Tony Mantor: Why Not Me the World
From Diagnosis to Detention: How Schizophrenia Changed Two Lives Forever
Sun, 04 May 2025
Send us a textCarly, a licensed clinical social worker and mother, shares her 30-year journey navigating her son's schizophrenia diagnosis and the healthcare system's failures that led to his year-long incarceration. • Son diagnosed with schizophrenia at age 17, now 47 years old• Early signs included not wanting to get out of bed, not going to school, and "odd" behavior• Initially had periods of stability while on medication but struggled with consistent treatment• COVID isolation marked a turning point with medication non-compliance and rapid deterioration• Multiple hospitalizations where he was repeatedly released before being stabilized• Baker Act attempts failed, requiring court intervention for involuntary commitment• Currently in jail after physically attacking neighbors, with limited treatment options• Courts cannot order medication or appropriate treatment due to misdemeanor charges• Carly's advice: "We didn't cause it, we can't cure it, we can't control it"• Self-care is crucial for family members – "The best thing we can do for our loved ones is to take care of ourselves"Tell everyone everywhere about Why Not Me The World, the conversations we're having and the inspiration our guests give to everyone everywhere that you are not alone in this world.https://tonymantor.comhttps://Facebook.com/tonymantorhttps://instagram.com/tonymantorhttps://twitter.com/tonymantorhttps://youtube.com/tonymantormusicintro/outro music bed written by T. WildWhy Not Me the World music published by Mantor Music (BMI)
Chapter 1: What is the focus of this podcast episode?
Welcome to Why Not Me? The World Podcast, hosted by Tony Mantor. Broadcasting from Music City, USA, Nashville, Tennessee. Join us as our guests tell us their stories. Some will make you laugh, some will make you cry. real life people who will inspire and show that you are not alone in this world.
Hopefully you gain more awareness, acceptance, and a better understanding for autism around the world. Hi, I'm Tony Mantor. Welcome to Why Not Meet the World? Humanity Over Handcuffs, the Silent Crisis special event. Today, we are joined by Carly, a clinical social worker who is stepping away from her professional role to speak to us as a mother. Carly's child lives with a serious mental illness.
She brings a wealth of personal experience and insight that she will share with us. We really appreciate her taking the time. Thanks for coming on.
Chapter 2: What challenges did Carly face with her son's schizophrenia?
I'm happy to be here and I'm glad you're here too. Really important topic and conversation that needs recognition.
If you could, give us a little background on what you do and your journey in what you've been trying to accomplish.
I'm a licensed clinical social worker. I'm retired. My son was diagnosed with schizophrenia when he was 17. He's now 47 years old. We've had periods of instability and periods of stability. And he's been in jail for over a year now for incidences he caused due to his lack of taking his medication.
When did you first notice something was off with him? I'm curious about the very first moment you realized he was dealing with some personal issues that just needed attention.
Chapter 3: When did Carly first notice issues with her son?
When he was in his last year of high school, he had a lot of those symptoms where he didn't want to get out of bed. He didn't want to do anything and or go anywhere and stop going to school. And there was also the other extreme where he was acting a little like silly and goofy and odd, just odd. So I did bring him to a psychiatrist. And they did evaluate him.
And he was originally put in the hospital. And that's when he was diagnosed with schizophrenia. Somewhere along there was schizoaffective disorder. So that's where he had. He kind of ranges between being depressed and having some of that mania along with symptoms of schizophrenia where he did the paranoia and the delusions and things like that. Hearing voices.
When he was a senior, you mentioned getting a diagnosis. Once you received that diagnosis, what steps did you take to manage it and improve the situation, even if it wasn't fully under control?
Yeah, we were referred to a psychiatrist. So we started seeing the psychiatrist. Unfortunately, during that period of time, he was also using drugs unbeknownst to me. And that particular psychiatrist fired him because he confessed to using drugs along with his medication. We found somebody else.
Chapter 4: What steps did Carly take after her son's diagnosis?
We found this fabulous registered nurse practitioner who we saw for many years, and he did very good for a long time.
When someone hears schizophrenia, they often assume the worst. So during the process when he was on his medication and things were relatively stable, what were you going through to help keep him on that positive path?
