4DCA Division 2 Oral Argument 2025/11/04 Morning Session - Nov 04, 2025

argument

4DCA Division 2 Oral Argument 2025/11/04 Morning Session

California Fourth District Court of Appeal, Division Two 3h 14m 7 chapters transcribed 8 days ago official recording ↗

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What introductions and welcome remarks open the oral argument session?

Manuel Ramirez 4:29

Again, good morning, and it's always a pleasure to introduce my colleagues appearing before you. On my right is Justice Fields. Good morning. On your right is Justice Minitrez. Good morning. Welcome to staff as well. Good morning to both of you. My name is Manuel Ramirez, and I'll preside over a portion of this calendar. I do note that we have some special guests in the courtroom. It is always our practice and our good procedure to both welcome and to introduce those guests that are here with Judge Keene. So for that, I'm going to turn it over to Judge Fields to perhaps do the welcoming remarks.

Unknown 5:10

I'm very, very happy to see Judge Keene. He's one of my mentees. I had the great honor of swearing him in when he became a judge. Just a very, very accomplished lawyer in the public defender's office for many, many years. He became a judge. He's been a mock trial coach for many years at Notre Dame, right?

5:22

Correct.

Unknown 5:23

And so it's really great to see you. And it was really great to celebrate with you and have really celebrated your whole career with you and watched you. And you actually did a trial in my court. And you're just an outstanding, outstanding trial lawyer. So to watch them progress to this level has been amazing. And knowing that you're coaching the kids, I think, is absolutely wonderful. So welcome, and welcome to your students.

Manuel Ramirez 5:42

Thank you. Judge Keene, if I may ask, maybe you could introduce them as well individually very quickly. But just a quick, very quick rundown of the fact pattern that they're facing. And I don't think any of us will be judging the mock trial competition. So if you could just help us out with that and perhaps run through the quick introduction of all of them.

Marshal Grassi 6:04

I think that would be

Manuel Ramirez 6:04

appropriate.

Manuel Ramirez 6:29

And where

Unknown 6:34

Manuel Ramirez 6:41

she? Maybe she can just

Unknown 6:42

raise her hand and we can see her. Good morning.

Unknown 7:26

And Gracie, you're also joining us this year for the first

Manuel Ramirez 7:30

time.

Kyle Patrick 7:30

Very good. I'm happy to be here, and thank

Manuel Ramirez 7:31

you for having us. Thank you. It's our pleasure, our honor to have all of you and your mock trial students present with us this morning. And to all of you, good luck. I know that I can say, and I think my colleagues will join me in this, that over time, we have the good fortune of doing something like this and getting to meet you. And then some number of years later, we also have the good fortune of seeing some of you graduate from college, law school, and then see you at a swearing-in ceremony where, as Justice Fields said, and I'm sure Justice Matros has had the same experience, it is our great pleasure to then welcome you into our profession as you are taking the oath of a new attorney.

Unknown 8:13

And that's my relationship with Judge Keene, seeing him from the time he first started appearing in front of me, all the way to becoming a senior, senior person in the public attorney's office and then becoming a judge. What a great honor to have you here today. Thank you. May I ask you a question? You guys still practicing two hours or three hours a night, twice a week?

Marshal Grassi 8:29

Well, we go

Manuel Ramirez 8:32

two hours, three times a week, but starting in December, it's three hours.

Unknown 8:43

our teacher coach, Rachel Dyer. She's one of the teachers at Notre Dame. Welcome. Can she

Manuel Ramirez 8:47

stand so we can see her? She's hiding back there in the corner.

Unknown 8:51

Good morning. Good morning. You

Manuel Ramirez 8:53

deserve better than hiding in the corner. Good morning. Welcome.

Unknown 8:56

In addition to being

Manuel Ramirez 8:57

a teacher at the high school, she's also an attorney, so we're blessed to have a teacher attorney coach at the

Unknown 9:04

school.

Marshal Grassi 9:04

Unknown 9:04

understand you recruited Judge Choi also.

Manuel Ramirez 9:06

Yes,

Unknown 9:07

for the first year. She's one of our alumni, so she's been doing great work. Judge King was so talented, I told him for many years he should become a judge. It took him about five years before he finally decided, OK. But I told him about five years before he actually applied, right?

Manuel Ramirez 9:24

Well, by coincidence, I will be in Los Angeles late tomorrow afternoon to watch my two grandchildren, the twins, as they present in a mock trial in Los Angeles. It's not an experience that we ever get away from, and we're back with it in many other different forms.