Chapter 1: What is the main topic discussed in this episode?
Hey, there's something I got to tell you. You're not going to hear this, but I got to tell you, it's on you. It is your job to stop the fascist takeover of our country. It's on you. I know, I know, you don't want to hear it. No, you don't want to hear it. But in the movie that is made about this era, the camera is zooming in right now on you, on your character. It is on you.
And I know you're like, but I'm not ready. I don't know what to do. I didn't train or whatever. No, you know, Neil wasn't ready. Luke Skywalker wasn't ready. Katniss wasn't ready. Shuri from the Black Panther wasn't ready. Moana wasn't ready. Those pups on Paw Patrol are never ready. Except for Chase. He's a cop. But yeah, it's on you.
It's on you to figure out how to stop America's fascist takeover. Jesus Christ. He wasn't ready either, actually. Yeah, but it's on you. No politicians are going to save us. Nobody else. It's on you. You're welcome. I'm sorry. On this episode of The Commercial Break.
When the president has troops and his law enforcement kidnapping people off streets and taking them to places where they don't want to go and not giving them ever access to a lawyer in that process, that's fascism. Ta-da! Congratulations. You're Venezuela. Yeah, no, and I think Venezuela, we did an episode of United Shades of America about Venezuela. I remember.
So I'm happy, not happy, but to hear your wife say that and hear her positive, I'm like, oh, so I've been right. I've been saying this happened in Venezuela. And one day you look up and, as I learned in that episode, and suddenly you're using the currency for a napkin because it's not worth anything because they've totally raided everything and nothing is worth anything anymore.
And people are using garbage or emptying out garbage cans to steal water. It's like that... that we're on that track right now. The next episode of the commercial break starts now. Oh, yeah, cats and kittens, welcome back to the commercial break.
I'm Brian Green, and there's no one here with me as Chrissy is out on her menfo break, but I had an opportunity to talk to W. Kamau Bell on a TCB infomercial Tuesday, and I'm super excited to share that conversation with you. If you do not know W. Kamau, he is an American comedian, television show host, political commentarian, general observationalist of the world around us.
And I do appreciate what he has to say. Actually, I feel and I'll tell him this. I feel like I'm bringing a cotton swab to a knife fight because W. Kamau is currently the reigning celebrity Jeopardy champion amongst all the other things that he is. The United Shades of America was a very popular show that was on CNN for, I don't know, seven or eight years. It had a number of seasons.
And I watched almost every episode of that because it's a great look into the psychology and psyche of America at that time. I think that it started filming in like maybe the mid 2000s and or yeah, maybe the mid 2000s. No, no, no, no, no. In the mid-2010s. And then it just ended a couple of years ago. Go check out that show. He's also on tour. He's doing Select Cities.
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Chapter 2: How does W. Kamau Bell prepare for uncomfortable conversations?
I'd like to get his opinion. I'm laughing because he is currently the spokesperson, like the television spokesperson for the ACLU. And so I just saw a commercial with him on it for the ACLU. And now he's going to be here on my television screen yet again. So Why don't we do this? Let's take a break.
And when we get back through the magic of telepodcasting, I will bring W Kamau here, and we will have a nice conversation with him, and we will ask him all the pertinent questions, like... Is there any chance that democracy survives the current shit show? And, you know, we'll see what he has to say. I hope there's an optimistic answer to this. I really do.
Because I'm looking for optimism in a lot of different corners, and I don't see a whole bunch. But, you know, we'll hold on. We'll hold strong. We'll keep the faith. Doesn't matter which side of the aisle you're on. We all got to defend democracy, free speech, human rights, all that good stuff. That's just, you know, basic shit that we should do.
And I don't care whether or not you like what I'm about to say. We should not have troops in American cities. We just shouldn't. It just should not be happening. But, you know, we also shouldn't be kidnapping people off the street in unmarked patrol cars with unmarked officers having masks on their face. All that stuff is kind of dystopian.
It's kind of bullshit and it should stop and it should stop immediately. So... I'm not a bleeding heart liberal. I just think that we are all getting desensitized to something that is clearly fucked up. If you would have 20 years ago said to yourself that this is what is going to be happening in these United States of America, I think you would laugh.
