Have you ever been in a conversation where no matter what you say, it’s clear—there’s no winning? Some people are committed to misunderstanding you. In today’s episode, I’m breaking down how to protect your peace, stand your ground, and keep your integrity when someone’s trying to make you the villain in their story. Whether it’s a bully, a manipulator, or someone you just can’t reason with, this episode will help you hold your standard and respond without losing yourself. This episode is sponsored by Cozy Earth. Upgrade Your Every Day. Get 40% off at cozyearth.com/jefferson or use code JEFFERSON at check out. Order my new book, The Next Conversation, or listen to the full audiobook today. Also, come meet me on my book tour! Like what you hear? Don’t forget to subscribe and leave a 5-star review! Suggest a topic or ask a question for me to answer on the show! Want a FREE communication tip each week? Click here to join my newsletter. Join My School of Communication Watch my podcast on YouTube Follow me on Instagram Follow me on TikTok Follow me on LinkedIn Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices
What does it mean when there's no winning in a conversation?
Have you ever found that there are some people, there's just no winning? You're in conversation with this person and you realize there is nothing I can say that is going to appease you. There's nothing I can say that's going to make this better. On today's episode, that's exactly what I want to delve into. Welcome to the Jefferson Fisher Podcast. I'm coming to you from my hotel room in Chicago.
In about 20 minutes, I'm going to be leaving out that door for my book signing. And I am thrilled. I'm excited for it. Just came from LA. Actually, real quick, I'm pulling... You can see how my phone is propped up by this ironing board. I have a Wrigley Field is right out my window, so I'm really excited.
I haven't been able to tour yet, haven't had time, but I wanted to take a second to talk to you about something. I'll do the whole intro here in a second, but right now, this is what I want to stick in your mind. Some people, and you notice this when you're in conversation with them, There is no piece of advice I can give you. There's not a word, a twist of a sentence.
There's not a structure for a conversation that is ever going to get them to your side of the court because they are committed to misunderstanding you. These are people that... no matter what you do, they are looking for a villain. In other words, they are trying to create an enemy in the conversation.
And you might have felt this in a place of kind of how I started the episode of, it doesn't matter what I say, I'm never going to get there with you. It doesn't matter what I do, no matter how many times I apologize, these are people that are looking for a villain. And this is what I mean by that. They are deciding to behave a certain way in communication, in conversation, in an argument.
And they know internally that how they're behaving is wrong. They're saying things that are attacking your personal character. They are exhibiting narcissistic behaviors. They are trying to be manipulative. They are saying things that are hurtful. Maybe they're lying. Maybe they're just wanting to put you down. And they're doing that, and inside they know they are.
They just really don't care about it. But even more so, they are wanting something from you. They're wanting a response. They're wanting an emotional reaction out of you in that very moment. Can you see it? Can you picture that person in your mind? Can you picture that conversation?
What they're doing, and if we could zoom in on that moment, what they're hoping is for you to react and respond in a way that ratchets it up. If they come at you with a level three insult, they are hoping that you're going to respond with a level five. If they start yelling at a level six, they are hoping you start yelling at a level seven. They want you to do more.
Because right now, they know that they're looking bad. They know it internally. But if they can get you to act worse... That's the key. If they can get you to act worse, well, then that's all the better because you're in that argument and it's going over and over and it boils over and you say something that takes it a little bit too far and they go, aha. I knew it. I knew you were this person.
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