Well, then and now are like two different lifetimes, right? When he's that young.
Sure.
It wasn't as serious as it is now. You know, when I look back, see how he is like, I've never this past two years, I've never seen him in such a decline in such state where he didn't even recognize who I was. My husband and I have been in this, you know, his stepfather. over his house weekly, helping him with groceries or transportation.
He's also in a wheelchair because he lost a leg due to a psychotic break he had. And so we gave him, you know, we spent time with him. And when he was younger, eventually he got his own apartment. We were living in South Florida. He got his own apartment. He was on his medication, but he was doing things like roaming town in the middle of the night, like just going out walking.
I'm like, Nathan, you can't be walking around at night. You're going to get in trouble. But it didn't kind of, oh, I've talked to the police. They're fine. I tell them who I am. And he continued that even when we moved north. He even continued that behavior while he was still able to walk. It was just odd behavior, not sleeping at night, always have a hard time sleeping and managing his moods.
You know, he'd fluctuate from being depressed to being manic. And he's doing he's an artist. He's a writer. He plays music, writes music. And so, you know, he'd be kind of like up all night. He'd get in these creative modes and he'd be up and then he'd go the other direction where you couldn't get him out of bed to do anything.
So how is he doing now? Is he better? Is he worse? Is he still the same? What's his situation look like now?
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Chapter 5: How did COVID-19 affect her son's mental health?
Yeah. So he doesn't recognize at this point that he's ill and he needs medication. So he continued and I tried, you know, putting his medication, helping with his medication, you know, his weekly thing. And at this point, I was going over every day for months. I was thinking, you know, I have some control over this medication. baffling and cunning disease, right?
Which I had no control whatsoever, but I was trying, I could see the train wreck happening and I couldn't stop it is what was happening. And he started doing some bad behaviors in his apartment that he'd live in for 17 years. He wouldn't keep his clothes on. He was banging on people's doors all night. He was taking mushrooms and weed.
I don't know if there was anything else, but those two I do know. I did talk to him. He wouldn't listen. And like I said, we were there every week. And he called me every day. I didn't see it coming.
This is definitely tough on him with what he's going through. But how was you handling it? It's just as tough for you seeing your son go down the spiral. So how was you handling it?
I felt, I think, in the end that love wasn't enough. Love... and caring and showing up literally wasn't enough to keep him from doing what happened he needed we needed social support that didn't exist his psychiatrist ended up firing him because he called up he was making these awful phone calls and saying terrible crazy things to people or writing emails.
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Chapter 6: What were the challenges of getting her son committed?
I actually got a call from, he had art in a gallery. I actually got a call from the gallery owner saying, do you know what's going on with your son? And I said, yes, he's unmedicated. He's not doing well. And she shared with me the message she left. And it was just like, you couldn't even follow it. It didn't make any sense. And he was angry. And she said, should I be afraid?
And I said, I can't tell you that. I said, if you're afraid, you can call the police. He's in a wheelchair. He has one leg. He doesn't have a car. But I'm not going to tell you not to protect yourself or your people. And so, you know, he was back to was causing a lot of trouble at his apartment complex. So his baker acted at one time, Marchman acted another in the third one that ended up in.
And this is a matter of a few months where he actually attacked his neighbors, which were his friends.
physically attacked an elderly lady and his friend who was his neighbor so he called me a few times after that they released him a couple times you know he's not gonna get better and you can't have a rational conversation with somebody who's not rash right he's calling me sister something like he didn't know who he was sister something so with all this going on what was next what happened from there
They let him go from jail twice. He got rearrested within 24 hours because he doesn't know what to do or where to go. He went back to his apartment, got rearrested there for trespassing and something else another time. We put him in a hotel one night, but the next day he wouldn't get out of the room.
It's like, okay, we're going to go to the homeless shelter and these are the rules and this is what you have to do and so on and so forth. Yeah, that was an arrest. So after those two releases and arrests, they just kept him there. And he's had several different lawyers talking to the lawyers occasionally.
