Amy Lanzi

Are these products going to be pushing the envelope that's required for us? So we use that very simple framework across people and product and pitches. That's how I think about applying that across the three things.

Are these products going to be pushing the envelope that's required for us? So we use that very simple framework across people and product and pitches. That's how I think about applying that across the three things.

Yes, good name, great name.

Yes, good name, great name.

So, so many of our, and this is a huge conversation in Adweek this week, want to figure out how to understand, tap into, and leverage the creator economy. It's growing and growing and growing, and everyone talks about it, but it's really hard because there are, There are 3.5 million creators we see inside of Influential globally, and we see 100 billion data points every day about these creators.

So, so many of our, and this is a huge conversation in Adweek this week, want to figure out how to understand, tap into, and leverage the creator economy. It's growing and growing and growing, and everyone talks about it, but it's really hard because there are, There are 3.5 million creators we see inside of Influential globally, and we see 100 billion data points every day about these creators.

So when you get into trying to actually authentically leverage creators, you cannot do it without, like I said, a tech platform. to be able to quickly understand them, contract them, understand what are the rules of engagement, and to also keep up with them. And so you need to be able to have a tech approach to be able to do that. And so this was the main driver is one.

So when you get into trying to actually authentically leverage creators, you cannot do it without, like I said, a tech platform. to be able to quickly understand them, contract them, understand what are the rules of engagement, and to also keep up with them. And so you need to be able to have a tech approach to be able to do that. And so this was the main driver is one.

And now when you take that and you bring it into how we're investing in media, for example, and how paid and owned work together, you cannot do that without having a handle on creators. to think about how they fit in that mix and how we are working with them at scale. And I think the scale question is one. It's one thing if you have a couple of creators, it's manageable.

And now when you take that and you bring it into how we're investing in media, for example, and how paid and owned work together, you cannot do that without having a handle on creators. to think about how they fit in that mix and how we are working with them at scale. And I think the scale question is one. It's one thing if you have a couple of creators, it's manageable.

It's not when you're a global brand that wants to do this in a relevant way across markets. You need to have a tech platform and the data to be able to do it. That's the first. The second is, how do you then think about the rise of all the trends you might see to be able to then get smarter in media targeting?

It's not when you're a global brand that wants to do this in a relevant way across markets. You need to have a tech platform and the data to be able to do it. That's the first. The second is, how do you then think about the rise of all the trends you might see to be able to then get smarter in media targeting?

So now you mine for those and you build the cohorts and then you find the creators that are more likely to be someone that is leaned into girl math, for example. Now I can find someone that's tuned into this girl math mindset and I can find them programmatically because we've put all these things together.

So now you mine for those and you build the cohorts and then you find the creators that are more likely to be someone that is leaned into girl math, for example. Now I can find someone that's tuned into this girl math mindset and I can find them programmatically because we've put all these things together.

And the creator is really now that big connector that helps us have better insight and intel into our consumers.

And the creator is really now that big connector that helps us have better insight and intel into our consumers.

The mix of their tech is the primary difference. Also the culture of the management committee with ours. That's really important. I've done a couple acquisitions for group and that's the most important. It's a people business. So if the culture doesn't match on the management team level to the culture of the group, it won't work.

The mix of their tech is the primary difference. Also the culture of the management committee with ours. That's really important. I've done a couple acquisitions for group and that's the most important. It's a people business. So if the culture doesn't match on the management team level to the culture of the group, it won't work.

But the main thing is looking at that technology and just the scale that they had and how it would work within our world is really, they were a standout and that's why it happened.

But the main thing is looking at that technology and just the scale that they had and how it would work within our world is really, they were a standout and that's why it happened.

Maybe, could be. I mean, it depends on how brands want to leverage the technology. I mean, the clients we work with, it's more about how do you use creators and find the right creators to be in sub communities to be able to have an authentic connection because those brands won't survive over time.

Maybe, could be. I mean, it depends on how brands want to leverage the technology. I mean, the clients we work with, it's more about how do you use creators and find the right creators to be in sub communities to be able to have an authentic connection because those brands won't survive over time.

So for us, it's about that our North Star of networked experiences and how we are able to deeply understand the creators and all those things more deeply to then help brands like a Sephora, for example, authentically show up in a way that is a systematic approach versus one-off creators and you kind of don't know exactly what happened if you don't have this type of intelligence.

So for us, it's about that our North Star of networked experiences and how we are able to deeply understand the creators and all those things more deeply to then help brands like a Sephora, for example, authentically show up in a way that is a systematic approach versus one-off creators and you kind of don't know exactly what happened if you don't have this type of intelligence.

Well, it's a really good question. No one has a, like, to me, there are creators that are rising creators, right? That have, you know, nano created, they have a couple thousand or a hundred followers and they are like very important to certain cohorts or to communities. And then as they become more and more known, they then really, in my world, turn into influencers, right?

Well, it's a really good question. No one has a, like, to me, there are creators that are rising creators, right? That have, you know, nano created, they have a couple thousand or a hundred followers and they are like very important to certain cohorts or to communities. And then as they become more and more known, they then really, in my world, turn into influencers, right?

We didn't really need big influential when we were just looking for a couple of influencers. I will give an example, an old example, when I worked on a confectionery business and we were looking for mom bloggers, okay? That's old. This is old school, yeah. This is old school. Those were influencers. They were very influential in helping moms figure out lots of things.

We didn't really need big influential when we were just looking for a couple of influencers. I will give an example, an old example, when I worked on a confectionery business and we were looking for mom bloggers, okay? That's old. This is old school, yeah. This is old school. Those were influencers. They were very influential in helping moms figure out lots of things.

So now influencers are, I think, is an overused term because it, to me, is someone that's a little bit more well-known. You might be able to find them. They might actually have someone that's representing them, for example, versus the creators that you follow on your For Your Page and I follow that we're not going to find unless we're deep inside of a tech system like influential.

So now influencers are, I think, is an overused term because it, to me, is someone that's a little bit more well-known. You might be able to find them. They might actually have someone that's representing them, for example, versus the creators that you follow on your For Your Page and I follow that we're not going to find unless we're deep inside of a tech system like influential.

In my mind, yes. I mean, when we talk to clients and sort that, and they say we, and even clients, it's very open now, right? Everyone is saying, in fact, a lot of the creative pitches we have are really social pitches. They're just not calling them that. And sometimes they'll ask a PR agency because they're looking for influencers, but they're actually looking for creators.

In my mind, yes. I mean, when we talk to clients and sort that, and they say we, and even clients, it's very open now, right? Everyone is saying, in fact, a lot of the creative pitches we have are really social pitches. They're just not calling them that. And sometimes they'll ask a PR agency because they're looking for influencers, but they're actually looking for creators.

But because it's through the PR lens, they're used to the influencer language. So for us, we talk to clients about like, what type of creator are you looking for? Is this a new person? Is it someone that's really deeply into a sub-community? Like this is a Croc story that's very important to them. Versus is it someone that, you know, look at Emma Chamberlain. She was a creator on YouTube.

But because it's through the PR lens, they're used to the influencer language. So for us, we talk to clients about like, what type of creator are you looking for? Is this a new person? Is it someone that's really deeply into a sub-community? Like this is a Croc story that's very important to them. Versus is it someone that, you know, look at Emma Chamberlain. She was a creator on YouTube.

And now she's more of an influencer. She is someone that's sponsored by a beauty brand. So she has gone through that sort of life cycle. So when we talk to clients, we're like, what are we doing with them first? And then that'll help you land which of those areas you sort. But this is, you know, it's a pretty gray area, to be honest, on the use of those words.

And now she's more of an influencer. She is someone that's sponsored by a beauty brand. So she has gone through that sort of life cycle. So when we talk to clients, we're like, what are we doing with them first? And then that'll help you land which of those areas you sort. But this is, you know, it's a pretty gray area, to be honest, on the use of those words.

They're used interchangeably, I would say, in the market and with clients.

They're used interchangeably, I would say, in the market and with clients.

Interestingly, we did something with Crocs that is right in this, which is the social team found something that influencers made on YouTube in either 2006 or 2007, and some creators remade it. Okay, so just think about that. So I think, and it was an adage and whatever, but I think it's an interesting thing to look at the difference.

Interestingly, we did something with Crocs that is right in this, which is the social team found something that influencers made on YouTube in either 2006 or 2007, and some creators remade it. Okay, so just think about that. So I think, and it was an adage and whatever, but I think it's an interesting thing to look at the difference.

And I would say that there's probably some, so I don't know this, but there's probably something like, no, I'm not an influencer, I'm a creator. Which, you know, influencer also feels a little bit like you're maybe working for the man a little bit too, right? And just the lingua franca, but that's me. I don't know, I'm guessing. But I think your call is right. Well, you're the money.

And I would say that there's probably some, so I don't know this, but there's probably something like, no, I'm not an influencer, I'm a creator. Which, you know, influencer also feels a little bit like you're maybe working for the man a little bit too, right? And just the lingua franca, but that's me. I don't know, I'm guessing. But I think your call is right. Well, you're the money.

Yes.

Yes.

I think there is, that's a really good question. I think there is more to be made with the more, slightly more scaled, sophisticated creator, maybe they call themselves an influencer, because brands now are now, they've tested the waters. And so you have a lot of pressure to have all this content. And they've tested the waters. And now it's like I have all these different creators.

I think there is, that's a really good question. I think there is more to be made with the more, slightly more scaled, sophisticated creator, maybe they call themselves an influencer, because brands now are now, they've tested the waters. And so you have a lot of pressure to have all this content. And they've tested the waters. And now it's like I have all these different creators.