You would be like, there's no way that doesn't happen in the United States of America. Well, it's happening. And so we all should speak up and we should all defend the rights of ourselves and the rights of other people, um, Yeah. Okay. That's it. That's all I'm going to say so as not to turn every single listener of the commercial break off. Anyway, I enjoyed this conversation. I hope you do too.
I'll be back afterwards to wrap it all up. We'll be back. Hey, it's Rachel, your new voice of God here on TCB. And just like you, I'm wondering just how much longer this podcast can continue. Let's all rejoice that another episode has made it to your ears, and I'll rejoice that my check is in the mail.
Speaking of mail, get your free TCB sticker in the mail by going to tcbpodcast.com and visiting the Contact Us page. You can also find the entire commercial break library, audio and video, just in case you want to look at Chrissy, at tcbpodcast.com. Want your voice to be on an episode of the show? Leave us a message at 212-433-3TCB. That's 212-433-3822.
Tell us how much you love us, and we'll be sure to let the world know on a future episode. Or you could make fun of us. That'd be fine, too. We might not air that, but maybe. Oh, and if you're shy, that's okay. Just send a text. We'll respond. Now I'm going to go check the mailbox for payment while you check out our sponsors. And then we'll return to this episode of the commercial break.
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Chapter 3: What role does comedy play in addressing societal divides?
How are you doing? I guess I feel old when people are honored you show up. I guess I just, you know. Hey, listen. But I'll take it. Yeah, you could be Huntrix or whatever, and I'd be honored to have you on also. Sure, sure, sure. You know, because my kids. Yeah, no, for sure, for sure. I'd be honored to have Olivia Rodrigo on my podcast. No shit. No shit.
You know, listen, the world is run by the youth, the youths, as they would say. And I don't know how old you are, but I'm making the assumption we're around the same age and we are not the youths anymore. Those days have long passed. I'm a proud member of the greatest generation, a.k.a. Generation X. Amen. Amen. Generation X. So you grew up in the 90s just like I did, 80s and 90s just like I did.
I was telling a friend of mine who's currently in Chicago, and we were bantering back and forth about all the stuff that's going on in Chicago, but we both grew up across the street from each other. Haven't seen each other in a long time, but I said –
Totally off topic of politics, I said, my children will never know what it's like to get up on a Saturday morning and be babysat by Hanna-Barbera. They just will never know that. Hanna-Barbera and a sugary cereal. And I feel like they're missing out on that. Yeah. I mean, I think it's, I really noticed, especially like I've had, I have three daughters.
And so it's funny how much it's even changed from the 14 year old to the seven year old that I have now and how much more access she has to, I want to see exactly what I want, when I want to see it as many times I want to see it. Whereas when my 14 year old was born, there was streaming, but it was like a Netflix. The only like Disney movie they had on Netflix was Aristocats. So we saw that a lot.
And I was like, I had no idea this was so racist. Uh, But yeah, so it's like just and she had access to streaming. And it's funny, it always it would always end up we'd go to a hotel and she would turn on the TV and be like, I want to watch. And she would say something like, we can't do that here. We have to sort of do whatever the hotel wants. But yeah, the choice is different.
I don't understand that either. You know, it was funny because I guess when... When TiVo was a thing, like the very first DVR where you had to have a complicated piece of machinery installed on your TV by a technician to record a program. I'm on my second marriage, but on my practice marriage, my mother-in-law was one of the first that I knew of to get one of those TiVos.
And I happened to be the guy who had to go meet the technician at the time she was out of town. And the technician was playing around and checking to make sure everything worked. And he goes, you know, it's crazy. I don't think my kids are ever going to watch a commercial in their entire life. They were young. And I laughed. I thought it was a funny thing that he said.
And now I realize if they don't choose to, they won't watch a commercial in their entire lives. It's insane. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, the difference is commercials, you're not a way to sneak back in there, but you can still pay your way out of commercials if you want to. True. $5.99 with commercials, $89.99 without commercials. It seems crazy to be watching HBO when there's a commercial.
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Chapter 4: How does Kamau Bell view the current state of democracy?
