4DCA Division 2 Oral Argument 2026/04/08 Morning Session - Apr 08, 2026

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4DCA Division 2 Oral Argument 2026/04/08 Morning Session

California Fourth District Court of Appeal, Division Two 1h 27m 8 chapters transcribed 1 month ago official recording ↗

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Transcript generated automatically by AI and may contain errors.

What is the purpose of the oral argument and who are the judges on the panel?

Unknown 0:35

Yeah.

Unknown 1:28

Mm.

Art McKinster 2:00

No. This

Unknown 2:01

is strange.

Art McKinster 2:06

Okay. All right.

Art McKinster 2:19

Dunno. Thank you. That's okay. The law says you have to have one on. It doesn't know if colors anyway. But it it's uh its directory, it's doesn't invalidate the proceedings. Is that right? No that no that's true. No that's actually I haven't that that hasn't come up in a case before. Uh the judge was not wearing a robe. And it's directory, it's it doesn't have anything to do with jurisdiction to res uh to nullify anything. Yeah. Okay. Well good morning everyone. There's no one in the courtroom. Uh this is uh oral argument uh for Wednesday morning. We're assembled to hear two cases. Uh before I introduce the panel I just want to make sure that uh everyone's checked in. We have everybody. Okay. Uh this panel is is composed of uh Justice Michael uh Rafel, who is uh seated on my right.

Art McKinster 3:24

And uh and Justice Cory Lee, who is s seated on my left. And my name is Art McKinster and I'll be uh presiding over both the cases. Uh as a uh uh introduction or uh w by way of explanation, uh originally we had uh the uh ties case as number twelve and then we were going to do the uh dependency case uh which is uh uh Yeah, number thirteen, but we have decided to flip those. Uh Miss Drolla, are you there? Mr. Doherty, are you there, please?

Unknown 4:01

Yes, sir. I'm here. Yes.

Art McKinster 4:02

Great. We sent out a cover letter with the uh the opinion and there's been a lot of spirited debate over this opinion. Uh the the panel is divided. And I flipped uh the order of these so that you would be going last and uh so that you would have enough time to address some of the concerns of some of the panel members. Uh and if we needed more than the fifteen minutes as long as it it was uh profitable and and productive that we could grant more time because you you may need more time to answer uh questions. And for that reason we're gonna put you at the foot of the calendar and instead uh we'll we'll proceed uh with the other case. But uh during the time period that may give you uh uh a heads up but the panel is divided and I would even go so far as to say uh Mr.

Art McKinster 4:50

Dorothy uh it may not enjoy majority support. Uh but uh you need that heads up so that you can uh uh organize your thoughts bef uh while you're waiting for the other case to conclude. So with that in mind, I'm gonna go ahead and call uh our uh dependency case it's uh in ray uh sg and if we can have appearances uh for the record uh Uh first starting uh with the appellate

Sean Perdomo 5:19

Good morning, Your Honor, Sean Perdomo, on behalf of the appellants, the paternal grandparents.

Joe Barrell 5:25

And your Honors uh Joe Barrel on behalf of um CFS and let me just apologize. I don't know why my video is not working, so if it would be okay, I would like to be able to participate with audio only.

Art McKinster 5:39

That's perfectly okay. I don't know why you're not coming through but your your your audio's coming through loud and clear, Mr. Barrel. Uh I I forgot to ask for spellings, Mr. Barrel, uh just to make sure we have it right. The spelling of your last name, please.

Joe Barrell 5:52

Uh B as and boy A R R E L L

Art McKinster 5:58

Thank you and that's for the benefit of the clerk. Also for the appellate, would you spell the last name please for us?

Sean Perdomo 6:04

P-E-R-D-O-M-O.

Art McKinster 6:10

And it's pronounced?

Sean Perdomo 6:11

Per demo.

Art McKinster 6:13

Perdomo.

Sean Perdomo 6:14

Yes.

Art McKinster 6:15

Thank you very kindly. That is a new name. We were were showing Dina Joseph, so you have substituted in, is that correct?

Sean Perdomo 6:21

Yes, Your Honor.

Art McKinster 6:22

Okay, and that's another reason why we go through this. And my clerk thanks you. With that in mind, uh the appellate has uh a total of fifteen minutes uh for argument. Did you wish to reserve some part of that time to respond uh to the county council?

Sean Perdomo 6:37

Yes, Your Honor. Uh perhaps uh five minutes for rebuttal. Oh, yeah.

Art McKinster 6:42

If if you look at your screen you'll see there's a light system, uh green, yellow, and red. That g that uh tells you where you are. The yellow light comes on uh when there is two minutes absolutely left, whether it you're in your first argument or your second one, the red light comes on when your time has expired. You'll also get an audible at five minutes from our clerk. Hopefully you'll hear it if you're in the heat of battle, but she she will tell you when you're down to five.