And if you let it loose too much, what does your brand stand for? Because brands are the original creators. Brands make... content. Brands made soap operas, for example. They were creators. And marketing innovation said differently is creating content.

And if you let it loose too much, what does your brand stand for? Because brands are the original creators. Brands make... content. Brands made soap operas, for example. They were creators. And marketing innovation said differently is creating content.

So I think as that becomes more of a need for brands to stand out as we have so much noise, I think there will be a little bit more of this, I need to have someone that's obviously authentic and important in a subculture, but also someone that I can count on and point to that has their own voice that feels right and authentic for the brand.

So I think as that becomes more of a need for brands to stand out as we have so much noise, I think there will be a little bit more of this, I need to have someone that's obviously authentic and important in a subculture, but also someone that I can count on and point to that has their own voice that feels right and authentic for the brand.

It does, which to me makes me tip back to the influencers because the more pay to play that is, the more not authentic it is. And I look at everything we talked about our kids through the lens of my 11 year old who's gonna call that and say like, this is not authentic. And I think we have to think, consumers are in control, we always say this, they really are.

It does, which to me makes me tip back to the influencers because the more pay to play that is, the more not authentic it is. And I look at everything we talked about our kids through the lens of my 11 year old who's gonna call that and say like, this is not authentic. And I think we have to think, consumers are in control, we always say this, they really are.

And they are also looking, brands need to protect what they stand for. Because if you play that out in the long term, and you don't have your proper comms plans, then what is the brand gonna stand for over time? Right? Especially in a world where there's so much content.

And they are also looking, brands need to protect what they stand for. Because if you play that out in the long term, and you don't have your proper comms plans, then what is the brand gonna stand for over time? Right? Especially in a world where there's so much content.

So you have to have something and you have to, it's not control, but you have to have your own authentic voice as a brand for a creator or an influencer to work. Otherwise, what are they talking about? Or what are you telling them to talk about if you haven't figured out what that is?

So you have to have something and you have to, it's not control, but you have to have your own authentic voice as a brand for a creator or an influencer to work. Otherwise, what are they talking about? Or what are you telling them to talk about if you haven't figured out what that is?

I think they want both, both. They want our ad dollars, to be clear. And they want brands' ad dollars. So one way to get at it is to make it about the individual that a brand is investing in that's a creator. That only works so much. So I think they want both, and they want to understand the balance of both.

I think they want both, both. They want our ad dollars, to be clear. And they want brands' ad dollars. So one way to get at it is to make it about the individual that a brand is investing in that's a creator. That only works so much. So I think they want both, and they want to understand the balance of both.

But I think the experience doesn't come off that way because a lot of brands don't know how to balance the two. So you probably experience more of the individual piece, the individual experience versus actually how brands authentically show up in a way that breaks through. But they want both. The platforms, they kind of want the ad dollars. It's really important.

But I think the experience doesn't come off that way because a lot of brands don't know how to balance the two. So you probably experience more of the individual piece, the individual experience versus actually how brands authentically show up in a way that breaks through. But they want both. The platforms, they kind of want the ad dollars. It's really important.

We see it in two ways. For me, when we say this inside of Digitas, at some point Mr. Beast needed an agency. So how do we become the agency of the YouTube creator that now grows up, right? He has an incredible set of products, et cetera. So there's one thing in terms of these businesses These creators actually could be new clients of ours. That's one way to think about it.

We see it in two ways. For me, when we say this inside of Digitas, at some point Mr. Beast needed an agency. So how do we become the agency of the YouTube creator that now grows up, right? He has an incredible set of products, et cetera. So there's one thing in terms of these businesses These creators actually could be new clients of ours. That's one way to think about it.

I think the other thing is, especially with brands, like I mentioned Sephora, that are very committed to beauty for all and diversity and inclusion, especially when it comes to beauty, that are building collabs with these creators. So it's a more cooperative engagement.

I think the other thing is, especially with brands, like I mentioned Sephora, that are very committed to beauty for all and diversity and inclusion, especially when it comes to beauty, that are building collabs with these creators. So it's a more cooperative engagement.

And brands that are doing that are really overcoming some of the things that may turn them off completely from the model on YouTube, for example. I think some of the things that are happening on TikTok shop is also really interesting in terms of how now expensive it's gotten. It used to be free. Now it's gotten very expensive to sell things on TikTok, which we knew was going to come.

And brands that are doing that are really overcoming some of the things that may turn them off completely from the model on YouTube, for example. I think some of the things that are happening on TikTok shop is also really interesting in terms of how now expensive it's gotten. It used to be free. Now it's gotten very expensive to sell things on TikTok, which we knew was going to come.

And so I think that's another thing that's going to also say like some new brands or creators that are now selling their own products in that way are now going to really rethink that model because you just can't afford it.

And so I think that's another thing that's going to also say like some new brands or creators that are now selling their own products in that way are now going to really rethink that model because you just can't afford it.

Well, I do. And I have to say, because I work on so many pitches, my whole situation is they're like, does she like cats? You don't have like a burner with a protected algorithm? No, I wish. So, like, my For You page is a little bit of a mess. But, yeah, there are some things that you see that, you know, live shopping, you're like, what's happening? Who is watching this?

Well, I do. And I have to say, because I work on so many pitches, my whole situation is they're like, does she like cats? You don't have like a burner with a protected algorithm? No, I wish. So, like, my For You page is a little bit of a mess. But, yeah, there are some things that you see that, you know, live shopping, you're like, what's happening? Who is watching this?

And, you know, what's happening here? But people are watching it. We just, again, this is like the sub-community component that if you get it right, we actually just had an interesting conversation today with Fanatics and Fanatics Live. Yeah. And it's incredible the people that are collectors that log on at 11 a.m. to watch this one person, Andy and Joe, that are selling a $4,000 collectible card.

And, you know, what's happening here? But people are watching it. We just, again, this is like the sub-community component that if you get it right, we actually just had an interesting conversation today with Fanatics and Fanatics Live. Yeah. And it's incredible the people that are collectors that log on at 11 a.m. to watch this one person, Andy and Joe, that are selling a $4,000 collectible card.

And you see it. And there's about 2,000 people on at 11 o'clock. And we just had that meeting today, which is wild. So there are people that want it because it's about attention. And now you can get as precise as that very specific moment. So when I see them, I say, what is this? And somebody's watching this.

And you see it. And there's about 2,000 people on at 11 o'clock. And we just had that meeting today, which is wild. So there are people that want it because it's about attention. And now you can get as precise as that very specific moment. So when I see them, I say, what is this? And somebody's watching this.

And this is fascinating as a curious marketer, how you understand this and you authentically show up.

And this is fascinating as a curious marketer, how you understand this and you authentically show up.

I think, like anything, the market normalizes to where it should be. I think that's fair. And I would say that we've talked about this in terms of just the search market. Look how much that's transformed. So, yeah, I think that what I am more forecasting is clients...

I think, like anything, the market normalizes to where it should be. I think that's fair. And I would say that we've talked about this in terms of just the search market. Look how much that's transformed. So, yeah, I think that what I am more forecasting is clients...

seeing especially when it comes to the creator space that have rushed into it and sort of decoupled from more traditional marketing things let's just call it that for now that have created a lot of chaos for their brand in the market that they're now wondering wait is this actually helping me sell more shampoo

seeing especially when it comes to the creator space that have rushed into it and sort of decoupled from more traditional marketing things let's just call it that for now that have created a lot of chaos for their brand in the market that they're now wondering wait is this actually helping me sell more shampoo

Is this really helping me build my brand, build loyal customers, and grow my fair share over time? And so I think there will be a little bit of a ruthless look at some of these things. And it's like anything in marketing. There's a big trend. Everyone rushes into it. And then you look back and say, did this sell the one more thing, which is how we view it?

Is this really helping me build my brand, build loyal customers, and grow my fair share over time? And so I think there will be a little bit of a ruthless look at some of these things. And it's like anything in marketing. There's a big trend. Everyone rushes into it. And then you look back and say, did this sell the one more thing, which is how we view it?

So I would imagine that there's a lot of energy and there's just only so much time. So the more creators that are here, there's diminishing returns on that.

So I would imagine that there's a lot of energy and there's just only so much time. So the more creators that are here, there's diminishing returns on that.

That has been going on for a while, especially with the birth of DTC brands when that was a thing, like when Casper was born. There also were a number of agencies that were born just like that, where they had certain creators, like creatives, not creators, that also had a piece of equity, and that was a new agency model.

That has been going on for a while, especially with the birth of DTC brands when that was a thing, like when Casper was born. There also were a number of agencies that were born just like that, where they had certain creators, like creatives, not creators, that also had a piece of equity, and that was a new agency model.

I do think that that is a continued trend now, but now it's about having these creators versus creatives on staff or taking these things in-house because they wanna be closer to performance. But I also know that at some point these brands need to grow up and they need to do things to drive shareholder value and do really big things in the market. And that's typically when they come to us.

I do think that that is a continued trend now, but now it's about having these creators versus creatives on staff or taking these things in-house because they wanna be closer to performance. But I also know that at some point these brands need to grow up and they need to do things to drive shareholder value and do really big things in the market. And that's typically when they come to us.

Thank you for having me.

Thank you for having me.

So it's not about winning in paid social, which is what a lot of them are worried, how do I sell the one more thing on Instagram and all dollars go there. But as they become more aggressive, there's more PE, whatever it is, they tend to then come seeking support that's more to get them to that next phase of growth.

So it's not about winning in paid social, which is what a lot of them are worried, how do I sell the one more thing on Instagram and all dollars go there. But as they become more aggressive, there's more PE, whatever it is, they tend to then come seeking support that's more to get them to that next phase of growth.