Right. But it's really populism at the end of the day is is what it is. It's it's populism. And then it turns into fascism. And so my father and Hitler was a socialist. It doesn't matter what you call it.
And my father-in-law made this point to me so many years ago, that decade ago when we met and the kind of Trump was moving on the scene, he would probably have considered himself more of a conservative if he lived here and he was voting here. Right. But he said to me one day, he said, it doesn't matter what you call it.
It's a circle and it all ends up in extremism, all ends up in the right place, in the same place, the exact same place. And he couldn't have been more right about that. And I wonder when you were doing Fifty Shades... Fifty Shades? When you were doing Fifty Shades... Hey! Yeah, sexy. You looked hot in that movie, just letting you know. When you were doing the CNN show... United Shades.
United Shades of America. When you were doing that show... Years ago, did you smell this coming? Did you could you tell just by being out there on the streets, having these really tough conversations and really interesting positions? Could you tell that the country was kind of pulling itself apart? So, yeah, it's interesting. When we started the show, Barack Obama was in his last year in office.
And at that point, there was this idea that he was about to hand off the presidency to a woman named Hillary Clinton. That it was going to be a smooth transition. Because how could Donald Trump ever win? And I remember being at a kid's birthday, like a birthday party with one of my kid's friends in Berkeley, California. And this old hippie guy was like, yeah, we thought Reagan was a joke, too.
And so we thought there was no way Ronald Reagan would ever be governor of California, let alone president of the United States. And that really was like, click. And then we did an episode of United Shades where we did two episodes in the same season. I think it was the same season.
One was on the south side of Chicago with men who were in gangs and black men who were in gangs on the south side and west side of Chicago. And then we did an episode in Appalachia with white ex-coal miners. And I remember thinking these two people would say they are in different ends of the political spectrum or they would say, I don't believe in whatever the other party is.
Chicago is a very democratic city. Appalachia is a very red state. And yet they all want the same things. They want better jobs. They want higher wages. They want more access to health care. They want better schools for their kids. They want there to be less potholes in the streets. So. but they've been, but, but political parties are weaponizing their differences against them.
So they think I want the opposite of what that guy wants. And you both want, you want, and you've been told if that guy gets what he wants, then that means I get less of what I want when it's like, no, that's not how it actually ever should work, but that's how the political parties. So yeah, I would say I was really clear about the division in the country between like was planted.
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Chapter 5: What insights does Kamau share about his experiences with the KKK?
And how do you put that cat back in the bag? You aren't going to. It's not going to happen unless a few brave men and women stand up and do that. I have a question for you personally, because I watched one of your episodes. It really affected me. I think it was the one where you went and you were kind of talking to KKK members. How do you prepare for that mentally? Yeah. I mean, I understand.
I'm sure you get this question a lot, but it's just a curiosity. It has got me on this one. How do you prepare for that mentally? How do you keep your fists in your pockets? I don't know. I mean, so that one specifically was the very first episode of United Shades we ever take. It was the pilot episode that sold the series.
So I was the one who pitched that idea because it was the idea of the show was like – black guy goes places he shouldn't go or you wouldn't expect him to go. And so they were like the country club or the golf course. And I was like, or the KKK rally. Cause I was like, you got to go big or go home. But then it was like, it really was.
The hardest thing about that episode was that it was the pilot, so I didn't even know the crew that well. And I didn't know the producers that well. So at the times in the making of that episode, when me, Kamau Bell, the human, was having an emotional reaction to something, there was nobody to turn to, really, and be like, help! And...
I mean, there was a friend of mine who was a producer on that episode, but there was just really nobody in control to turn to and be like, this doesn't work for me. This thing you're asking me to do doesn't work for me. And if I have to explain it to you, I'm going to start weeping.
So I had a friend of mine who was there to help, but they just really didn't disregard him or me as being like, as far as they were concerned. you know, host of a TV show can meet a lot of different things. And some hosts are just like wind up toys. And that's what they want to do. Like, I'll just sort of tell me where to go, what to say, how to do it.
