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The Pat Kenny Show

What separates a good speech from a bad one?

03 May 2026

Transcription

Transcript generated automatically by AI and may contain errors.

Chapter 1: What is the main topic discussed in this episode?

1.651 - 4.814 Pat Kenny

The Pat Kenny Show on Newstalk.

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Chapter 2: What prompted King Charles' address to Congress?

6.636 - 23.395 Pat Kenny

King Charles' address to Congress this week landed at a delicate moment in UK-US relations, a relationship that's close, occasionally strained, and shaped as much by tone and symbolism as by policy. King Charles was asked to walk a diplomatic high wire.

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24.015 - 59.653 King Charles

250 years ago, or as we say in the United Kingdom, just the other day... They declared independence. As Oscar Wilde said, we have really everything in common with America nowadays, except, of course, language. It is, in fact, my 20th visit to the United States and my first as king and head of the Commonwealth.

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60.747 - 82.114 King Charles

This is a city which symbolizes a period in our shared history, or what Charles Dickens might have called a tale of two Georges. King George, as you know, never set foot in America. And please rest assured, ladies and gentlemen, I am not here as part of some cunning rearguard action.

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87.494 - 116.573 King Charles

Now, as you may know, when I address my own Parliament at Westminster, we still follow an age-old tradition and take a Member of Parliament hostage, holding him or her at Buckingham Palace until I am safely returned. These days, we look after our guests rather well, to the point that they often do not want to leave.

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116.992 - 141.312 Pat Kenny

There were some of the humorous remarks from King Charles in his address to the Joint Houses of Congress. And, of course, he was witty once again at the dinner that was hosted by Donald Trump in his honor. The speeches, plural, widely seen as an attempt to strike the right balance. And it raises an interesting question. What actually makes a speech work?

141.292 - 154.074 Pat Kenny

I'm joined now in studio by Derek Mooney, former ministerial advisor and speechwriter, to explore what separates the memorable from the forgettable. Derek, good morning and welcome. Morning. First of all, what do you think of the speeches?

154.114 - 178.674 Derek Mooney

Speeches, particularly the one to Congress, was exceptionally good. It managed to have a great mix of wit, many serious points. He was also delivering some slightly tough messages with very well sugar-coated and most importantly, his delivery is exceptionally good. His speech rate is slow, he's methodical, but he has nice inflections.

179.956 - 184.584 Derek Mooney

He speaks in a kind of a language that is probably slightly outdated, but is all the more classic for that.

185.285 - 186.587 Pat Kenny

When he says, by Jove...

Chapter 3: How did King Charles balance humor and serious messaging in his speech?

541.077 - 561.894 Derek Mooney

Absolutely. But it's also interesting to note how different it is from his mother. That this would be a completely different speech if this was Queen Elizabeth delivering it. She probably would have been loads to go as far as he went. But you're absolutely right. He's a very good off-the-cuff speaker. I've seen about two or three events live. And he is very, very good. He can ad lib.

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562.355 - 583.437 Derek Mooney

Now, this goes back to his own familiarity, particularly with comedy. So he always liked The Goon, Spike Milligan in particular. His father was also kind of, Prince Philip, was famously kind of hung around with comedians and made a great line in terms of, I think, his advice to speechwriters and to people giving speeches is what the backside can't endure, the brain can't absorb.

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583.417 - 597.462 Derek Mooney

So there's, I think, therefore, Charles knew just exactly how to pace it. And he also knew something a lot of politicians don't seem to know is how not to talk across your own laugh lines. When you have a reaction, let it play out.

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598.003 - 610.341 Pat Kenny

Let that laugh go and let that applause go on. Now, you mentioned the speed at which a speech is delivered. Sometimes people want to get it over with and they rush it. What is the ideal cadence for a political speech?

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610.361 - 618.353 Derek Mooney

For a political speech, it's normally around 100, 110 words per minute. And that's to allow for applause lines, etc. In Ireland, we're really bad at that.

Chapter 4: What makes a speech memorable versus forgettable?

619.354 - 639.018 Derek Mooney

I think I've done a couple of analysis of various speeches from Micheál Martin, Simon Harris and Mary Lou MacDonald at their Ardèche speeches. And at one stage, Micheál Martin was going at 150 words a minute. And what's clear this happened is somebody has written a speech and haven't worked out. You've only got 23 minutes to deliver it. So then you start to gabble. Then you start to rush it.

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639.899 - 656.522 Derek Mooney

And it becomes like a mad advert for OMO. You're just throwing lines out very, very quickly. And you end up talking across your own applause lines. And that's a mistake. So I think less is more in a lot of these cases. And trust the speaker to be able to fill a gap if they're 10 seconds earlier for 20 seconds.

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656.502 - 672.049 Pat Kenny

And what about explaining? I mean, the hallmark of these two speeches by Charles was the subtlety of the messaging. In other words, he didn't have to spell everything out. It might not have been politic to so do, but he didn't spell everything out. He just let things sit and be absorbed.

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672.67 - 689.969 Derek Mooney

And again, which is... That speaks to the expertise of the people who crafted the speech. They're not doing this for the first time. And no disrespect to the profession, but this isn't written by journalists. This is written by people who write speeches. So there is a very, very useful thing. It's worth looking up.

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Chapter 5: How does delivery impact the effectiveness of a speech?

690.37 - 709.345 Derek Mooney

The Foreign and Commonwealth Office has a speechwriter's guide, a style guide. And it sets out the key elements of it. And it's there. But it's also lots of full stops. Short sentences, simple words, keep the language, avoid jargon, and their message will come across. And people mightn't get it in the minute, but they're going to get it afterwards.

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709.365 - 716.344 Derek Mooney

And knowing nowadays that speeches are replayed constantly on YouTube and in clips, not necessarily watched live.

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716.324 - 725.561 Pat Kenny

Yeah, and of course, many of the people who'd be in the Foreign Office or indeed in Downing Street or in the Palace would be veterans of the Oxford Union, would be well-tutored in the art of archery.

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725.581 - 730.57 Derek Mooney

Absolutely, and there's a lot of people from the HIST and the LNH sitting in Ivy House and government buildings as well.

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730.887 - 736.617 Pat Kenny

Yeah. The speed, is there any particular culprit in Irish terms of too fast?

737.098 - 756.27 Derek Mooney

Most of them are. Simon Harris and Micheál Martin in particular. You can understand to a certain degree because if you're a Taoiseach or a Tánaiste, you're basically, every government department has sent up a message or every minister, because it's a political speech in fairness, so it's not the department's doing it, has a message to get across. So there's a shopping list.

756.25 - 774.057 Derek Mooney

And that's very, very hard to fit in. You're better off having one overarching message. And in the case of the speech at Congress, there was one overarching message, which is we are your closest friends. We are your best allies. You should be listening to us a bit more. And if you have a core message, then everything else can flow out from that.

774.037 - 788.318 Pat Kenny

Do you think that leak of the ambassador's remarks earlier in the year about the special relationship being with Israel rather than being with Britain, any damage from that, flowing from that? Or is that just simply the obvious truth?

788.859 - 800.736 Derek Mooney

Well, I think it's merely the confirmation of what most people know. And I am sure Keir Starmer wasn't thrilled to have that said around the place. But I think a lot of people in Britain just know this is the case.

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