If they take another round of funding, that's one. And those are interesting ones, that's definite. Second, if they are now moving, let's just use the DDC thread, if they're suddenly, they were only selling direct and now they're selling it wholesale, and that's more complex to figure out how am I selling on my own channels and now how am I selling at Walmart or Target or whatever.

If they take another round of funding, that's one. And those are interesting ones, that's definite. Second, if they are now moving, let's just use the DDC thread, if they're suddenly, they were only selling direct and now they're selling it wholesale, and that's more complex to figure out how am I selling on my own channels and now how am I selling at Walmart or Target or whatever.

And so now they need more content, they need more support, they also need people that have an outside-in perspective that haven't grown up in that org. So those are the two signals, I would say, or if there's just immense pressure on that category, Casper is one of those.

And so now they need more content, they need more support, they also need people that have an outside-in perspective that haven't grown up in that org. So those are the two signals, I would say, or if there's just immense pressure on that category, Casper is one of those.

They looked for an agency because they were doing all these things in-house so that they need to really sort of change the game to be able to get to that next growth path.

They looked for an agency because they were doing all these things in-house so that they need to really sort of change the game to be able to get to that next growth path.

Is the question more about why are brands not investing there? Or is it more, why did Mr. Beast want to get into this space? Which is the question.

Is the question more about why are brands not investing there? Or is it more, why did Mr. Beast want to get into this space? Which is the question.

I'll pull them apart a little more.

I'll pull them apart a little more.

We're all 29. That's great.

We're all 29. That's great.

It won't, it's not, I understand the question now. It's not, I think it's a little bit of the, this has always happened. We've always seen stars create their beauty, for example, or a brand like Fabletics, for example. This is a model, we used to call it licensing, we just don't call it it anymore.

It won't, it's not, I understand the question now. It's not, I think it's a little bit of the, this has always happened. We've always seen stars create their beauty, for example, or a brand like Fabletics, for example. This is a model, we used to call it licensing, we just don't call it it anymore.

It's now a, someone like Mr. Beast that's decided to launch products, but it basically is licensing 3.0, if you think about it. And so it can't happen unless you have the right distribution model. So if they don't have that set up, at some point, everyone has to have the hard conversation when they get out of the direct model and they need to scale and they're now selling at those big retailers.

It's now a, someone like Mr. Beast that's decided to launch products, but it basically is licensing 3.0, if you think about it. And so it can't happen unless you have the right distribution model. So if they don't have that set up, at some point, everyone has to have the hard conversation when they get out of the direct model and they need to scale and they're now selling at those big retailers.

you're competing with everyone that has gigantic sales teams that goes in to talk to CVS or Walmart or whatever it is, that is unsustainable for them to keep up the momentum, drive enough innovation. At some point, it'll be too expensive. So that's one. And I think part of it is, yes, it's expensive to sponsor.

you're competing with everyone that has gigantic sales teams that goes in to talk to CVS or Walmart or whatever it is, that is unsustainable for them to keep up the momentum, drive enough innovation. At some point, it'll be too expensive. So that's one. And I think part of it is, yes, it's expensive to sponsor.

And also, I think, again, as brands need to figure out, there's no more money for brands. So if you are a YouTuber that suddenly becomes very expensive, there's a lot of other places you can spend money. That just doesn't make sense long term. So I can also spend my dollars elsewhere.

And also, I think, again, as brands need to figure out, there's no more money for brands. So if you are a YouTuber that suddenly becomes very expensive, there's a lot of other places you can spend money. That just doesn't make sense long term. So I can also spend my dollars elsewhere.

But I also think there's a little bit of, like, this is graduating as a YouTuber, for example, that you now have your own product line. Yeah. It's an ego thing, I think, too. I agree. Because there's a whole cottage industry that's wanting to get to this group that wants to sell them some new beauty line or whatever and convincing them that they can carry this.

But I also think there's a little bit of, like, this is graduating as a YouTuber, for example, that you now have your own product line. Yeah. It's an ego thing, I think, too. I agree. Because there's a whole cottage industry that's wanting to get to this group that wants to sell them some new beauty line or whatever and convincing them that they can carry this.

Wonderful, it sounds good. I'm a little scared, but it's gonna be good, yes. All right, let's start with the basics.

Wonderful, it sounds good. I'm a little scared, but it's gonna be good, yes. All right, let's start with the basics.

I think Any promise of infinite content that seems like it's right and authentic is a threat in general to brands as well as to the health of agencies. It sounds fantastic. I would say that in the market right now, even brands still have barely figured out how to just do DCO. So it sounds amazing to think about that offer, but it also comes with a lot of risk.

I think Any promise of infinite content that seems like it's right and authentic is a threat in general to brands as well as to the health of agencies. It sounds fantastic. I would say that in the market right now, even brands still have barely figured out how to just do DCO. So it sounds amazing to think about that offer, but it also comes with a lot of risk.

So we, Digitas, we built our own AI platform. We have, in partnership with Sapient, we have a solution that has been, the group has invested quite a bit here to have both an enterprise solution. So how do you design an enterprise approach for a CMO or a CTO so they can think about bringing AI into the way of working on that side? So you're not dependent on the platforms.

So we, Digitas, we built our own AI platform. We have, in partnership with Sapient, we have a solution that has been, the group has invested quite a bit here to have both an enterprise solution. So how do you design an enterprise approach for a CMO or a CTO so they can think about bringing AI into the way of working on that side? So you're not dependent on the platforms.

You need to be coming with your own set of content to be able to do that and your own systematic approach to it because it opens up a ton of risk. So I don't, in a world where brand safety is really important and with your example of someone turning a knob, I think this becomes a really interesting space to just say, sure, we'll give you all of our assets and go crazy and do that.

You need to be coming with your own set of content to be able to do that and your own systematic approach to it because it opens up a ton of risk. So I don't, in a world where brand safety is really important and with your example of someone turning a knob, I think this becomes a really interesting space to just say, sure, we'll give you all of our assets and go crazy and do that.

This is about, because it's about brand safety. So it used to be just about, okay, how do I make sure what's happening here is not placed against something that is unsafe for the consumer and not right for the brand? Now you've made double of that, which I think is a really interesting space when you listen to the promise of this. But it is something that we are

This is about, because it's about brand safety. So it used to be just about, okay, how do I make sure what's happening here is not placed against something that is unsafe for the consumer and not right for the brand? Now you've made double of that, which I think is a really interesting space when you listen to the promise of this. But it is something that we are

we're looking at saying like we all need to be able to use tools, AI tools, to be able to come up with more content. There's no question. There's no debate. We need more content. We need to feed all the feeds with content. But we also need to be able to do it in a way that's sustainable, that is also maintaining the integrity of that brand. And so how do you do that?

we're looking at saying like we all need to be able to use tools, AI tools, to be able to come up with more content. There's no question. There's no debate. We need more content. We need to feed all the feeds with content. But we also need to be able to do it in a way that's sustainable, that is also maintaining the integrity of that brand. And so how do you do that?

I don't know if I would just give all of my assets to any of those platforms.

I don't know if I would just give all of my assets to any of those platforms.

Yes, okay, so Digitas is an agency inside of Publicis Group. We are a modern marketing agency versus advertising, which is very important. Our value prop to our clients is around delivering networked experiences. What that means is how do we know more about them to earn the right in their own network? So that means the network of you, all the channels, all the places you spend time.

Yes, okay, so Digitas is an agency inside of Publicis Group. We are a modern marketing agency versus advertising, which is very important. Our value prop to our clients is around delivering networked experiences. What that means is how do we know more about them to earn the right in their own network? So that means the network of you, all the channels, all the places you spend time.

I definitely think that we are, I mean, in the market now, there is a demand for real life, right? We're seeing the rise of experiential. We're seeing the rise of sports. Consumers really wanna be in like connected moments. And so to me, that's less content, right? We're talking about attention and time.

I definitely think that we are, I mean, in the market now, there is a demand for real life, right? We're seeing the rise of experiential. We're seeing the rise of sports. Consumers really wanna be in like connected moments. And so to me, that's less content, right? We're talking about attention and time.

So if you are actively watching this rule or whatever that thing is, or you're going to a concert or living your life, you're not scrolling and consuming all of this content. So I think we are seeing a definite change in that for sure. And I am very hopeful as well because I don't have that much time either. And I also don't want that for future generations that that's all they're doing.

So if you are actively watching this rule or whatever that thing is, or you're going to a concert or living your life, you're not scrolling and consuming all of this content. So I think we are seeing a definite change in that for sure. And I am very hopeful as well because I don't have that much time either. And I also don't want that for future generations that that's all they're doing.

But I do think there's the continued transformations from all of these platforms that no matter where you're choosing to spend your time, you need new types of content to be there. So if you, you know, my son is, you know, a gamer. So like, how do you show up on Brawl Stars? That's a whole new content. That's a whole new set of thing that has to be contextually relevant.

But I do think there's the continued transformations from all of these platforms that no matter where you're choosing to spend your time, you need new types of content to be there. So if you, you know, my son is, you know, a gamer. So like, how do you show up on Brawl Stars? That's a whole new content. That's a whole new set of thing that has to be contextually relevant.

It has to feel right that someone is making while someone is over here playing Monopoly Go. See what I mean? So there's so many other interfaces now that, of course, we're going to need more content types. But I hope that doesn't mean everyone is consuming more content. That's their whole life.

It has to feel right that someone is making while someone is over here playing Monopoly Go. See what I mean? So there's so many other interfaces now that, of course, we're going to need more content types. But I hope that doesn't mean everyone is consuming more content. That's their whole life.

I need as a brand to be able to earn the right to be able to be part of your world. And then now I'm able to make loyal consumers and drive sales over time.

