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Today with David McCullagh

Pay Controversy - RTÉ management due at Oireachtas Committee

20 May 2026

Transcription

Transcript generated automatically by AI and may contain errors.

Chapter 1: What recent controversy is RTE facing regarding salary transparency?

0.031 - 19.169 David McCullagh

Next, though, the price of transparency or another example of miscategorisation of salaries. As we heard on the news, RTE will face further questions this afternoon at the Oireachtas Media Committee over the latest payments controversy. For more on this, I'm joined by Barry Lanahan, RTE political correspondent. Morning, Barry. Good morning, David.

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19.53 - 28.418 David McCullagh

The RTE top brass were in with Minister Patrick O'Donovan yesterday for more than two hours. A lot of tough talking before and after the meeting.

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28.567 - 39.023 Barry Lenihan

And the Minister really setting down the gauntlet yesterday on his way into the Cabinet meeting, saying that there could be no further gaps in the reporting of pay at RTE.

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39.143 - 60.287 Barry Lenihan

Again, during leaders' questions at the Dáil yesterday as well, David Sinn Féin putting it to the Coalition that they had allowed the latest events in RTE to transpire by essentially not keeping a close enough eye on the broadcaster. an assertion rejected by the Taoiseach who also said that there could be no further gaps in how people are treated at Montrose.

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Chapter 2: What were the key points discussed in the Oireachtas Media Committee meeting?

60.307 - 80.641 Barry Lenihan

So that really is setting the stakes for this high-level meeting around four o'clock yesterday. You have the chair. RT Chair Terence O'Rourke, the Director General, Kevin Backhurst, Deputy DG, Andrea Lynch, going in to the department to meet the Minister and his officials. They met for around two hours or so and emerged afterwards.

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80.981 - 92.053 Barry Lenihan

And Kevin Backhurst essentially saying that the Derek Mooney case was an isolated incident, that nobody else was left out of that top 10 presenter earnings. Like

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92.033 - 113.063 Barry Lenihan

Mr Mooney had been for several years due to his classification as both a producer and a presenter with the Dáil of course hearing that even the dogs in the wild knew how Derek Mooney was a presenter and Mr Backhurst also implying that nobody beyond Mr Mooney and indeed the late Sean Rocks had been wrongly classified as a presenter.

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113.043 - 137.081 Barry Lenihan

Kevin Backhurst also went on to say that essentially RTE had paid the price for transparency by reclassifying Derek Mooney to put that out in the public domain, that their decision to do that had essentially sparked this furore of the last few days. And that was disappointing to him because he wanted to drive transparency there. And essentially, RT had paid the price for that.

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Chapter 3: How did RTE management respond to the allegations of salary misclassification?

137.341 - 148.853 Barry Lenihan

Patrick O'Donovan also emerged to say he'd been satisfied. And amid opposition criticism of him earlier the day, he said he was a big supporter of public service media and remained to do so.

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149.094 - 164.096 David McCullagh

OK, he also said RT should consider publishing a top 100 salary list. And he said he accepted RT's word that there aren't any more landmines waiting to explode. We have heard that before, though. We have indeed, David.

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164.737 - 179.776 Barry Lenihan

And again, Kevin Backhurst asked several times whether he was 100% sure was there anything else under the RTE bonnet. He said, we can only give the same answer. We don't know of anyone else. If we discover something, then we're not going to hide it.

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Chapter 4: What financial implications arose from the Derek Mooney case?

180.036 - 202.568 Barry Lenihan

We're going to put disinfectant on it and get it out there into the open. But that comment and that from Patrick O'Donovan saying he was reassured by RTE management that nothing else would emerge. It really does, I suppose, set the stakes even higher for this meeting, for the Arachtas Media Committee meeting today. There was a flurry of speculation

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202.548 - 223.934 Barry Lenihan

yesterday in Leinster House that more was to emerge. The Taoiseach even intimated as such in the Dáil yesterday. But alas, Mr O'Donovan, Mr Backhurst, insisted that the case was closed at this latest revelation, which really does perhaps leave them a hostage to fortune, if you will, if something else was to come out into the open at that meeting today.

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224.154 - 242.325 Barry Lenihan

OK, so what are we expecting to unfold today then? Well, we do know from a briefing circulated to committee members, a detailed briefing from RTE, that they will accentuate the positives, the RTE executives noting how the broadcaster had a surplus of around five, had a surplus in

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Chapter 5: What are the expected outcomes of the committee meeting regarding RTE's financial status?

242.305 - 269.595 Barry Lenihan

2024 of €5.3 million, compared to a deficit of €10 million in 2023. So things improving, the broadcaster will say, since the reforms implemented in the wake of the Ryan Tuberty pay fiasco of 2023. They're also to outline how there are 17 staff on an old pension scheme with a market value of €1 billion, but no employees have been admitted to that since the late 1980s.

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269.575 - 289.98 Barry Lenihan

And the issue of pensions, I'm told, is likely to come up quite a bit. Indeed, the meeting was convened to look at that issue. But committee members have lots of questions around pensions. Talking to committee members as well, they're keen to bring everything and anything to do with RTE in recent weeks out into the open at this hearing. The Fianna Fáil TD, Peter Chapman.

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289.96 - 312.965 Barry Lenihan

clear, he telling me that issues around the outsourcing of the lotto, around the new jingles on RTE Radio 1, even around the RTE Radio 1 schedule, that as he felt, all negative headlines around RTE do damage to the broadcaster at a time when he believes there's need for a strong broadcaster due to the rise of disinformation and the far right.

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313.045 - 318.111 Barry Lenihan

So even if the substantive pay issue might have been put to bed

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Chapter 6: How is the case of Sean Rocks impacting RTE's pension policies?

318.091 - 323.02 Barry Lenihan

that TDs will be keen to bring everything and anything up with the broadcaster today.

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323.461 - 334.26 David McCullagh

Finally, Barry, in relation to our late colleague, Sean Rocks, RT has provided some general details around pension and benefit schemes relevant after the death of an employee.

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334.527 - 360.703 Barry Lenihan

yes sean rocks the presenter of the arena program on this station from 2009 up until his death in july of last year we confirmed yesterday that his partner of 22 years catherine bailey met the minister communications minister patrick o'donovan on monday to express her concern about the classification of mr rocks during his time with rte it's believed she told the minister

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360.683 - 392.057 Barry Lenihan

that Mr. Rox, the Monaghan native, was primarily classified as a producer, even though his role was to all intent and purposes and publicly referred to as a presenter, and that this has had financial implications for her upon Mr. Rox's death last July for her and her young family. Now, RTE, while acknowledging an issue with Mr. Rox, acknowledging that this meeting had happened.

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392.397 - 419.142 Barry Lenihan

It has provided general details of its pension policy. It says it has a group life assurance policy which pays two and a half times the insured pensionable pay on death in service. And this is for basic salary plus pensionable allowances and that these would be advised by RTE by its pension administrators. And there's also a 50-50 scheme in its defined contribution pension scheme

419.122 - 441.952 Barry Lenihan

for spouses' death in service pension. That is based on pensionable salary and potential pensionable service. And children's pensions are also payable. But Miss Bailey has concerns about that. And it's understood that some of the concerns in relation to the case of our late colleague, Sean Rocks, that they will be aired at the committee meeting this afternoon.

442.192 - 445.72 David McCullagh

OK, Barry Lennon, our chief political correspondent. Thank you so much for that.

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