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Chapter 1: What is the premise of 'Presumed Innocent'?
He's watched every movie more than once.
He's Stephen Fennec. He's watched the latest Disney movies with his kids. But that's about it. He's Trevor Long.
You talking to me?
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The first rule of Fight Club is you do not talk about Fight Club.
With Steven Fenwick and Trevor Long. This is the captain. Brace for impact.
Hello and welcome to the best movies you've never seen, our movie podcast. My name is Stephen Fennec and I'm the person who comes up with the movies to show Trevor Long, my co-host, to watch for the very first time. That's the whole premise of the show. Trevor's watched now, what, 214 movies now? I'm basically, you know, Hollywood authenticated. That's...
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Chapter 2: Who are the main characters in 'Presumed Innocent'?
Now, Paul Winfield is the actor who plays the judge, Judge Little, in the movie. Now, he read the novel in the 80s, in the late 80s, and loved it. Told his agent, he said, mate, if ever this is made into a movie, I want to be the judge. Wow. Right? So a few years later, movie's in pre-production. He's really pushed hard for the role.
impressed alan j pacula the director who said right out come and audition and boom was cast in the movie wow how's that for projecting what you want and that's a vision board kind of stuff oprah would be proud right ahead you heard of this seeing this what's your impressions here what happened i got nothing yeah no i'm i'm coming 100 blind on this one and so you knew though the cast was pretty solid so well i mean harrison ford it's going to be a good good movie right yeah
I honestly ā Did you know it was a ā presumed, didn't you? Did you assume it was a legal ā I assumed it was a legal show.
Yeah.
But I don't think there's many of these other actors I recognise. Yeah. Yeah, I just ā I mean, I could get a fretting understanding. Greta Scarkey was in another film we did. Yeah.
I know the name. A while ago, yeah.
But I wouldn't pick her in a line-up. Well, her daughter's now acting now. Her daughter, I can't remember her name. But what I'm saying is Harrison Ford's the one that I recognise, everyone else, but I assume these are good names because Harrison Ford's in it. Absolutely right. Well ā Our mate Roger Ebert. 3.5 stars out of 4. The 3.5 stars is solid. Here's what he said.
I'll just give you a little overview here. Pacula has made film versions of difficult books before. Sophie's Choice, All the President's Men are among his credits. This time, his challenge was to avoid getting bogged down in the marshes of circumstantial and forensic evidence, which make good reading but can expand into interminable movie dialogue. Right.
The adaptation of Turo's novel does a good job of presenting the evidence as needed and no more than is needed while allowing time for the characters to establish themselves. The lead performance by Harrison Ford must have been a delicate balancing act since at every point he must seem plausible both as a killer and as an innocent man.
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Chapter 3: What is the significance of the B-file in the movie?
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So I'm thinking, okay, he's watching the movie. It was like the juror's seat. He knows what I'm watching. Right at the start or right at the end. I'm not re-watching 12 Angry Men, so, you know. There you have it. It could have been that. There you have it. So what are your, don't tell us everything, but your first impressions?
Yeah, I mean, there's a lot to unpack with this movie through the run-through and in my final summary. But I think you could easily guess that I enjoy this movie because Law & Order is on the television right now.
Based on reality, yeah. In the room.
It's like a glorified Law & Order. Yeah. And so I've always enjoyed courtroom drama. Okay. TV. Good to know. So I imagine... I imagine I could get sunk in a really deep hole of courtroom drama movies as well. We've done some others. Yes. But, yeah, this was enjoyable. Harrison Ford is a strange cat because he has ā I've watched him in interviews, and his demeanor in this movie is him.
It's very kind of placid. I don't know, just the way he talks and the way he delivers his ā Very Harrison Ford. I really enjoy his style. And, you know, the great thing about this story is that it evolves all the way through. Oh, yeah. Keeps you guessing. It's a good movie. It's not just a criminal justice system. It's a solid story. And your social media posts?
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Chapter 4: How does the film portray the investigation process?
Right. And I devoured the book. Scott Turow is the author. He was kind of like a John Grisham type writer. Oh, okay, right. So Scott Turow, this was a huge release, not only as a book, but also as a movie. And I saw it with my then steady girlfriend, Jo. We've been together for, I think, three years at this point. And now you're grandparents. And now we're grandparents. That's right.
So I can remember it was a huge release at the time. Rewatched it a few times. I own it on, I don't think I've got it on. I've got it on Blu-ray. I haven't got it on 4K. Yeah. I try to get everything on 4K if I can. Of course. But no, I've seen this many times. And you know what? It still surprises me. Really? Still surprises me. Well, I was thinking deeper appreciation of it.