I need as a brand to be able to earn the right to be able to be part of your world. And then now I'm able to make loyal consumers and drive sales over time.

Our creatives I think are, they like the way they've been able to get to new, they like telling stories. So I think I would think about how the opportunity is to actually tell authentic stories, whether you're partnering with a creator or you have an incredible brand and you're creating fantastic stories to put into the market, because that's what consumers expect from brands.

Our creatives I think are, they like the way they've been able to get to new, they like telling stories. So I think I would think about how the opportunity is to actually tell authentic stories, whether you're partnering with a creator or you have an incredible brand and you're creating fantastic stories to put into the market, because that's what consumers expect from brands.

So they think about that opportunity as one. I think the second is also using some of the different tools we have to help our creatives come up with different territories, like traditional how you do pitches. that they can use all of our AI tools to come up with territories you wouldn't have thought of that then inspire these unique stories.

So they think about that opportunity as one. I think the second is also using some of the different tools we have to help our creatives come up with different territories, like traditional how you do pitches. that they can use all of our AI tools to come up with territories you wouldn't have thought of that then inspire these unique stories.

It's a little bit of what we talked about in the new front around the stories that brands, and it's a human, there's a human part of this. So there's actually, I think, a little bit more of a fierce protectiveness of the creative process. But we also need to be using and harnessing creators or these new products to be able to push the boundaries of what it means to tell stories.

It's a little bit of what we talked about in the new front around the stories that brands, and it's a human, there's a human part of this. So there's actually, I think, a little bit more of a fierce protectiveness of the creative process. But we also need to be using and harnessing creators or these new products to be able to push the boundaries of what it means to tell stories.

I don't feel as much that, I don't hear as much, I'm worried that everything is just going to be shoved into the feed and it's all going to look exactly the same. That's not something that I hear our creatives worried about, but it is something to worry about because if everything is a sea of sameness, no brands break out of that. So over time, it just erodes everything.

I don't feel as much that, I don't hear as much, I'm worried that everything is just going to be shoved into the feed and it's all going to look exactly the same. That's not something that I hear our creatives worried about, but it is something to worry about because if everything is a sea of sameness, no brands break out of that. So over time, it just erodes everything.

It's again, it gets back to the creators also want to make sure that they're connected to brands that that makes sense to them. So creatives are the ones that create the story around a brand and what that brand means and how that then enables a creator to be able to have a I call it like a freedom in a framework to be able to do things that feels right for Brand X.

It's again, it gets back to the creators also want to make sure that they're connected to brands that that makes sense to them. So creatives are the ones that create the story around a brand and what that brand means and how that then enables a creator to be able to have a I call it like a freedom in a framework to be able to do things that feels right for Brand X.

They wouldn't be doing that if it was just some random brand. There is that matchmaking that happens, and so I look at creatives, and this is what we were emailing about, is they're able to think about the timeless part of this brand, what it means, what you matter, what do you stand for, what are you known for, and then that enables the creators to be able to play in that space.

They wouldn't be doing that if it was just some random brand. There is that matchmaking that happens, and so I look at creatives, and this is what we were emailing about, is they're able to think about the timeless part of this brand, what it means, what you matter, what do you stand for, what are you known for, and then that enables the creators to be able to play in that space.

It gives them the right playground. Because then they're able to understand how they should, because otherwise it's completely not authentic. And then I think that's a risk for them in the market that, you know, someone like my daughter who's, you know, a sophomore in college won't follow them anymore.

It gives them the right playground. Because then they're able to understand how they should, because otherwise it's completely not authentic. And then I think that's a risk for them in the market that, you know, someone like my daughter who's, you know, a sophomore in college won't follow them anymore.

Yes.

Yes.

Yes.

Yes.

We, some of those things I can't talk about, but no, I mean, again, because we start, yeah, we start with, you know, search is fascinating and the search bar sort of tells lots of things. So we think about like, what is the right strategy for search and where do you spend that money?

We, some of those things I can't talk about, but no, I mean, again, because we start, yeah, we start with, you know, search is fascinating and the search bar sort of tells lots of things. So we think about like, what is the right strategy for search and where do you spend that money?

I would say, you know, a lot of the times it's less on Google and more on TikTok because that's where actually searches are starting. more so than other, or other platforms for that matter.

I would say, you know, a lot of the times it's less on Google and more on TikTok because that's where actually searches are starting. more so than other, or other platforms for that matter.

But I don't, we're not seeing our relation, it's just not really talked about, honestly, with like in the way we engage with them on how brands are thinking about showing up with Google today because it's sort of over there. It's the same thing with TikTok. Like we don't get into that. We just don't get into it with them.

But I don't, we're not seeing our relation, it's just not really talked about, honestly, with like in the way we engage with them on how brands are thinking about showing up with Google today because it's sort of over there. It's the same thing with TikTok. Like we don't get into that. We just don't get into it with them.

I mean, I think it's better because I think more choices are better. And I think what's right for the consumer, if consumers start doing different things, I think it's better to be able to have more choices instead of feeling like there's this one giant machine that feeds everything. I think it's better.

I mean, I think it's better because I think more choices are better. And I think what's right for the consumer, if consumers start doing different things, I think it's better to be able to have more choices instead of feeling like there's this one giant machine that feeds everything. I think it's better.

So to me, TikTok is an entertainment channel. And it's important to think about how you are, you know, showing up as a brand that entertains and how you're also, you know, right now, how are you thinking about TikTok? As I think it's like the 12th largest retailer right now with TikTok, as I mentioned, TikTok shops. How are you thinking about the behavior?

So to me, TikTok is an entertainment channel. And it's important to think about how you are, you know, showing up as a brand that entertains and how you're also, you know, right now, how are you thinking about TikTok? As I think it's like the 12th largest retailer right now with TikTok, as I mentioned, TikTok shops. How are you thinking about the behavior?

What does it tell you in terms of how you should be perhaps thinking about your own channel? We kind of... say that it's a place you have to be to be culturally relevant in there, but also like, what can you learn now? Because we don't know what's going to happen.

What does it tell you in terms of how you should be perhaps thinking about your own channel? We kind of... say that it's a place you have to be to be culturally relevant in there, but also like, what can you learn now? Because we don't know what's going to happen.

No, we don't advise on what's gonna happen next, it's more about what should we be doing now, because we don't know. We don't talk about that.

No, we don't advise on what's gonna happen next, it's more about what should we be doing now, because we don't know. We don't talk about that.

I mean, we have a great relationship in general. I think, again, for most of our brands, it's about how they're showing up and how they're relevant there. And then the role of the creators. It's less about that conversation. It's more about what is the right way to be contextually relevant on Instagram to either drive a purchase or drive brand love, honestly.

I mean, we have a great relationship in general. I think, again, for most of our brands, it's about how they're showing up and how they're relevant there. And then the role of the creators. It's less about that conversation. It's more about what is the right way to be contextually relevant on Instagram to either drive a purchase or drive brand love, honestly.

So to our North Star is following attention. So and that's pretty simple. When I say that to you, it means a lot when you're, you know, if you're working on a brand that's trying to get to Gen Z versus Generation Alpha, etc. And so we look at it as where should we be spending time to make authentic connections? for our brands.

So to our North Star is following attention. So and that's pretty simple. When I say that to you, it means a lot when you're, you know, if you're working on a brand that's trying to get to Gen Z versus Generation Alpha, etc. And so we look at it as where should we be spending time to make authentic connections? for our brands.

We tend to not necessarily get into that conversation in terms of you know, some creators you can't get to because of the pay model. But, you know, I don't, I could potentially see a time where there are certain creators that like, if they show up, that this is the one we have to, that is a must win. And what does that look like? And how does that brand feel about that?

We tend to not necessarily get into that conversation in terms of you know, some creators you can't get to because of the pay model. But, you know, I don't, I could potentially see a time where there are certain creators that like, if they show up, that this is the one we have to, that is a must win. And what does that look like? And how does that brand feel about that?

Because it's important now for brands to think about how the platforms are treating them and the investment model. Because, you know, at the end of the day, that's not going to sell more shampoo.

Because it's important now for brands to think about how the platforms are treating them and the investment model. Because, you know, at the end of the day, that's not going to sell more shampoo.

Well, it's both because people do different things.

Well, it's both because people do different things.

I have to pick one? Yeah.

I have to pick one? Yeah.

Instagram sells more things. Okay. Because TikTok shops is so new.

Instagram sells more things. Okay. Because TikTok shops is so new.

You know, I don't have a feeling on X, to be honest.

You know, I don't have a feeling on X, to be honest.

We are very careful on how they should be spending and does it right for the brand itself and understanding the risk reward. I think brand safety is a thing there. There's a lot of changes there. And so for brands, we talk about like, is this right for your brand? And what does that mean for you? And we're very clear on that.

We are very careful on how they should be spending and does it right for the brand itself and understanding the risk reward. I think brand safety is a thing there. There's a lot of changes there. And so for brands, we talk about like, is this right for your brand? And what does that mean for you? And we're very clear on that.

But I would say that honestly, a lot of our clients don't spend as much, their audience isn't necessarily spending that much time, at least the brands I work with. So it's much more of the conversation about TikTok versus Instagram,

But I would say that honestly, a lot of our clients don't spend as much, their audience isn't necessarily spending that much time, at least the brands I work with. So it's much more of the conversation about TikTok versus Instagram,

also Amazon, like that sort of space, and how you should be investing your dollars, or on connected TV, less so on X in that role, just for the brands that I work with.

also Amazon, like that sort of space, and how you should be investing your dollars, or on connected TV, less so on X in that role, just for the brands that I work with.

