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Chapter 1: What historical significance does the GPO hold for Ireland?
Now, to many, the GPO is Ireland's most iconic building, providing the backdrop to many
of our most important national celebrations, including the annual St. Patrick's Day parade. Certainly one of the most visually imposing and impressive of our buildings, one for the ages. It's more than two centuries old. It's a neoclassical building and it was seized by the self-proclaimed provisional government of the New Republic
as part of the 1916 Rising, partly for tactical but also for symbolic reasons. Its interior was destroyed by fire during the siege by British soldiers, but the shell remained standing, as did its centrepiece, the boldly projecting portico of six fluted ionic columns supporting an entablature and cornice.
And the state decided in 1924 to rebuild rather than level the site and start anew, which is why inside the GPO customers can still enjoy the Art Deco beauty of the reconstructed main hall. There's also a specially created visitor centre there, opened in 2016 to give locals and tourists the opportunity to understand the history of the Easter Rising.
Now, the reason I'm saying all this is that today the government has made an announcement about the future of the GPO. And Jack Chambers, the Minister for Public Expenditure, Infrastructure, Public Service Reform and Digitalisation joins us. Good evening to you, Minister. Good evening, Matt.
I wrote all that for a book who really owns Ireland three years ago and also pointed out at the time that the offices behind the main hall had housed the staff of Unpussed for decades, but they were no longer fit for purpose. And the company had already moved to the tallest new office building in the country, the Exo in the North Docklands, leaving the future of the building uncertain.
Three years later, you're finally getting around to doing something about it, are you?
Yeah.
Well, thanks, Matt, and thanks for having me on. I just would say that, look, we want to ensure that we all know the historical significance of this building for O'Connell Street, for our city, for our country. And we want to ensure that we revitalise it, re-renew it for the next 100 years. How do young people today connect with its important history? How do we secure its legacy in the long term?
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Chapter 2: What are the government's initial plans for the GPO redevelopment?
There have been constant discussions. There have been constant plans. And nothing has ever been done. And this is the problem with O'Connell Street. Can you understand why I'd be sceptical when I hear, oh, we're going to draw plans for the GPO.
I do. And look, I hear that and I hear it on other issues of social and economic infrastructure. And what I'm trying to do is give confidence with a funding allocation. It's in our sector investment plan. It's been prioritised over other instances and other areas that we could invest in because we want to future-proof the legacy of the GPL.
How much money have you put aside for it?
So in the sector investment plan, we've set aside between 200 and 500 million is the expected cost over a decade. It'll probably be done on a phased basis. We've also set aside 6 to 8 million euro to renovate some of the areas in the GPO on a short term basis. So we actually bring in community and civic use quickly because...
People walk by the GPO and don't really have access and don't necessarily experience it on a daily basis. That's why, for example, we're going to have a 250-seat cultural and community space in the Telegraph Room where we were today. And that will, I think, bring a lot more people through it to experience it.
And again, there's other opportunities to have, you know, as you said, there's vacant office space where the OPW are looking at bringing, you know, different public servants or civil servants in by renovation.
Could you not do other things with it? Could you not use it as museum space? There was a suggestion previously that maybe the Abbey Theatre would be relocated there.
I think there's, I've met the Abbey Theatre last year and there's obviously separate work ongoing to properly... That's about decades behind as well where it's supposed to be. ...advance that project with the Department of Culture. So, you know, and I've been engaged with the Abbey Theatre on that and their work.
You must be about the 10th minister who's been engaged because the redevelopment of the Abbey has been talked about since the turn of the century.
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Chapter 3: How will the GPO's future be managed by the Office of Public Works?
It was in the programme for government that you wanted to get rid of it. Why is there a rebellion within the Fianna FƔil party now? About 20 parliamentary party members has been reported who want a discussion, which is a euphemism as they don't want to do this.
Well, look, this has been kind of the wider discussion. This has been ongoing for the last three to four years. I believe we should reform the triple lock. I don't believe the likes of Russia or other countries should have a veto on how we deploy our troops.
Chapter 4: What temporary uses are being considered for the GPO during redevelopment?
And it was in our party manifesto going to the last general election.
So if it was in the manifesto, if it was in the programme for government... Why are so many of your parliamentary party now kicking up about it?
There'll be a wider discussion on it, but that's a matter for discussion. We're a healthy debate. But is that another example of the leadership losing control of the party? I don't believe so, because people have a discussion on any issue they like at the parliamentary party.
But why are they only waking up to this now? Is this because they're reacting to social media pressure?
I don't think so. I would make the case that we should reform the Triple Lock, that it's something that we shouldn't have. We haven't had a UN Security Council mandate for the deployment of troops for many, many years. And we should be able to decide our own affairs in the context of the deployment of our troops.
But would it be safe for our troops to go anywhere without a UN mandate?
Well, I think that's an assessment that can be made when we reform the triple lock and when we create a new mechanism that we've decided where the DƔil and government would decide on an informed basis how we deploy our troops. And obviously, that will be a matter for future deployment.
But I don't think we should rely on, you know, a power somewhere else to dictate how we should deploy our troops in a world that's changing. But look, we value debate as a party and I look forward to discussions this evening. Thank you very much.
Minister for Public Expenditure, Jack Chambers.
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