We'll unpack it as we go, but I can absolutely imagine re-watching this two or three times and seeing more, looking at it through different angles and characters. Correct. Let's talk about the cast. Of course, Harrison Ford plays Rusty Savage, and of course he is Indiana Jones. He's in Star Wars Air Force One. Blade Runner, The Fugitive, Witness. He's got quite an impressive list of films.
We haven't done The Fugitive, have we?
No.
We've done Air Force One and we've done Star Wars. The Fugitive is Tommy Lee. The Fugitive is opposite Tommy Lee. Yeah, I've seen that. That's on our list, mate. Our massive list. Bump it up the list. It's on. I get a lot of encouragement, actually, from listeners who are suggesting movies now. It's good. Because they, like me, don't believe the list is being hacked into.
There was one, actually.
We had a really nice review on the podcast, on the Apple podcast. And the guy, I forget his name, but he was saying, oh, I guess I'm up till late at night listening to your shows. I can't get enough. And he had a list of movies that he wanted us to do. And the first movie, if he's listening, his first movie was The Time Machine. I said, mate, I've got news for you.
The 1960 Time Machine, we've done it. So the Rod Taylor Time Machine, we've already done that. I don't remember it anyway. Greta Scarkey plays Carolyn Palamas. And she was in, we've done this, The Player. Remember that movie with Tim Robbins about he plays the Hollywood executive? It's like a look behind sort of Hollywood. Yep.
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Chapter 5: What are the major twists in the plot of 'Presumed Innocent'?
She was also in Emma and another movie called Shattered. Raul Julia plays Sandy Stern. He was in The Addams Family and Addams Family, the sequel. Street Fighter, he was in The Rookie and in Havana, I think opposite Robert Redford. Died, sadly, in 1994. Aged 54. Wow. Yeah. Bonnie Bedelia plays Barbara Sabish. That's Harrison Ford's wife. And she was in, famously, Die Hard and Die Hard 2.
Remember she was John McClane's wife?
Oh, yeah.
In Die Hard, remember? It's in Nakatomi. Remember she was a high-powered executive at Nakatomi? She seemed familiar, yes. There you go. She was also in a Stephen King adaptation of Needful Things. Right. Did you recognise John Spencer?
Yeah.
Leo McGarry. Yes.
I'm like, oh, so young, too. Yeah, he was, too.
Also, West Wing. Yeah. Dan Lipranza. There's another one in here, isn't there? There is, yeah. Well, there's him. And Bradley Whitford. Bradley Whitford. Yeah. And also their son in the movie is named Jesse something, and he plays a young intern in the series as well. Does he really? Yes, he does, yeah. I did not know that. When he grows up. Wow.
Yeah, so John Spencer was, of course, in the West Wing, was in Copland, which we've done. War Games, which we've done, and The Rock, which we've done. Yeah. We're a fan of John Spencer. Yeah, we are big fans. Passed away in 2005. Age 58. Yeah. He died, yeah. And Brian Dennehy plays Raymond Horgan. He was in First Blood.
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Chapter 6: What role does courtroom drama play in the film?
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So really great quality, really good audio, and just that big cinema-like experience at home. Check out the XR10 projector from Hisense at hisense.com.au. Boom. The movie starts, I think, was that the shot you sent me, the opening frame? Very slow run of credits over the jury box. This sort of slow zoom on an empty jury box, and we hear this little voiceover.
I am a prosecutor. I'm a part of the business of accusing, judging, and punishing. I explore the evidence of a crime and determine who is charged. who was brought to this room to be tried before his peers. I present my evidence to the jury and they deliberate upon it. They must determine what really happened.
If they cannot, we will not know if the accused deserves to be freed or should be punished. If they cannot find the truth, What is our hope of justice?
Interesting. And the movie opens with Rusty arriving at his office and told the boss wants to see him. But there was an envelope shoved under the door. Now, it was from, did you notice closely? It said, from the office of Carol and Palamas. Yep. And it read in capital letters, stop it. I know it's you. Yeah. So immediately there's intrigue. You're thinking, what's happening here?
So he goes up to see his boss, which is District Attorney Raymond Horgan, which is played by Brian Dennehy. He's in the middle of a re-election campaign against his political rival, Nico Di La Guardia. Now, Rusty is then told about what happened to his colleague, Carolyn Palamas.
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Chapter 7: How does the ending of 'Presumed Innocent' unfold?