I don't. I feel like that, you know, for me, you could see it coming to life actually during some of the recent debates. And like what happened before versus what's happening now, I think is a completely different experience. And I think for brands that really want to be part of a live experience, they're actually investing to be like actually buying a TV spot on the Super Bowl to be part of it.

I don't. I feel like that, you know, for me, you could see it coming to life actually during some of the recent debates. And like what happened before versus what's happening now, I think is a completely different experience. And I think for brands that really want to be part of a live experience, they're actually investing to be like actually buying a TV spot on the Super Bowl to be part of it.

But it feels very different. I don't think that void has been filled. Yeah.

But it feels very different. I don't think that void has been filled. Yeah.

Yeah. Thanks for having me.

Yeah. Thanks for having me.

So that could be on a social platform, that could be on Roblox, that could be on ad-supported Netflix now, right? It could be in all those different places. And it's really about using intelligence to be able to figure out, is this a place I'm spending time? Is it a way I can create loyalty? I can create loyal consumers and then ultimately drive sales, obviously. But that's how we think about it.

So that could be on a social platform, that could be on Roblox, that could be on ad-supported Netflix now, right? It could be in all those different places. And it's really about using intelligence to be able to figure out, is this a place I'm spending time? Is it a way I can create loyalty? I can create loyal consumers and then ultimately drive sales, obviously. But that's how we think about it.

So it's an audience first mindset versus thinking about how you are investing in TV, which would be, I would say, the step change from the from to what you just sort of said. And the platforms really blur that world because how do you define who is a video partner? What does that mean? So that could be YouTube. That could be. So that's something we really think about is like the time and context.

So it's an audience first mindset versus thinking about how you are investing in TV, which would be, I would say, the step change from the from to what you just sort of said. And the platforms really blur that world because how do you define who is a video partner? What does that mean? So that could be YouTube. That could be. So that's something we really think about is like the time and context.

So attention and context are the two things you have to think about to be able to earn your right into a consumer's network.

So attention and context are the two things you have to think about to be able to earn your right into a consumer's network.

So we are scaled, so this is important in the agency world. And we also have our own scaled data offering inside of our world, which is Epsilon, which allows us to see consumers everywhere, not just in one place.

So we are scaled, so this is important in the agency world. And we also have our own scaled data offering inside of our world, which is Epsilon, which allows us to see consumers everywhere, not just in one place.

So being able to do that, so using identity to be able to make the right audience first approaches is how you really start to lean into all these places that you can't necessarily see beyond their own walls. I don't like the term walled gardens, but that's what I'm talking about here.

So being able to do that, so using identity to be able to make the right audience first approaches is how you really start to lean into all these places that you can't necessarily see beyond their own walls. I don't like the term walled gardens, but that's what I'm talking about here.

So that allows us to have a different view so I can see you in all the different places and know more about you as a human, purchase behavior, etc. So that then sets me up to be able to understand how I should be interacting with you with context across the different platforms.

So that allows us to have a different view so I can see you in all the different places and know more about you as a human, purchase behavior, etc. So that then sets me up to be able to understand how I should be interacting with you with context across the different platforms.

So scale is important when it comes to product and services. So think of the things that we sell to service and network. The value prop of networked experiences is a mixture of productized services. So everything we deliver, let's say we're delivering you a CRM program, we're using our products, in this case it's Epsilon, for example, to be able to deliver that.

So scale is important when it comes to product and services. So think of the things that we sell to service and network. The value prop of networked experiences is a mixture of productized services. So everything we deliver, let's say we're delivering you a CRM program, we're using our products, in this case it's Epsilon, for example, to be able to deliver that.

Is our data platform. So we have scaled products that enable us to compete with the platforms. Does that make sense? The way to get sale isn't hiring more, having a bigger agency.

Is our data platform. So we have scaled products that enable us to compete with the platforms. Does that make sense? The way to get sale isn't hiring more, having a bigger agency.

It has to be an agency that knows how to use data and technology in service of the consumer to be able to then not compete, but I would say collaborate with the platforms and now the creators so that it's a much more equal conversation. Otherwise, you know, Digitas was born in 1980. At that time, it was just a people business, really. And it was built on the promise of direct marketing.

It has to be an agency that knows how to use data and technology in service of the consumer to be able to then not compete, but I would say collaborate with the platforms and now the creators so that it's a much more equal conversation. Otherwise, you know, Digitas was born in 1980. At that time, it was just a people business, really. And it was built on the promise of direct marketing.

But that was humans talking about the promise of direct marketing and thinking about how you go direct to a household in mail, right? That was much of a human-based approach versus now you can't compete with Amazon. You have to work with them, but you have to bring your own data and your own tech to that conversation.

But that was humans talking about the promise of direct marketing and thinking about how you go direct to a household in mail, right? That was much of a human-based approach versus now you can't compete with Amazon. You have to work with them, but you have to bring your own data and your own tech to that conversation.

So let's start with the structure of Publicis. To your point on consolidation, we've done a really smart job in terms of how we've consolidated around this notion of product and scaled services. So we have a media pillar. We have Epsilon as its own pillar. Publicis Sapient for consulting is part of us. We have a creative pillar. And then there's the digital experience pillar.

So let's start with the structure of Publicis. To your point on consolidation, we've done a really smart job in terms of how we've consolidated around this notion of product and scaled services. So we have a media pillar. We have Epsilon as its own pillar. Publicis Sapient for consulting is part of us. We have a creative pillar. And then there's the digital experience pillar.

Inside of that pillar is where Digitas sits. It's one of five agencies. Inside of Digitas, we are organized by a mixed-shirts matrix and we are organized by capabilities and business owners is the most simple way to say that. So we have a series of offices, there is a managing director that is in charge of the client book and making sure those clients have

Inside of that pillar is where Digitas sits. It's one of five agencies. Inside of Digitas, we are organized by a mixed-shirts matrix and we are organized by capabilities and business owners is the most simple way to say that. So we have a series of offices, there is a managing director that is in charge of the client book and making sure those clients have

governance, the best in class service, as well as we're bringing new things to them to drive their business. And then we have key capability leaders that are driving strategy, media, creative, CRM, and commerce. So those are the big five capability owners. And then they work as a team in a matrix or to be able to deliver those product type services to clients.

governance, the best in class service, as well as we're bringing new things to them to drive their business. And then we have key capability leaders that are driving strategy, media, creative, CRM, and commerce. So those are the big five capability owners. And then they work as a team in a matrix or to be able to deliver those product type services to clients.

We do not fight inside of the family, and that is unique to Publicis. Many of the other holdcos, I was at another one for a long time, they do that, and that's a different strategy. We do not. So what we do is we do two things. One, it's what is its client first? So if a client says, I need these set of things, all the agencies are not the same.

We do not fight inside of the family, and that is unique to Publicis. Many of the other holdcos, I was at another one for a long time, they do that, and that's a different strategy. We do not. So what we do is we do two things. One, it's what is its client first? So if a client says, I need these set of things, all the agencies are not the same.

So which one is the best to service the client's needs? One. And that's an honest conversation. And for us, I'm ruthless about this. Because if you fake what you do, you won't win. So you're much better to be really honest about what you're great at and what you're not. And inside of Poulos' group, we're very clear on that. The second is managing on conflicts. So that's another thing.

So which one is the best to service the client's needs? One. And that's an honest conversation. And for us, I'm ruthless about this. Because if you fake what you do, you won't win. So you're much better to be really honest about what you're great at and what you're not. And inside of Poulos' group, we're very clear on that. The second is managing on conflicts. So that's another thing.

So if it's an even capability, let's say that it is between agency one and two, then you're looking at the conflicts to figure out how we service that. But I would say one of the other things that's interesting in the market, and there's a lot of conversation at Adweek, is just the idea of building bespoke teams to service a matrix client and matrix needs and complex needs.

So if it's an even capability, let's say that it is between agency one and two, then you're looking at the conflicts to figure out how we service that. But I would say one of the other things that's interesting in the market, and there's a lot of conversation at Adweek, is just the idea of building bespoke teams to service a matrix client and matrix needs and complex needs.

So that's something that our version of that is power of one. So we really end up being a key component of that, whether it's our data and analytics world or social world, etc. That's a compliment to another agency. So we're telling the client that's the very best thing to service their business.

So that's something that our version of that is power of one. So we really end up being a key component of that, whether it's our data and analytics world or social world, etc. That's a compliment to another agency. So we're telling the client that's the very best thing to service their business.

So previous to, I'll explain through previous to Digitas, I was running the commerce practice for the group. That was my job. My job was to build the new space for the group, which was a commerce capability. First of all, what is that? How do we build it? What are the products? What's the service layer? What's the go-to-market?

So previous to, I'll explain through previous to Digitas, I was running the commerce practice for the group. That was my job. My job was to build the new space for the group, which was a commerce capability. First of all, what is that? How do we build it? What are the products? What's the service layer? What's the go-to-market?

So you build that at the center because none of the agencies really had a strong commerce capability. What does that mean? In this case, it was how do I have stronger investment strategies with Amazon? How do I have the tools and technology to be able to deliver the best sales outcome for any of a packaged goods brand, for example?

So you build that at the center because none of the agencies really had a strong commerce capability. What does that mean? In this case, it was how do I have stronger investment strategies with Amazon? How do I have the tools and technology to be able to deliver the best sales outcome for any of a packaged goods brand, for example?

So that you build the capability in the center and then you start training the agencies and building that muscle into the agency. And then eventually you do one of two things. you acquire an agency to scale it, which we just did. We bought an agency called Mars United Commerce two weeks ago.

So that you build the capability in the center and then you start training the agencies and building that muscle into the agency. And then eventually you do one of two things. you acquire an agency to scale it, which we just did. We bought an agency called Mars United Commerce two weeks ago.

