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The Joe Rogan Experience

#2308 - Jordan Peterson

Tue, 22 Apr 2025

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Jordan Peterson is a clinical psychologist, co-founder of the educational platform Peterson Academy, host of "The Jordan B. Peterson Podcast," and the author of several bestselling books. His most recent title is "We Who Wrestle with God: Perceptions of the Divine." www.jordanbpeterson.com Get 20% off premium protein meat sticks at https://paleovalley.com/rogan Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

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Transcription

Chapter 1: Who are the main guests and hosts on this episode?

3.993 - 5.815 Joe Rogan

The Joe Rogan Experience.

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6.216 - 22.895 Jordan Peterson

Showing by day, Joe Rogan Podcast by night, all day. No, no. I'm too vain. That's exactly right. I look back and I think, oh, those headphones are pushing at my hair. Isn't that sad? That's so sad.

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22.935 - 25.397 Tom Segura

You shave your head. That's sad. You never look back if you do.

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25.417 - 26.078 Jordan Peterson

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

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26.098 - 27.058 Tom Segura

Oh, it's the greatest thing in the world.

27.499 - 32.222 Jordan Peterson

It's freedom. I have a big dent here from when a meteorite landed on me when I was a kid.

32.483 - 34.604 Tom Segura

A meteorite. Oh, funny story.

34.664 - 34.945 Jordan Peterson

I know.

Chapter 2: What are the psychological effects of head trauma and personal injury?

35.085 - 55.183 Tom Segura

I've got plenty of cuts on my head. I've got them all over the place. Well, you're looking pretty unscarred. Oh, the back of my head. I have one when I was a little kid. It's pretty big. One of these cranes that lifts up sewer pipes. Those big concrete pipes bang me off the back of the head. Oh, yeah, that's not good. I grayed out, went to the hospital.

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55.223 - 61.125 Tom Segura

Were you a different person before that experience? I don't know. I don't need to have talked to my mom. I was always a little wild.

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61.145 - 63.166 Jordan Peterson

This could be of autobiographical significance.

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63.346 - 67.147 Tom Segura

Oh, there's definitely a lot of head trauma. Were you knocked out?

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67.227 - 70.088 Jordan Peterson

No, no. I stayed conscious, but I got close. That's the big predictor.

70.128 - 80.872 Tom Segura

I got gray. I grayed out. I came back to it. I didn't completely go unconscious. So Jamie went golfing this weekend with OJ Simpson's Golf Clubs.

81.735 - 87.038 Jordan Peterson

Uh-oh. Not with OJ. He's not here. You should be exercised. That would be the next step.

87.078 - 89.179 Tom Segura

Jamie bought OJ Simpson's golf clubs.

89.999 - 91.52 Jordan Peterson

This is like a childhood dream?

Chapter 3: How do distractions like social media and algorithms affect youth decision-making?

6708.744 - 6735.028 Jordan Peterson

So Cain's sacrifices are rejected by God. And God tells him, if you brought your best to the table, you'd be accepted. And Cain gets bitter and resentful, and... invites temptation in to possess him, so that spirit of resentment possesses him, and then he becomes murderous. He kills his brother, and his descendants become genocidal, and then you have the flood.

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6736.124 - 6758.433 Jordan Peterson

And so that pattern of sacrifice is established right at the beginning of the biblical texts. Abel versus Cain. Abel brings the best to the table, and that satisfies God. So one question. God actually asks Cain this when Cain complains. He says, wouldn't you be accepted if you were doing your best? So that's a question of conscience, right?

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6758.473 - 6786.218 Jordan Peterson

If you're in extreme misery and your life is hollow and empty and you're bitter and resentful, it's like... You bringing your best to the table? Because the covenant proclaims that if you did, you'd be accepted. Yeah, clearly. Okay, so now the question is what constitutes, now you know you have to sacrifice. So sacrifice becomes the foundation of the state, not power, not hedonism, sacrifice.

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6786.838 - 6808.154 Jordan Peterson

And then that motif is played out through the whole Bible and that's what culminates in the New Testament, right? Total sacrifice as the foundation of the community. That's right. And like, I don't know how to, what sense to make out of the metaphysics of the religious realm, you know, because that's beyond me and everyone. The world's a strange place and we could leave it at that.

