street. He's giving a big speech to stockholders meeting for a big company, and he's walking the aisle with a microphone, and he's very... Tons of gravitas.
And he's just saying greed, for lack of a better word, is good. Greed is right. Greed works. Greed clarifies, cuts through and captures the essence of the evolutionary spirit. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I think we know now the state of our politics that he was right. It's going great. It's going so good. He's all right. What he left out is, and all of that sucks.
And that the consequences of all of this is not good. The end game of this is devastating. Exactly. So today we will find out what that spirit conjured throughout the 80s. Of course, your show, Physical, takes place in the 80s. How would you capture the spirit of the 80s? How would you describe it? I don't know.
I feel like that's almost a good... I feel like that's why there's something to his speech in that movie. Because it's almost like the 80s was like, you can get up and you can create your own future. And greed and wanting to do it and having to step over people to pull it off is a great start. And then the other side of it feels like Cyndi Lauper and Madonna, which...
I feel like I identify with more in my spirit of what I like to envision of the 80s. But as far as business, yeah, I think it was like that. Also, I'm just going to say a word that I associate with the 80s, cocaine. Yeah. Lots of it. Yeah. Lots and lots. And that's what crossed the aisles. That's where the art community and the business community found common ground. Amen.
All right, well, let's get into Ivan Boesky a little bit. He starts out modestly.
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Chapter 6: What were the consequences of Boesky's insider trading actions?
Born in 1937, he grew up in post-war Detroit, the son of a Russian immigrant who ran delis and old school brass rail bars, which is those blue collar taverns fueled by rye bread, cigarettes and cheap liquor. And a little fun Detroit footnote, Boesky attended Mumford High School. Does that mean anything to you? No.
Mumford High School later achieved pop culture immortality thanks to Eddie Murphy's gray sweatshirt in Beverly Hills Cop. Oh, yeah. Okay. He has a Mumford sweatshirt. I love that. Yeah. So Boesky actually went there. From the sounds of it, Ivan strove for more. There's a peculiar quote from his second cousin found in a Time magazine article. He had this capacity for single mindedness.
He drove himself mercilessly as far as exercise goes. That's the most unrelatable sentence I've ever heard in my life. Yeah, it goes on to talk about how he does hundreds of push-ups, which is odd, but I guess speaks to like a driven sort of character as a young man. Have you ever watched someone with incredible focus and drive and just thought, that's really impressive before ā
realizing that's the energy that also is wrecking everything. Yes. But also they almost seemed, you can't picture them laughing or saying something originally funny, or you just, they almost feel like carbon copies of carbon copies of people. Yeah, I know what you mean. I don't understand that drive. It's a little bit Elon Musk's arc, right? Yeah.
It feels like he was this incredibly inspiring, kind of relentless innovator. And then, whoa, whoa, it just went so far over the... The line. Yeah. At some point. Yeah. The ambition gets taken away or just takes off way too far. I also think some kids speaking of the eighties, I think you watched movies.
I think there's a lot of us that saw something like the karate kid and wanted to be Daniel LaRusso. And then some people were like, no, I want to be Johnny. I want to be the blonde headed dude. Who's clearly a bad guy. And it's, you see that in their lives. Yeah. That's so interesting.
I mean, I definitely when I saw those guys jumping motorcycles around in their skeleton Halloween costumes, I was like, I definitely want to be that. Right. But when Daniel LaRusso like kicks him in the face with the swan kick, I'm like, yeah. That's who I want to be. You're like, that's the guy.
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Chapter 7: How did Boesky's actions influence Wall Street regulations?
Yeah. Yeah. While in school, Boesky married Seema Silberstein in 1962, daughter of real estate lawyer and hotel tycoon Ben Silberstein. We could probably actually do a whole story on Silberstein. He is fascinating in and of himself. But here's a quick anecdote. Allegedly, when he was younger, he was turned away from the Beverly Hills Hotel.
On a subsequent visit with his youngest daughter, Muriel, she exclaimed that he thought ā He should simply buy the place. And so he did. I guess it's kind of a fuck you. He just bought the hotel for $5.5 million in 1954. Wow. That's just over $66 million today, and I think it's worth a lot more than that.