Or you then bake that capability into the agency and so now the agency can service that and use those products that are run at the center and then they're able to then build that into the actual value prop and the delivery model of the agency. So that's how a capability starts at the center and some things do stay in the center.

Or you then bake that capability into the agency and so now the agency can service that and use those products that are run at the center and then they're able to then build that into the actual value prop and the delivery model of the agency. So that's how a capability starts at the center and some things do stay in the center.

It's better to have certain media components that are all working together because those teams can learn new tech and move it faster into the agency or the delivery teams. But then there are things for Digitas in particular, and this is a unique place for Digitas within group, is we are inventors. Digitas is known for inventing and making.

It's better to have certain media components that are all working together because those teams can learn new tech and move it faster into the agency or the delivery teams. But then there are things for Digitas in particular, and this is a unique place for Digitas within group, is we are inventors. Digitas is known for inventing and making.

So we make choices on the things we're going to make to push with clients that then are sort of new space. You were at our new front, right? We developed that because it was a white space in the market. So that's what we'll make that's really true to the value prop of Digitas and what clients expect from us.

So we make choices on the things we're going to make to push with clients that then are sort of new space. You were at our new front, right? We developed that because it was a white space in the market. So that's what we'll make that's really true to the value prop of Digitas and what clients expect from us.

then those things end up potentially being something that scales across the other agencies.

then those things end up potentially being something that scales across the other agencies.

Yes, we do. Yes, we do. We have to. I mean, we do because it's new to us and we need to make the market for ourselves first. Part of it is also you're not going to take something and scale it on other clients either. And our clients come to us with that expectation. And it's also part of our IP. We are unicorns and that's part of our DNA.

Yes, we do. Yes, we do. We have to. I mean, we do because it's new to us and we need to make the market for ourselves first. Part of it is also you're not going to take something and scale it on other clients either. And our clients come to us with that expectation. And it's also part of our IP. We are unicorns and that's part of our DNA.

So I'm so glad you asked me this. I was ready. This was the one question.

So I'm so glad you asked me this. I was ready. This was the one question.

So when I joined Digitas, one of the things I noticed is that everyone talked about the culture of Digitas. It's fantastic. I said, great, tell me about it. What is the culture? Well, it's fantastic. It's everyone likes each other. It's really great. No one could articulate the words. And to me, a culture is important about the talent and the types of clients and the types of decisions you make.

So when I joined Digitas, one of the things I noticed is that everyone talked about the culture of Digitas. It's fantastic. I said, great, tell me about it. What is the culture? Well, it's fantastic. It's everyone likes each other. It's really great. No one could articulate the words. And to me, a culture is important about the talent and the types of clients and the types of decisions you make.

So we reset our culture. We're fearless. We're inventive. We're generous. Unicorns love figs. You get it? And that is how we make decisions. So everything we do, we use that, right? So we say, is this making us more fearless, inventive, and generous? Are we bringing this, are we making decisions for our clients, for our talent?

So we reset our culture. We're fearless. We're inventive. We're generous. Unicorns love figs. You get it? And that is how we make decisions. So everything we do, we use that, right? So we say, is this making us more fearless, inventive, and generous? Are we bringing this, are we making decisions for our clients, for our talent?

Are these products going to be pushing the envelope that's required for us? So we use that very simple framework across people and product and pitches. That's how I think about applying that across the three things.

Yes, good name, great name.

So, so many of our, and this is a huge conversation in Adweek this week, want to figure out how to understand, tap into, and leverage the creator economy. It's growing and growing and growing, and everyone talks about it, but it's really hard because there are, There are 3.5 million creators we see inside of Influential globally, and we see 100 billion data points every day about these creators.

So when you get into trying to actually authentically leverage creators, you cannot do it without, like I said, a tech platform. to be able to quickly understand them, contract them, understand what are the rules of engagement, and to also keep up with them. And so you need to be able to have a tech approach to be able to do that. And so this was the main driver is one.

And now when you take that and you bring it into how we're investing in media, for example, and how paid and owned work together, you cannot do that without having a handle on creators. to think about how they fit in that mix and how we are working with them at scale. And I think the scale question is one. It's one thing if you have a couple of creators, it's manageable.

It's not when you're a global brand that wants to do this in a relevant way across markets. You need to have a tech platform and the data to be able to do it. That's the first. The second is, how do you then think about the rise of all the trends you might see to be able to then get smarter in media targeting?

So now you mine for those and you build the cohorts and then you find the creators that are more likely to be someone that is leaned into girl math, for example. Now I can find someone that's tuned into this girl math mindset and I can find them programmatically because we've put all these things together.

And the creator is really now that big connector that helps us have better insight and intel into our consumers.

The mix of their tech is the primary difference. Also the culture of the management committee with ours. That's really important. I've done a couple acquisitions for group and that's the most important. It's a people business. So if the culture doesn't match on the management team level to the culture of the group, it won't work.

But the main thing is looking at that technology and just the scale that they had and how it would work within our world is really, they were a standout and that's why it happened.

Maybe, could be. I mean, it depends on how brands want to leverage the technology. I mean, the clients we work with, it's more about how do you use creators and find the right creators to be in sub communities to be able to have an authentic connection because those brands won't survive over time.

So for us, it's about that our North Star of networked experiences and how we are able to deeply understand the creators and all those things more deeply to then help brands like a Sephora, for example, authentically show up in a way that is a systematic approach versus one-off creators and you kind of don't know exactly what happened if you don't have this type of intelligence.

Well, it's a really good question. No one has a, like, to me, there are creators that are rising creators, right? That have, you know, nano created, they have a couple thousand or a hundred followers and they are like very important to certain cohorts or to communities. And then as they become more and more known, they then really, in my world, turn into influencers, right?

We didn't really need big influential when we were just looking for a couple of influencers. I will give an example, an old example, when I worked on a confectionery business and we were looking for mom bloggers, okay? That's old. This is old school, yeah. This is old school. Those were influencers. They were very influential in helping moms figure out lots of things.

So now influencers are, I think, is an overused term because it, to me, is someone that's a little bit more well-known. You might be able to find them. They might actually have someone that's representing them, for example, versus the creators that you follow on your For Your Page and I follow that we're not going to find unless we're deep inside of a tech system like influential.

In my mind, yes. I mean, when we talk to clients and sort that, and they say we, and even clients, it's very open now, right? Everyone is saying, in fact, a lot of the creative pitches we have are really social pitches. They're just not calling them that. And sometimes they'll ask a PR agency because they're looking for influencers, but they're actually looking for creators.

But because it's through the PR lens, they're used to the influencer language. So for us, we talk to clients about like, what type of creator are you looking for? Is this a new person? Is it someone that's really deeply into a sub-community? Like this is a Croc story that's very important to them. Versus is it someone that, you know, look at Emma Chamberlain. She was a creator on YouTube.

And now she's more of an influencer. She is someone that's sponsored by a beauty brand. So she has gone through that sort of life cycle. So when we talk to clients, we're like, what are we doing with them first? And then that'll help you land which of those areas you sort. But this is, you know, it's a pretty gray area, to be honest, on the use of those words.

They're used interchangeably, I would say, in the market and with clients.

Interestingly, we did something with Crocs that is right in this, which is the social team found something that influencers made on YouTube in either 2006 or 2007, and some creators remade it. Okay, so just think about that. So I think, and it was an adage and whatever, but I think it's an interesting thing to look at the difference.

And I would say that there's probably some, so I don't know this, but there's probably something like, no, I'm not an influencer, I'm a creator. Which, you know, influencer also feels a little bit like you're maybe working for the man a little bit too, right? And just the lingua franca, but that's me. I don't know, I'm guessing. But I think your call is right. Well, you're the money.

Yes.

I think there is, that's a really good question. I think there is more to be made with the more, slightly more scaled, sophisticated creator, maybe they call themselves an influencer, because brands now are now, they've tested the waters. And so you have a lot of pressure to have all this content. And they've tested the waters. And now it's like I have all these different creators.

And if you let it loose too much, what does your brand stand for? Because brands are the original creators. Brands make... content. Brands made soap operas, for example. They were creators. And marketing innovation said differently is creating content.

So I think as that becomes more of a need for brands to stand out as we have so much noise, I think there will be a little bit more of this, I need to have someone that's obviously authentic and important in a subculture, but also someone that I can count on and point to that has their own voice that feels right and authentic for the brand.

It does, which to me makes me tip back to the influencers because the more pay to play that is, the more not authentic it is. And I look at everything we talked about our kids through the lens of my 11 year old who's gonna call that and say like, this is not authentic. And I think we have to think, consumers are in control, we always say this, they really are.

And they are also looking, brands need to protect what they stand for. Because if you play that out in the long term, and you don't have your proper comms plans, then what is the brand gonna stand for over time? Right? Especially in a world where there's so much content.

So you have to have something and you have to, it's not control, but you have to have your own authentic voice as a brand for a creator or an influencer to work. Otherwise, what are they talking about? Or what are you telling them to talk about if you haven't figured out what that is?

I think they want both, both. They want our ad dollars, to be clear. And they want brands' ad dollars. So one way to get at it is to make it about the individual that a brand is investing in that's a creator. That only works so much. So I think they want both, and they want to understand the balance of both.

But I think the experience doesn't come off that way because a lot of brands don't know how to balance the two. So you probably experience more of the individual piece, the individual experience versus actually how brands authentically show up in a way that breaks through. But they want both. The platforms, they kind of want the ad dollars. It's really important.