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6808.734 - 6833.792 Jordan Peterson

But the idea that See, Christ is the exemplar of voluntary self-sacrifice, right? Won't turn to power, won't deviate from his course, faces the worst of all possible deaths, descends to hell itself. That's the pattern of life lived with no reserve. And that's the foundation of the free state. That's right. I tried that on Brett, eh? He told me when we first met.

6835.074 - 6859.208 Jordan Peterson

on the tour that he felt that the biblical narratives were anachronistic, you know, that they were written in a time that was no longer relevant to us, but he decided by the end of our three days together that if you got to the core of the message, it's alive, right? That's the living spirit inside the bush, you might say. And that it's, so here's even the weirder thing.

6859.248 - 6878.477 Jordan Peterson

So imagine, it's pretty obvious that Christ is a symbol of voluntary self-sacrifice, right? I don't think it, it doesn't really come as a shock to anyone. But the weird thing is, you know, we put that symbol at the center of our churches and and at the centers of our towns for 2,000 years, not really knowing why.

6879.297 - 6905.905 Jordan Peterson

And the reason is, is that voluntary self-sacrifice is the foundation of the integrated psyche and the stable, productive, and abundant community. And that's right. It's right. And so, well, it's been exciting to have the opportunity over the last nine months to go talk to people about that, because I've talked to about... 150,000 people, I guess, public lectures.

6906.186 - 6929.944 Tom Segura

That to me is one of the most fascinating aspects of Christianity, regardless of whether or not you think Logically, these things took place. Logically, these stories are a completely accurate depiction of exactly how it went. If you follow the principles, it's incredibly beneficial to your spiritual life as a person.

Chapter 4: What is the role of play in human development and relationships?

10091.491 - 10097.595 Tom Segura

Yeah. That's really uncomfortable for people if they have this...

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10098.696 - 10125.699 Jordan Peterson

Idea that's embedded in their consciousness about what's going on to accept that of course of course It's in fact accepting that when that reality is thrust upon you unawares you develop post-traumatic stress disorder Right because it's naive people who encounter malevolence develop PTSD That's the pathway So if you want to make your children susceptible to PTSD like all these kids that are triggered by everything right make them extremely naive and

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10127.188 - 10143.683 Jordan Peterson

And then let them encounter malevolence. Right. Because you're supposed to teach them to handle serpents. Right. To identify them and handle them. And that means they have to learn about the nature of the world and the girls to differentiate between snakes and babies.

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10144.224 - 10144.544 Unknown Speaker

Yeah.

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10144.664 - 10167.277 Jordan Peterson

Right. Right. And babies and men. And the man who worms his way into your dreams because he's a dependent infant, he's a snake. And your sympathy is wasted on him. Yes, there certainly are. Man, I tell you, those riots that used to gather around me, you know, that was mostly 2017, before I stopped speaking at universities mostly.

10168.238 - 10191.896 Jordan Peterson

um the women were pretty bad harpy city man and this self-righteous feminine toxic compassion just screeching at the top of its lungs but the men that were with them oh my god i didn't even i didn't want to be within three feet of them you know it's like i'll be your friend yeah you know you see those people on the net talking to children i'll be your friend

10192.256 - 10203.947 Joe Rogan

When your family abandons you, I'm here for you. You know, they don't understand. Not like me. We could be closer than anybody has been with you.

10205.308 - 10221.145 Jordan Peterson

That just barely scrapes the surface of awful. Like awful is a long, long ways down. Yeah. So part of what's happened in the universities, and, you know, it's a terrible thing to say, well, There's a lot of things.

10221.325 - 10253.189 Jordan Peterson

Storehouse of wealth, radical increase in the number of students served, radical feminization of the institutions, and weakness on the part of the men who should have been guardian of the gates. All of that. And is it repairable? I don't think so. I think once the parasites have the corpse... What are you going to do? Are you going to bring Lazarus back from the dead? You know, I don't think so.

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