Unless you want me here, I'm supposed to meet the coroner. No, it's all right. Go on, get up. I can hear De La Guardia now. Raymond Horgan can't protect his own prosecuting attorneys. How the hell is he gonna protect an average citizen? Tommy Molto's secretary said he wasn't coming in today. Some fucking acting head of homicide. He turned out to be the little creep.
Should have fired him when we fired Nico instead of handing him his job. If I had any balls, I'd do it now. Rusty, I want you to handle this case personally. Wait, when I got the office, I'll assign somebody. Well, who the hell are you gonna assign it to? Homicide? Tommy Molto, for Christ's sake? When Delagardia just loved that, Molto would tip him off on everything we'd get.
Miserable guinea bastards. They're so close, you can see Molto's nose sticking out of Nico's belly button.
So that was an extended bit of audio there because it gives you a good snapshot of the players that are involved and the stakes. It's also a critical moment because he's asked or demanded that he takes the job. You do it. Later on he denies that. But Rusty, we know the landscape. There's election going on. We know who the opponents are. Rusty accepts. Regrudgingly. He doesn't.
He doesn't let everything go here because we find out at this point that he's holding back a very big secret. We find out later. I don't think we know fully then that he does. You think this is the moment he should have said something, obviously. He maybe should have volunteered that information, but Horgan has ordered him to personally head the investigation.
Now, what he does afterwards, he goes into her office and fires up her computer, and he sees that there is a B-file case number in the system that Which also stands out because all the other files, all the other case numbers are different. They're different. Nice old computers and everything. Old 90s computer. Takes minutes to fire up a bunch of things.
But he says the file case number is in the system, but the actual file is missing. Missing. So Lip Branza, who is his investigator, has crime scene photos. It's pretty gruesome. She's bound in ropes, sexually assaulted, and was bludgeoned to death.
What do you have here? A bunch of pictures of a dead lady. No weapon found yet? Not a... It's a weird one. She was strangled by the ropes, but look at the way he tied her. It's like he put himself between her legs, and when he pumped, they all tightened up like he was trying to let his weight strangle her. It's all slipknoted. I mean that he was sort of trying to fuck her to death.
Well, look at the next one. Check the state computer around the sex offenders and see if we can cross-match on Carolyn's name or this business with the ropes. Find out which of the creeps she put away is out on parole. I never did understand why you put abroad like that and charge her rape and all that sicko shit. She wanted it. And she was good? Too good, maybe.
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Chapter 8: What lessons can be learned from 'Presumed Innocent'?
Just, I'm not grabbing this yet. Now, you work with this fraud. She's not going to leave her fucking door. The window's wide open. And she was drinking with him. She gave him a glass of beer like she was entertaining. Fingerprints on the glass? Yeah. Greer sent it down to the lab. So what are you figuring? Somebody she let in and opened the windows to make it look like a break-in?
She's not going to let some sex maniac she sent to jail in for a beer. On the other hand, we're talking Carol.
So a lot to unpack there, too. Lip Branza was actually brought in. Greer was the other investigator in Harrison Ford. The Rusty said, look, I prefer, I want Lip to handle it. He wants his guy. Yeah, that's his man. But again, all these little tiny things don't seem consequential, but then they allow you to have more things to question as the movie gets to its crescendo.
Yeah.
Now at home, Rusty's wife, Barbara, Bonnie Bedelia, is aware, obviously, of his infidelity in the past. We kind of find out at this point that she knows that he had an affair. She knows what happened, and they're listening to the news broadcast about it, and she reacts with a really cold, biting resentment when she learns that Rusty is handling the case.
So Dan Lepranzer and Rusty Savage will work night and day for the next two weeks and catch Raymond a killer. At least that's the strategy. You're in charge of this investigation? Raymond insisted I take it on. There are 150 lawyers down there. They couldn't find one who didn't fuck or put in charge. Did you tell Raymond? This is a conflict of interest. Is that professional?
Barbara, I'm Raymond's chief deputy. You are so predictable. It's your way of reliving the whole thing. She's dead. And you're still obsessing.
She seems over the affair. Yeah. You know there's a bit of sensitivity still there. Yeah. And, yeah, we'll talk more about her later. Over lunch in a bar, Lip meets up with Rusty and talks about the forensic investigation.
See, Penless says normally he would see some of the guy's little thingies swimming upstream in the womb when he looked under the microscope. Instead, this guy's was all dead. Nothing went nowhere. So Penless figures this guy is sterile. You got blood type A. Oh, I'm very young. I've thought of that. But you've got a kid. You get anything from hair and fiber?
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