We see it in two ways. For me, when we say this inside of Digitas, at some point Mr. Beast needed an agency. So how do we become the agency of the YouTube creator that now grows up, right? He has an incredible set of products, et cetera. So there's one thing in terms of these businesses These creators actually could be new clients of ours. That's one way to think about it.

I think the other thing is, especially with brands, like I mentioned Sephora, that are very committed to beauty for all and diversity and inclusion, especially when it comes to beauty, that are building collabs with these creators. So it's a more cooperative engagement.

And brands that are doing that are really overcoming some of the things that may turn them off completely from the model on YouTube, for example. I think some of the things that are happening on TikTok shop is also really interesting in terms of how now expensive it's gotten. It used to be free. Now it's gotten very expensive to sell things on TikTok, which we knew was going to come.

And so I think that's another thing that's going to also say like some new brands or creators that are now selling their own products in that way are now going to really rethink that model because you just can't afford it.

Well, I do. And I have to say, because I work on so many pitches, my whole situation is they're like, does she like cats? You don't have like a burner with a protected algorithm? No, I wish. So, like, my For You page is a little bit of a mess. But, yeah, there are some things that you see that, you know, live shopping, you're like, what's happening? Who is watching this?

And, you know, what's happening here? But people are watching it. We just, again, this is like the sub-community component that if you get it right, we actually just had an interesting conversation today with Fanatics and Fanatics Live. Yeah. And it's incredible the people that are collectors that log on at 11 a.m. to watch this one person, Andy and Joe, that are selling a $4,000 collectible card.

And you see it. And there's about 2,000 people on at 11 o'clock. And we just had that meeting today, which is wild. So there are people that want it because it's about attention. And now you can get as precise as that very specific moment. So when I see them, I say, what is this? And somebody's watching this.

And this is fascinating as a curious marketer, how you understand this and you authentically show up.

I think, like anything, the market normalizes to where it should be. I think that's fair. And I would say that we've talked about this in terms of just the search market. Look how much that's transformed. So, yeah, I think that what I am more forecasting is clients...

seeing especially when it comes to the creator space that have rushed into it and sort of decoupled from more traditional marketing things let's just call it that for now that have created a lot of chaos for their brand in the market that they're now wondering wait is this actually helping me sell more shampoo

Is this really helping me build my brand, build loyal customers, and grow my fair share over time? And so I think there will be a little bit of a ruthless look at some of these things. And it's like anything in marketing. There's a big trend. Everyone rushes into it. And then you look back and say, did this sell the one more thing, which is how we view it?

So I would imagine that there's a lot of energy and there's just only so much time. So the more creators that are here, there's diminishing returns on that.

That has been going on for a while, especially with the birth of DTC brands when that was a thing, like when Casper was born. There also were a number of agencies that were born just like that, where they had certain creators, like creatives, not creators, that also had a piece of equity, and that was a new agency model.

I do think that that is a continued trend now, but now it's about having these creators versus creatives on staff or taking these things in-house because they wanna be closer to performance. But I also know that at some point these brands need to grow up and they need to do things to drive shareholder value and do really big things in the market. And that's typically when they come to us.

Thank you for having me.

So it's not about winning in paid social, which is what a lot of them are worried, how do I sell the one more thing on Instagram and all dollars go there. But as they become more aggressive, there's more PE, whatever it is, they tend to then come seeking support that's more to get them to that next phase of growth.

If they take another round of funding, that's one. And those are interesting ones, that's definite. Second, if they are now moving, let's just use the DDC thread, if they're suddenly, they were only selling direct and now they're selling it wholesale, and that's more complex to figure out how am I selling on my own channels and now how am I selling at Walmart or Target or whatever.

And so now they need more content, they need more support, they also need people that have an outside-in perspective that haven't grown up in that org. So those are the two signals, I would say, or if there's just immense pressure on that category, Casper is one of those.

They looked for an agency because they were doing all these things in-house so that they need to really sort of change the game to be able to get to that next growth path.

Is the question more about why are brands not investing there? Or is it more, why did Mr. Beast want to get into this space? Which is the question.

I'll pull them apart a little more.

We're all 29. That's great.

It won't, it's not, I understand the question now. It's not, I think it's a little bit of the, this has always happened. We've always seen stars create their beauty, for example, or a brand like Fabletics, for example. This is a model, we used to call it licensing, we just don't call it it anymore.

It's now a, someone like Mr. Beast that's decided to launch products, but it basically is licensing 3.0, if you think about it. And so it can't happen unless you have the right distribution model. So if they don't have that set up, at some point, everyone has to have the hard conversation when they get out of the direct model and they need to scale and they're now selling at those big retailers.

you're competing with everyone that has gigantic sales teams that goes in to talk to CVS or Walmart or whatever it is, that is unsustainable for them to keep up the momentum, drive enough innovation. At some point, it'll be too expensive. So that's one. And I think part of it is, yes, it's expensive to sponsor.

And also, I think, again, as brands need to figure out, there's no more money for brands. So if you are a YouTuber that suddenly becomes very expensive, there's a lot of other places you can spend money. That just doesn't make sense long term. So I can also spend my dollars elsewhere.

But I also think there's a little bit of, like, this is graduating as a YouTuber, for example, that you now have your own product line. Yeah. It's an ego thing, I think, too. I agree. Because there's a whole cottage industry that's wanting to get to this group that wants to sell them some new beauty line or whatever and convincing them that they can carry this.

Wonderful, it sounds good. I'm a little scared, but it's gonna be good, yes. All right, let's start with the basics.

I think Any promise of infinite content that seems like it's right and authentic is a threat in general to brands as well as to the health of agencies. It sounds fantastic. I would say that in the market right now, even brands still have barely figured out how to just do DCO. So it sounds amazing to think about that offer, but it also comes with a lot of risk.

So we, Digitas, we built our own AI platform. We have, in partnership with Sapient, we have a solution that has been, the group has invested quite a bit here to have both an enterprise solution. So how do you design an enterprise approach for a CMO or a CTO so they can think about bringing AI into the way of working on that side? So you're not dependent on the platforms.

You need to be coming with your own set of content to be able to do that and your own systematic approach to it because it opens up a ton of risk. So I don't, in a world where brand safety is really important and with your example of someone turning a knob, I think this becomes a really interesting space to just say, sure, we'll give you all of our assets and go crazy and do that.

This is about, because it's about brand safety. So it used to be just about, okay, how do I make sure what's happening here is not placed against something that is unsafe for the consumer and not right for the brand? Now you've made double of that, which I think is a really interesting space when you listen to the promise of this. But it is something that we are

we're looking at saying like we all need to be able to use tools, AI tools, to be able to come up with more content. There's no question. There's no debate. We need more content. We need to feed all the feeds with content. But we also need to be able to do it in a way that's sustainable, that is also maintaining the integrity of that brand. And so how do you do that?

I don't know if I would just give all of my assets to any of those platforms.

Yes, okay, so Digitas is an agency inside of Publicis Group. We are a modern marketing agency versus advertising, which is very important. Our value prop to our clients is around delivering networked experiences. What that means is how do we know more about them to earn the right in their own network? So that means the network of you, all the channels, all the places you spend time.

I definitely think that we are, I mean, in the market now, there is a demand for real life, right? We're seeing the rise of experiential. We're seeing the rise of sports. Consumers really wanna be in like connected moments. And so to me, that's less content, right? We're talking about attention and time.

So if you are actively watching this rule or whatever that thing is, or you're going to a concert or living your life, you're not scrolling and consuming all of this content. So I think we are seeing a definite change in that for sure. And I am very hopeful as well because I don't have that much time either. And I also don't want that for future generations that that's all they're doing.

But I do think there's the continued transformations from all of these platforms that no matter where you're choosing to spend your time, you need new types of content to be there. So if you, you know, my son is, you know, a gamer. So like, how do you show up on Brawl Stars? That's a whole new content. That's a whole new set of thing that has to be contextually relevant.

It has to feel right that someone is making while someone is over here playing Monopoly Go. See what I mean? So there's so many other interfaces now that, of course, we're going to need more content types. But I hope that doesn't mean everyone is consuming more content. That's their whole life.

I need as a brand to be able to earn the right to be able to be part of your world. And then now I'm able to make loyal consumers and drive sales over time.

Our creatives I think are, they like the way they've been able to get to new, they like telling stories. So I think I would think about how the opportunity is to actually tell authentic stories, whether you're partnering with a creator or you have an incredible brand and you're creating fantastic stories to put into the market, because that's what consumers expect from brands.

So they think about that opportunity as one. I think the second is also using some of the different tools we have to help our creatives come up with different territories, like traditional how you do pitches. that they can use all of our AI tools to come up with territories you wouldn't have thought of that then inspire these unique stories.

It's a little bit of what we talked about in the new front around the stories that brands, and it's a human, there's a human part of this. So there's actually, I think, a little bit more of a fierce protectiveness of the creative process. But we also need to be using and harnessing creators or these new products to be able to push the boundaries of what it means to tell stories.

I don't feel as much that, I don't hear as much, I'm worried that everything is just going to be shoved into the feed and it's all going to look exactly the same. That's not something that I hear our creatives worried about, but it is something to worry about because if everything is a sea of sameness, no brands break out of that. So over time, it just erodes everything.

It's again, it gets back to the creators also want to make sure that they're connected to brands that that makes sense to them. So creatives are the ones that create the story around a brand and what that brand means and how that then enables a creator to be able to have a I call it like a freedom in a framework to be able to do things that feels right for Brand X.

They wouldn't be doing that if it was just some random brand. There is that matchmaking that happens, and so I look at creatives, and this is what we were emailing about, is they're able to think about the timeless part of this brand, what it means, what you matter, what do you stand for, what are you known for, and then that enables the creators to be able to play in that space.

