Tibbals v. Carter (11-218)
argument 11-218Tibbals v. Carter
Supreme Court of the United States
35 min
4 speakers
8 chapters
transcribed 4 days ago
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Transcript
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What is the Supreme Court’s primary question about habeas stays in Tibbals v. Carter?
We'll hear argument first this morning in case eleven two hundred eighteen, Tibbles versus Carter. Ms. Shimmer?
Mr Chief Justice, and may it please the Court This case is here from the Sixth Circuit, which held that habeas claims can be stayed indefinitely because prisoners have a statutory right to competence to assist in their case. But even Mr. Carter now disowns the circuit's rationale, and the court's indefinite stay order was wrong for two other reasons. First, habeas claims cannot be stayed indefinitely Doing so is fundamentally incompatible with the timeliness concerns underlying EDPA. Second, while we readily acknowledge that limited stays will be appropriate in some situations, this is not one of them. All of Mr. Carter's claims are record based and therefore resolvable without his assistance.
What situations would they be appropriate in?
Limited stays, we think Your Honor would be stay appropriate in situations. where the prisoner's ability to effectively communicate with this counsel or to disclose evidence would be necessary to his claim, and we think that would be true in a case potentially where EDPA does not restrict federal review to the state court record. So here for instance we think That r uh the prisoners assistance would not be necessary and therefore even a limited stay would not be appropriate because all of Mr. Carter's claims were vetted before the state courts and decided on the merits and therefore under twenty two fifty four D and this court's decision in Pinholster, the federal court is limited to reviewing the state court record.
We don't think that the prisoner's assistance in that case is necessary We don't think Mr. Carter has made a case for why his assistance would be necessary in this specific case.
Well why why shouldn't the rule be that an indefinite stay is is never necessary? You just proceed based on the evidence you have. Sometimes we have evidence where witness is missing, we have to go on with the case. uh then could be open Uh to argue in a later case that there was new evidence that was not available.
Well we absolutely agree, Justice Kennedy, that indefinite stays are never appropriate, regardless of the circumstances, that indefinite stays contravene EDPA's timeliness concerns. And to the extent that all of the parties in this case agree now that to the extent district courts have some power to issue stays, we say only limited stays. in these cases, that power is grounded in equitable discretion and we do not think that it comports with equitable discretion to allow a prisoner Essentially to win his case, to obtain a suspension of his capital sentence, the ultimate r end relief that he seeks. What
about the second part of of the question? So suppose that there's no stay, the the habeas uh proceeding is adjudicated against the petitioner, he then becomes competent um and claims there's new evidence. Would would would that be grounds to reopen, do you think?
Well we think in those s situations, certainly the State of Ohio wouldn't contest, for instance, under uh twenty two fifty-four B that if you were incompetent before, that that would be a legitimate basis potentially for not having been able to reasonably discover uh a new claim if one had a new claim. So we do think that moving forward that no indefinite stay should be permitted and when the courts move forward. Yes, if someone's competency is later restored, there are backstops. The person, certainly in Ohio, can always go back to state court.
And would the backstop be newly discovered evidence?
The backstop would be a newly discovered claim, I would I would say. I think that would be
Schumer, if if you are right that the no stay was appropriate in these circumstances, we would never reach the question of how much of a stay is appropriate in other circumstances, isn't that right?
I think that's right, because I think uh to the extent that using this case as a springboard, the court could draw the boundary line, could the could could draw one bright boundary line and say indefinite stays are never permitted, but limited stays might be permitted in cases where the claims are not record based.
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Chapters
8 chapters
1
What is the Supreme Court’s primary question about habeas stays in Tibbals v. Carter?
0:01–5:10
2
How does the Sixth Circuit’s reasoning on indefinite stays differ from the petitioners’ position?
5:10–9:12
3
Why do the parties argue that indefinite stays are incompatible with the EDPA’s timeliness concerns?
9:12–13:38
4
What criteria do the speakers propose for when a limited stay of habeas proceedings is appropriate?
13:38–17:44
5
How could newly discovered evidence or restored competency affect a previously stayed habeas petition?
17:44–22:16
6
What limits do the Justices suggest for the length of a stay once competency is likely to be restored?
22:16–27:06
7
How do the parties view the role of district courts in exercising discretion over stays?
27:06–32:02
8
What is the final recommendation on whether indefinite or limited stays should be permitted in this case?
32:02–35:36