Agency for Int'l Development v. Alliance for Open Society Int'l, Inc. (12-10)

argument 12-10

Agency for Int'l Development v. Alliance for Open Society Int'l, Inc.

Supreme Court of the United States 58 min 7 speakers 8 chapters transcribed 6 days ago official recording ↗
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What is the constitutional issue at the heart of Agency for International Development v. Alliance for Open Society?

John G. Roberts 0:02
We'll hear argument next this morning in case twelve ten, Agency for International Development versus the Alliance for Open Society International. Mr. Srinavason?
Donald B. Verrilli Jr. 0:11
Thank you, Mr Chief Justice, and may it please the Court. Congress's comprehensive programme to address the worldwide problem of HIV and AIDS includes a policy of opposing prostitution and sex trafficking because they contribute to the disease's spread. And correspondingly, Congress deterr d d determined that the government should partner with and should grant limited competitive federal funding to those organizations that agree with the policy opposing prostitution and sex trafficking. Because organizations that agree with that policy are most likely to carry out the federal program in conformity with the federal policy priorities. Now no organization that carries out HIV programming is required to subscribe to the Federal Government's views.
Donald B. Verrilli Jr. 0:52
But if an organization wants to partner with the federal government and get federal funds to carry out the federal program, well that looks Well but I
John G. Roberts 0:59
guess the problem is that there are a number of different ways you could carry out the program. And let's say you have an organization that focuses on a particular you know, the administration of hospitals or whatever it is that's covered by the program. And they regard this issue as collaterals to what they're concerned with. There there have to be some limitations on what type of uh loyalty oath you can require them to sign, isn't there?
Donald B. Verrilli Jr. 1:24
Well I think Mr. Chief Justice the way that Congress looked at this was to look in at at the organizations with which the government's going to partner across the mind run of situations. And I think what one can do is look at respondents brief, because respondents encompass a variety of different types of organizations. But respondents brief itself tells you at pages ten eleven to twelve and at pages thirty two and thirty three. that there are going to be situations in their own experience in which these issues about prostitution and and sex trafficking come into issue. I appreciate
John G. Roberts 1:52
it. What if they're not? What if the government has, in addition to this policy, a strong policy in promoting Recycling. And so they require everybody with whom they're going to do business, every grantee, to adopt a policy in favor of using renewable resources. Any problem with that?
Donald B. Verrilli Jr. 2:10
Uh Mr. Chief Justice, I think that would present a different question. Of course you know that it presents a different question, but it would be more d more difficult for the for the following reason that there is a germaneness component to Congress's the constitutionality of Congress's funding decisions in this area. And the more sweeping and the less germane the condition would be, the more it's open to constitutional attack. Now this condition is very, very germane because because as Congress found, prostitution and sex trafficking contribute to the spread of the disease. And so it makes good sense that Congress would have imposed this condition. And I think it's important to be a good idea.
Stephen G. Breyer 2:43
What should we do as far as I can tell from the briefs? the people who work with the prostitutes to try to prevent AIDS uniformly tell us that if you go to those prostitutes and you try to get them to take steps to stop AIDS It's very hard to do if at the same time you've announced you're against all prostitution. So what they're saying is that the condition imposed will interfere with the objective. And if there is a germaneess requirement, And nobody says the opposite. I mean I've no nobody denies what they're saying in terms of the effectiveness of their work. So I don't think at least I didn't read them all with great care. Maybe you can point to somebody who does. But if everyone is telling us that this is counterproductive,
Stephen G. Breyer 3:33
And uh the exact opposite of the then can we say, well, it isn't germane.
Donald B. Verrilli Jr. 3:37
Well, Justice Breyer, I don't think so. In two responses on that score, first of all, everybody is not telling you that, and I'll tell you who's not telling you that in a second.

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