I think of a little bit like Chris Harrison from the bachelor. He doesn't actually care at all. Who gets the rose. He's just supposed to ask, you know what I mean? We make fun of it all the time. He walks in 30 seconds and he goes, gentlemen, there's one rose left. And he walks back out. And he goes back to the hotel, the nine star hotel in Thailand where they're staying. That's right. Uh,
And so, but I was like, I wanted to do this because of the work I'd seen Morgan Spurlock do and Anthony Bourdain do and Michael Moore. And so I was like, I want to be in it and have decisions and make decisions. It took me several years to get that level of control. But that episode, there was just times, right? Like for the thing, the story I always tell is like,
at the, at the, the, the meeting, those clan members in the forest where we're going to do the cross burning later. And we were there for hours because they wanted it for, we got there early and it had to get dark. And I'm talking to the clans members and they're filming. And at some point I look around and I realized that the crew has their cameras down.
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Chapter 6: How can individuals take action against societal issues?
So it just like stayed clear for me. The person who was the most angry at me was this blonde, white, young white woman who looked like she would come in third in a Britney Spears, young Britney Spears lookalike contest. And I remember thinking like, Your biggest problem is you live here. Yeah. Like, if I took you to L.A., you would have a totally different life.
You'd have a totally different opinion. But you live here. You'd be dating an NBA basketball player. Exactly. Yeah, yeah, yeah. But you don't know the – and I really, from that, I took – a lot of what they were mad about was the circumstances they were born into that they couldn't escape. And somebody had weaponized that, saying it's black people's fault.
Meanwhile, they lived in Dawson Springs, Kentucky, a town that's not that black. Like, so you're mad at black people. And there's not that many black people around here. And the ones who are know you're in the clan. So not messing with you. They're like, they all know you're in the clan. So I think the idea being that, like, again, it's the site that like people's people's affections.
fears are being weaponized against them. So these guys live in a town where there's not a lot of jobs, not a lot of opportunities. And somebody has told them, especially at that point, it's Barack Obama's fault, the black guy. And the thing that I saw, because at the time when the episode aired, Trump was still not being really taken seriously as a candidate.
And some people were like, why would you do this show about the Klan? Who cares about the Klan? And cut to a year later, Trump is like an ongoing concern and going to win. And then some of that episode, it's like, since it's aired, it's grown bigger because it sort of pointed the direction that the country was going. Yeah, very interesting. It really was kind of a litmus test.
I remember watching the episode. I don't remember if I watched it when it first ran, but I just remember watching it. And I'm like, I... I mean, I'm obviously not a black man. I have had no, I have had, I won the genetic lottery in that sense, but I just from a little kid because no, no, no, no, no, no. I, I won the genetic lottery. I'm six foot four. I'm six four.
Well, then you are, I'm a short King. So then there you go. Um, But I just remember just because of the way that I was raised in Chicago that I just had a lot of hatred for the KKK. Like that just to me was the emblematic of everything that could go wrong in the human psyche and was also like an earmark of how much...
how big our problems are here in the United States of America when it comes to race. My wife comes from Venezuela, and she goes, I just can't believe how big of a problem racism is now. You know, Venezuela's a different country, right? But they have indigenous people, they have black people, and, you know, you go to other places, and it's just different. We just magnify it here.
We magnify it, and it's been magnified from the moment, right? Well, because we built the country on that. I mean, I think, like, certainly... like other countries have their own problems. They, they would call it nationality instead of racism.
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Chapter 7: What is the significance of platforms like Substack for content creators?
What religion are you – do your parents or whoever's around you, you grow up in? All these things are non – Choice. You don't make those choices. And largely your parents didn't make those choices and their parents didn't make those choices. So then we go around demonizing people based on things that they have no control over at all whatsoever.
But we point to them and we say they're the problem and they're the bad guys and they're the evil ones and they need to get out of here. And they've committed some, you know, crimes.
horrendous felony for crossing over an imaginary line in the sand when they had zero choice in it you just won the fucking lottery that's the only thing that happened to you dude and you wanted at this point in history because at another point in history if you'd been born in that same place you wouldn't you wouldn't have won the lottery you know what i mean so we're like again we're talking about that line shifts and moves and the and that country's reputation means something different 100 years on either direction of whatever of whatever date you were born
It's so true. And I wish that more people could see that when we're ripping parents away from children at bus stops and when we're, you know, just on the news today, or when a young lady goes to the store to get food for her house and her mom's not there.