Safe to say Boesky was well aware of this class differential he was marrying into and really wanted to prove himself. After graduating from the Detroit College of Law, he drifted through a series of soul-sucking gigs, law clerk, accountant, kind of rinse and repeat, none of it sticking, none of it satisfying. Yeah. Then his father died in 1964.
Boesky took over the family's last brass rail bar and rebranded it Le Club a Go-Go. No. And brought in sort of like topless dancers and all. Just made it a kind of tawdry, salacious affair. And, of course, it was bankrupt within two years. God, the Brass Rail Bar is so fun.
Every time I hear that, I think of Rudy when his dad threw him and his brother out of the bar when all the guys were off work at the mill and they were just drinking at the bar. And then Rudy was... Sean Astin was doing something and his dad told the owner to throw them out. It lives in my mind forever because I thought, why don't you just tell your son to leave the bar?
Why does the owner have to now get involved in throwing your kid out of the bar? But I always picture that. 5 p.m., blue collar, guys in their destroyed clothing from working at the mill just having beers. And it just seems so cozy. Now introduce like a burlesque dancer to that vibe. And it was not successful. It went bankrupt in two years. Boesky at the time was not exactly happy.
His father-in-law would constantly let him know how unhappy he was with his daughter's choices. He nicknamed Ivan Boski, Ivan the bum, and openly referred to him as a ne'er-do-well who would amount to nothing, which is kind of a brutal way to talk to your son-in-law. I feel like Ivan Broksky was right there for the taking, and he went with the bum. Yeah. Oh, gosh.
You're going to be a tough father-in-law. I'm excited. With that kind of nickname. Yeah.
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Chapter 8: What lessons can we learn from Ivan Boesky's story?
For the nicknames. This is an interesting one. How much of a person's identity or, you know, ambition gets shaped by all the people shouting at them that they're a failure? Yeah. Of course. Oh my God. Absolutely.
I mean, that's like the, the core of representation in entertainment and how you're represented, like in entertainment and who you are that you, you know, when you start to identify with people who look like you or you feel like you relate to, like, that's what inspires the idea that you think, well, I'm just meant to be a failure or I can be a success, you know, for sure. But you're right.
Like criticism like that, it starts to become your reality. Yeah, it can either destroy someone or, like, give them, like, very intense fuel. Yeah. And I would also say that's probably not, like, good fuel, healthy fuel. Vengeful. Vengeful fuel. It's like I want to be a success not because I want to, like, have nice vacations with my family.
It's because I want to make this other person feel like shit. Yeah. Forever doubted me. Because I want to buy a hotel when they refuse service. Yeah. That really puts me in my place. I couldn't do that at a gas station or if I went to a fast food place and they disrespected me, I'd be like, you just wait. I'm going to buy this place.
I'm going to need about 20 years just to kind of get the green together, but I'll show you. Well, needless to say, Boesky was extremely motivated, in part probably to best his father-in-law. He and Seema moved to the Big Apple. Now, Rory, that is a Wall Street term for New York City. Okay. Okay. You said we were going to learn today. You said that. The big apple. Make a note of it. Yeah.
Now, I guess father-in-law Silberstein was at least kind enough to put them up in a Park Avenue apartment. He even bankrolled banks. Bosque's first company with $700,000. This was 1975, and Ivan had found his passion and promise on Wall Street. He was an incredibly hard worker, allegedly clocking 20-hour work days.
This is an interesting thing that sort of emerges in a lot of biographical material about him. He never ate anything. He would go to these big, you know, functions and meals or like host big things, dinner parties and this and that. And like no one ever saw him eat. He would have like a grape or like little nibbles of things.
And he was like, as we mentioned before, relentlessly working out just like a very intense guy and also never slept. It's just one of those weird vampire dudes who can like, like I have my sleep tracker and if it's like less than eight hours, I'm just like, oh God, this is going to be a hard day. Yeah. Your day's ruined. My day's ruined.
I go into the day already like, ah, I'm on half a tank, guys. And you're like, if I could just get three pastries in my body, I bet I could find some fuel in there. I'm Bailey Taylor, and this is It Girl. You may know me from my It Girl series I've done on the streets of New York over the years. Well, I've got good news. I am bringing those interviews and many more to this podcast.
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