It gives them the right playground. Because then they're able to understand how they should, because otherwise it's completely not authentic. And then I think that's a risk for them in the market that, you know, someone like my daughter who's, you know, a sophomore in college won't follow them anymore.

Yes.

Yes.

We, some of those things I can't talk about, but no, I mean, again, because we start, yeah, we start with, you know, search is fascinating and the search bar sort of tells lots of things. So we think about like, what is the right strategy for search and where do you spend that money?

I would say, you know, a lot of the times it's less on Google and more on TikTok because that's where actually searches are starting. more so than other, or other platforms for that matter.

But I don't, we're not seeing our relation, it's just not really talked about, honestly, with like in the way we engage with them on how brands are thinking about showing up with Google today because it's sort of over there. It's the same thing with TikTok. Like we don't get into that. We just don't get into it with them.

I mean, I think it's better because I think more choices are better. And I think what's right for the consumer, if consumers start doing different things, I think it's better to be able to have more choices instead of feeling like there's this one giant machine that feeds everything. I think it's better.

So to me, TikTok is an entertainment channel. And it's important to think about how you are, you know, showing up as a brand that entertains and how you're also, you know, right now, how are you thinking about TikTok? As I think it's like the 12th largest retailer right now with TikTok, as I mentioned, TikTok shops. How are you thinking about the behavior?

What does it tell you in terms of how you should be perhaps thinking about your own channel? We kind of... say that it's a place you have to be to be culturally relevant in there, but also like, what can you learn now? Because we don't know what's going to happen.

No, we don't advise on what's gonna happen next, it's more about what should we be doing now, because we don't know. We don't talk about that.

I mean, we have a great relationship in general. I think, again, for most of our brands, it's about how they're showing up and how they're relevant there. And then the role of the creators. It's less about that conversation. It's more about what is the right way to be contextually relevant on Instagram to either drive a purchase or drive brand love, honestly.

So to our North Star is following attention. So and that's pretty simple. When I say that to you, it means a lot when you're, you know, if you're working on a brand that's trying to get to Gen Z versus Generation Alpha, etc. And so we look at it as where should we be spending time to make authentic connections? for our brands.

We tend to not necessarily get into that conversation in terms of you know, some creators you can't get to because of the pay model. But, you know, I don't, I could potentially see a time where there are certain creators that like, if they show up, that this is the one we have to, that is a must win. And what does that look like? And how does that brand feel about that?

Because it's important now for brands to think about how the platforms are treating them and the investment model. Because, you know, at the end of the day, that's not going to sell more shampoo.

Well, it's both because people do different things.

I have to pick one? Yeah.

Instagram sells more things. Okay. Because TikTok shops is so new.

You know, I don't have a feeling on X, to be honest.

We are very careful on how they should be spending and does it right for the brand itself and understanding the risk reward. I think brand safety is a thing there. There's a lot of changes there. And so for brands, we talk about like, is this right for your brand? And what does that mean for you? And we're very clear on that.

But I would say that honestly, a lot of our clients don't spend as much, their audience isn't necessarily spending that much time, at least the brands I work with. So it's much more of the conversation about TikTok versus Instagram,

also Amazon, like that sort of space, and how you should be investing your dollars, or on connected TV, less so on X in that role, just for the brands that I work with.

I don't. I feel like that, you know, for me, you could see it coming to life actually during some of the recent debates. And like what happened before versus what's happening now, I think is a completely different experience. And I think for brands that really want to be part of a live experience, they're actually investing to be like actually buying a TV spot on the Super Bowl to be part of it.

But it feels very different. I don't think that void has been filled. Yeah.

Yeah. Thanks for having me.

So that could be on a social platform, that could be on Roblox, that could be on ad-supported Netflix now, right? It could be in all those different places. And it's really about using intelligence to be able to figure out, is this a place I'm spending time? Is it a way I can create loyalty? I can create loyal consumers and then ultimately drive sales, obviously. But that's how we think about it.

So it's an audience first mindset versus thinking about how you are investing in TV, which would be, I would say, the step change from the from to what you just sort of said. And the platforms really blur that world because how do you define who is a video partner? What does that mean? So that could be YouTube. That could be. So that's something we really think about is like the time and context.

So attention and context are the two things you have to think about to be able to earn your right into a consumer's network.

So we are scaled, so this is important in the agency world. And we also have our own scaled data offering inside of our world, which is Epsilon, which allows us to see consumers everywhere, not just in one place.

So being able to do that, so using identity to be able to make the right audience first approaches is how you really start to lean into all these places that you can't necessarily see beyond their own walls. I don't like the term walled gardens, but that's what I'm talking about here.

So that allows us to have a different view so I can see you in all the different places and know more about you as a human, purchase behavior, etc. So that then sets me up to be able to understand how I should be interacting with you with context across the different platforms.

So scale is important when it comes to product and services. So think of the things that we sell to service and network. The value prop of networked experiences is a mixture of productized services. So everything we deliver, let's say we're delivering you a CRM program, we're using our products, in this case it's Epsilon, for example, to be able to deliver that.

Is our data platform. So we have scaled products that enable us to compete with the platforms. Does that make sense? The way to get sale isn't hiring more, having a bigger agency.

It has to be an agency that knows how to use data and technology in service of the consumer to be able to then not compete, but I would say collaborate with the platforms and now the creators so that it's a much more equal conversation. Otherwise, you know, Digitas was born in 1980. At that time, it was just a people business, really. And it was built on the promise of direct marketing.

But that was humans talking about the promise of direct marketing and thinking about how you go direct to a household in mail, right? That was much of a human-based approach versus now you can't compete with Amazon. You have to work with them, but you have to bring your own data and your own tech to that conversation.

So let's start with the structure of Publicis. To your point on consolidation, we've done a really smart job in terms of how we've consolidated around this notion of product and scaled services. So we have a media pillar. We have Epsilon as its own pillar. Publicis Sapient for consulting is part of us. We have a creative pillar. And then there's the digital experience pillar.

Inside of that pillar is where Digitas sits. It's one of five agencies. Inside of Digitas, we are organized by a mixed-shirts matrix and we are organized by capabilities and business owners is the most simple way to say that. So we have a series of offices, there is a managing director that is in charge of the client book and making sure those clients have

governance, the best in class service, as well as we're bringing new things to them to drive their business. And then we have key capability leaders that are driving strategy, media, creative, CRM, and commerce. So those are the big five capability owners. And then they work as a team in a matrix or to be able to deliver those product type services to clients.

We do not fight inside of the family, and that is unique to Publicis. Many of the other holdcos, I was at another one for a long time, they do that, and that's a different strategy. We do not. So what we do is we do two things. One, it's what is its client first? So if a client says, I need these set of things, all the agencies are not the same.

So which one is the best to service the client's needs? One. And that's an honest conversation. And for us, I'm ruthless about this. Because if you fake what you do, you won't win. So you're much better to be really honest about what you're great at and what you're not. And inside of Poulos' group, we're very clear on that. The second is managing on conflicts. So that's another thing.

So if it's an even capability, let's say that it is between agency one and two, then you're looking at the conflicts to figure out how we service that. But I would say one of the other things that's interesting in the market, and there's a lot of conversation at Adweek, is just the idea of building bespoke teams to service a matrix client and matrix needs and complex needs.

So that's something that our version of that is power of one. So we really end up being a key component of that, whether it's our data and analytics world or social world, etc. That's a compliment to another agency. So we're telling the client that's the very best thing to service their business.

So previous to, I'll explain through previous to Digitas, I was running the commerce practice for the group. That was my job. My job was to build the new space for the group, which was a commerce capability. First of all, what is that? How do we build it? What are the products? What's the service layer? What's the go-to-market?

So you build that at the center because none of the agencies really had a strong commerce capability. What does that mean? In this case, it was how do I have stronger investment strategies with Amazon? How do I have the tools and technology to be able to deliver the best sales outcome for any of a packaged goods brand, for example?

So that you build the capability in the center and then you start training the agencies and building that muscle into the agency. And then eventually you do one of two things. you acquire an agency to scale it, which we just did. We bought an agency called Mars United Commerce two weeks ago.

Or you then bake that capability into the agency and so now the agency can service that and use those products that are run at the center and then they're able to then build that into the actual value prop and the delivery model of the agency. So that's how a capability starts at the center and some things do stay in the center.

It's better to have certain media components that are all working together because those teams can learn new tech and move it faster into the agency or the delivery teams. But then there are things for Digitas in particular, and this is a unique place for Digitas within group, is we are inventors. Digitas is known for inventing and making.

So we make choices on the things we're going to make to push with clients that then are sort of new space. You were at our new front, right? We developed that because it was a white space in the market. So that's what we'll make that's really true to the value prop of Digitas and what clients expect from us.

then those things end up potentially being something that scales across the other agencies.

Yes, we do. Yes, we do. We have to. I mean, we do because it's new to us and we need to make the market for ourselves first. Part of it is also you're not going to take something and scale it on other clients either. And our clients come to us with that expectation. And it's also part of our IP. We are unicorns and that's part of our DNA.

So I'm so glad you asked me this. I was ready. This was the one question.

So when I joined Digitas, one of the things I noticed is that everyone talked about the culture of Digitas. It's fantastic. I said, great, tell me about it. What is the culture? Well, it's fantastic. It's everyone likes each other. It's really great. No one could articulate the words. And to me, a culture is important about the talent and the types of clients and the types of decisions you make.

So we reset our culture. We're fearless. We're inventive. We're generous. Unicorns love figs. You get it? And that is how we make decisions. So everything we do, we use that, right? So we say, is this making us more fearless, inventive, and generous? Are we bringing this, are we making decisions for our clients, for our talent?