When we're doing this to these people, the horrendous offense that they have committed, most of them, the horrendous offense that they have committed is walking over that imaginary line and not filling out the paperwork. That's it. That's the only thing that they have done. But, you know, this has been going on forever.
And I really hope that soon we, meaning the collective we, find a way to stand up and say, not in this country. Like, not right now. We're not going to do this. I hope, I pray that that is what happens. How do you personally... Being an intellectual, being a commentarian on political and just social life in general, how do you balance comedy and the very serious nature of what's going on?
You come across as pretty funny a lot of the times, but you're talking about things that's pretty serious. I mean, people ask me that question, and I think the thought is that somehow I was like a political science professor at a liberal arts college going, how do I get the message across? And then I go, jokes. You know what I mean?
And I think the person I've been talking about a lot recently that I'm sort of walking the giant footsteps of is Dick Gregory. Dick Gregory, first of all, before he was a comedian, he was like a great, he was like a track athlete.
So I think the idea is that you can, and then he became a comedian and he just wanted to be a comedian and really was like on the path to like, he was like the first black comedian to sit on the panel on like the, I think it was the Jack Parr show, the Tonight Show. And they booked him on the show and said, he's like, can I sit on the panel? They said, no, because you're black.
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Chapter 8: How does Kamau balance humor with serious social commentary?
Doesn't mean she's not blah, blah. Fair enough. She's certainly going to be a better president. But I think that one of the things that Barack Obama had in spades, which is a funny thing to say about the black guy, is that he was hyper charismatic. His charisma. So that Mitt Romney never stood it. It didn't matter if Mitt Romney was. Mitt Romney was a vacuum of charisma.
Mitt Romney was a stiff sock. Let's admit it. He was a sock who got overstarched. I mean, he was never going to win. No, he was never going to win. And you see it in elections. There's like 19 people running for mayor of New York, and Eric Adams won because he just had a personality. You know what I mean? He's just a cool cat. Yeah, he's a cool cat. Yeah. And they found out.
But then what happens? You get an offer. Oh, we shouldn't have elected a cool cat. We should have elected one of the qualified people. Exactly. Yeah. But I think that like there's just a way in which every public speaker wants to be open with a joke. Every public speaker wants to be funny because if people are laughing, you know, they're paying attention.
If they're not laughing, you can think that you can think they're paying attention, but they can be thinking about their laundry. Yeah, exactly. You and I both know, how did President Bill Clinton get into office? How did he get into office? Going on Arsenio Hall and playing that damn saxophone. That's it. He got the white people, he got the black people in one fall swoop.
And then he got the young people when he went on MTV and answered Boxers or Briefs, I think. Oh yeah, that's right, Boxers or Briefs. I did not inhale. I tried it, but I did not inhale. Yeah, I didn't inhale.
depends on the definition of what is is okay so but yes i think that he was one of the first ones to understand that i mean as you know goes back to kennedy initially but like that being in being a part of the pop culture is actually helpful to this and and trump understands that too he's just a part of a pop culture that i don't want to be a part of so but that's why he's on like the joe rogan show and theo vaughn show and
And Andrew Schultz, because he understands connecting with both and Aiden Ross, all these people who are now regretting stumping and endorsing him, stumping for and endorsing him. But he understood that pop culture was important. I say to those guys who I share the podcast fear with, I say, we'll argue about it later. Keep speaking out. Keep telling people that you made a mistake. That's okay.
We'll argue about why later, right? But now we're at where we're at, and it's good that you're speaking up at all. Go ahead. But I would say that I agree with you. I would just say this. I wrote a subsection about the 12 steps to recovery from MAGA for comedians. And one of those steps is make amends. Fair enough. It's not enough to go like, I should have done that.
Well, you've also alienated a bunch of people who you did that to. So that means you've got to do more work to come back. It's not enough to go, I don't agree with him anymore. In AA, you can't just go to one meeting and go, I quit drinking, everybody. I'm done, and never go to another meeting again.
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