Debating Dr. Jason Fung On Calories & Insulin
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What is the main topic of this episode?
Today we're joined by Dr. Jason Fung, a leading nephrologist and author of the best-selling book, The Obesity Code. Dr. Fung has taken the social media world by storm, igniting passionate discussion surrounding calories and their value when it comes to weight loss. His belief is that insulin and other hormones are more impactful than calories when it comes to weight management. Today, I wanted to directly discuss some of these hotly contested statements and find some common ground in this highly complex and often heated nutrition space. Turns out, it's way more complicated than I thought. So for the very first time, I'm trying a new truth-seeking approach where upon a significant point of disagreement during the conversation, you will hear this sound.
And that is to signal to you that there's a footnote in the description of this video leading to a separate short video clearing up the controversy with sources. Get ready for a deep dive on the science of nutrition, weight loss, and reversing chronic disease. Let's get started. Dr. Fung, I'm really excited to talk with you on a topic that very much needs more attention, the topic of obesity.
How does obesity relate to diabetes?
As you've said in previous conversations, I mean, we've had guests talking about it. We're in a crisis state where 60, maybe now 70% overweight or obese as a nation here, at least in the United States. I'm assuming similar figures in Canada or- A little less, but- A little bit less, but also climbing- But also very high. And truly a worldwide issue, right? More pandemic than epidemic at this point. I've heard your very strong interest in the topic, but you're a nephrologist, which is a kidney specialist and not necessarily the specialty that usually talks about obesity. How did you find that to be a topic that you were so passionate about?
Yeah, it sort of followed from type 2 diabetes. So what happened from 1977 is that obesity went up. And about 10 years later, 12 years later, what you saw is a huge epidemic of type 2 diabetes, which is very closely related diseases. And so once you have the type 2 diabetes, you can develop kidney disease somewhere around 10 or 15 years into the diagnosis of type 2 diabetes. So as you get, so 1977, you start to see this uptick in obesity. By 1990, you see uptick in type 2 diabetes. By 2000, 2002, when I'm getting out in practice, now you're starting to see diabetic nephropathy like all over the place. And it's by far and away the biggest cause of kidney disease. So the two big ones really is type 2 diabetes and hypertension.
So both of them are related in some way because they're very much metabolic diseases, they're related to weight and so on. And to lifestyle. And to lifestyle, exactly. And the point was that around 2008, 2009, I realized that as a nephrologist, As a medical profession, we had been thinking about this completely the wrong way. So when people develop their type 2 diabetes, we give them medications such as insulin. They gain weight. But we didn't actually change the course of the disease. And that's in 2008, 2009, several very large trials, the ACCORD trial, the ADVANCE trial.
What is the role of insulin in weight management?
and the VADT came out, all of it showed that if you control the sugars, the blood sugars, by giving lots of insulin, then you actually don't change the course of the organ damage. So you're not slowing down the kidney disease or heart disease or mortality in any significant way.
And so I really started... Wait, are you saying by controlling sugar levels, blood sugar levels, you weren't controlling mortality and morbidity rates?
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Chapters
8 chapters
1
What is the main topic of this episode?
0:25–1:37
2
How does obesity relate to diabetes?
1:37–3:46
3
What is the role of insulin in weight management?
3:46–6:24
4
Are calories the only factor in weight loss?
6:24–9:10
5
How does intermittent fasting work?
9:10–14:34
6
What are the implications of counting calories?
14:34–19:51
7
How can dietary changes impact type 2 diabetes?
19:51–22:35
8
What are the benefits of a low-carb diet?
22:35–1:58:50
Speakers
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