The social worker, I would call every couple of weeks, he's aggressive and noncompliant and doesn't cooperate. And I believe he's been in isolation a lot. I don't know if the whole time, but they don't basically in the jail, you know, if the patient, if the client, participant, whatever, On medication, they can't force it.
And no matter how many times they said to the lawyer and sent letters to the judge, he originally had three felonies, which would have gotten him the help that he needed. The judge put a court order early on, but the lawyer at that time didn't want to ask that or whatever.
With all this happening between the lawyer and the judge and everyone that was involved, what was the next step? What did they tell you?
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Chapter 7: What was Carly's experience during her son's hospitalization?
Now that you've been through this, 20-20 hindsight is always perfect. Looking back over the years you've been doing this, do you see anything that stands out? Something that could have changed? Or was it just destined to turn out the way it did for him?
I mean, I can say, well, maybe I should have done this at that time or that at that time. I mean, I tried to get him Baker. You know, you think of the Baker Act as answer. It wasn't going to be an answer if he continued to refuse his medication. It's already on this. The medication is poison. It doesn't help me. I'm not sick. I don't need it.
I feel like at this point there was nothing I could do to stop it.
It seems like for every solution offered, he raised another obstacle. So I believe he did everything you possibly could.
As much as I tried, I tried for months. Like I said, I sat there with him. I literally made a list. Keep your clothes on. Keep your music down. Stay in the house after such and such. I mean, I'd come home and I'd go back to his house the next day. And of course, it'd be crumpled up in the trash. There was a point where of no return.
That was what initially I was trying because you could see it happening. And it was like, if only they would keep him longer at the hospital, that's what would have saved him. But that wasn't happening.
It sounds like you were doing your best to consider every possibility, so I don't think second-guessing yourself would have made any difference at all. So looking ahead, what do you see now? What do you think you have to do, and what can help him to get a better stable life for his future?
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Chapter 8: How does Carly cope with her son's illness?
Well, I sent the judge a letter explaining his illness, and my fears are, A, he's going to hurt himself, he's going to hurt somebody else, or somebody's going to hurt him. He doesn't have any social skills at this point to stay at the homeless shelter. He didn't have that a year ago. He didn't have the ability, the social, his social behaviors and regulation and what to do was out the window.
The best thing that can happen, and it sounds horrible, is that he ends up back in jail. At least I know where he is and he's safe. I mean, it certainly isn't ideal, especially if he's in isolation and I have no control over him and I have no control over the judge, the social workers, the people in the jail, whatever I have to say. I can say all day long, but they do what they do, right?
So I don't want to be not hopeful about There's always a miracle that can happen. And I feel like regardless of the brain disease, we're all on a journey, right? We're all on a journey.
our own journey and um he's on his and he's on this this pathways and i don't know why and i i will never know why whatever happens why this happened and um you know it's his journey it's his journey just like my journey my journey is my journey and somebody can walk along with me I can walk along. I've been walking beside him. I'm walking beside him, maybe guiding him and supporting him.
That's all I could do. And once he decided he didn't want that anymore for whatever reason, then he's basically on his own and to whatever is going to happen, it's going to happen.
Right. There's not much more you can say on that. So what advice would you offer to others who might be facing the same struggles you've been through? How would you guide them toward finding even a small sense of peace in their lives so they're not left carrying the weight of self-blame or trapped in that pain? Because as you know, it's a very painful journey.
Right. Yes. Number one, we didn't cause it, right? we as parents, friends, family, we didn't cause it. We can't cure it and we can't control it. All we can control is our response to it. And we have to make a decision as family members or friends, what we're going to do. How can I best help this person if that's even available, if it's available to help and have boundaries.
And I think people really need to know that It's okay to have boundaries. If your loved one is violent, you don't have to, it sounds awful, but if they're being violent in your home, you don't have to put up with that. Your life doesn't have to be ruined because your loved one has a brain disease that's affecting you.
I think that people knowing that they're not alone, and that's why I love what you're doing is you're not alone. There's lots of us friends and families of relatives with seriously mentally ill people all over the world, I'm sure. We've all sacrificed a lot of time and energy and worry and fear. And the what ifs and the should haves and the guilt, right? We feel guilty.
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