Anne Applebaum

You know, he also ran an anti-immigrant campaign. even though Hungary has very, very few immigrants. So the immigrants were mostly fictitious. I mean, at least in the United States, we have real immigrants. And so there's a real problem, and you can talk about realistically how to solve it. In Hungary, it was mostly fiction. But he used that language.

And one of the reasons he did it, I think, was to create an international coalition around himself. He spent a lot of time and invested a lot of money in bringing foreign conservatives from Britain, from the United States, from other countries to Budapest. He created a special specific think tank called the Danube Institute, which was designed to do exactly that.

And one of the reasons he did it, I think, was to create an international coalition around himself. He spent a lot of time and invested a lot of money in bringing foreign conservatives from Britain, from the United States, from other countries to Budapest. He created a special specific think tank called the Danube Institute, which was designed to do exactly that.

And one of the reasons he did it, I think, was to create an international coalition around himself. He spent a lot of time and invested a lot of money in bringing foreign conservatives from Britain, from the United States, from other countries to Budapest. He created a special specific think tank called the Danube Institute, which was designed to do exactly that.

He spent a lot of time projecting Hungarian ideas into other places. And one of his ideas for how he would stay in power, in other words, although he'd broken many rules and although he was in violation of EU standards of judicial independence, one of the ways he thought he would stay in power was by finding allies outside of Hungary.

He spent a lot of time projecting Hungarian ideas into other places. And one of his ideas for how he would stay in power, in other words, although he'd broken many rules and although he was in violation of EU standards of judicial independence, one of the ways he thought he would stay in power was by finding allies outside of Hungary.

He spent a lot of time projecting Hungarian ideas into other places. And one of his ideas for how he would stay in power, in other words, although he'd broken many rules and although he was in violation of EU standards of judicial independence, one of the ways he thought he would stay in power was by finding allies outside of Hungary.

And he found many inside the United States, but also in some other European countries.

And he found many inside the United States, but also in some other European countries.

And he found many inside the United States, but also in some other European countries.

Sure. It's a two-way project. I mean, I think it's also important maybe at this point to stress that the project of destroying your democracy as an elected leader is something that you don't have to be right-wing in order to do. So this is more or less the same kind of playbook that Hugo Chavez used in Venezuela. Right. He also famously sacked civil servants.

Sure. It's a two-way project. I mean, I think it's also important maybe at this point to stress that the project of destroying your democracy as an elected leader is something that you don't have to be right-wing in order to do. So this is more or less the same kind of playbook that Hugo Chavez used in Venezuela. Right. He also famously sacked civil servants.

Sure. It's a two-way project. I mean, I think it's also important maybe at this point to stress that the project of destroying your democracy as an elected leader is something that you don't have to be right-wing in order to do. So this is more or less the same kind of playbook that Hugo Chavez used in Venezuela. Right. He also famously sacked civil servants.

There was a moment when he sacked 19,000 employees of the Venezuelan state oil company and replaced them with loyalists who wound up destroying the company. He also attacked judges, media, and so on. The playbook is neither right-wing nor left-wing. It's a playbook about undermining democracy, and it's one that is most often carried out by democratically elected leaders.

There was a moment when he sacked 19,000 employees of the Venezuelan state oil company and replaced them with loyalists who wound up destroying the company. He also attacked judges, media, and so on. The playbook is neither right-wing nor left-wing. It's a playbook about undermining democracy, and it's one that is most often carried out by democratically elected leaders.

There was a moment when he sacked 19,000 employees of the Venezuelan state oil company and replaced them with loyalists who wound up destroying the company. He also attacked judges, media, and so on. The playbook is neither right-wing nor left-wing. It's a playbook about undermining democracy, and it's one that is most often carried out by democratically elected leaders.

But these are democratically elected leaders who characterize themselves or describe themselves as as deserving of no opposition. So I am the true Hungarian or I am the only real American. I speak for the people and you only speak for elites and foreigners or I speak for. real people, real Americans, and my opponents are radical left lunatics or vermin. But it's a known playbook.

But these are democratically elected leaders who characterize themselves or describe themselves as as deserving of no opposition. So I am the true Hungarian or I am the only real American. I speak for the people and you only speak for elites and foreigners or I speak for. real people, real Americans, and my opponents are radical left lunatics or vermin. But it's a known playbook.

But these are democratically elected leaders who characterize themselves or describe themselves as as deserving of no opposition. So I am the true Hungarian or I am the only real American. I speak for the people and you only speak for elites and foreigners or I speak for. real people, real Americans, and my opponents are radical left lunatics or vermin. But it's a known playbook.

It's unfolded in many other countries. I could name Turkey. I could name India. You can point around the world and find a large number of them. Nowadays, most democracies fail through these kinds of tactics and not through coup d'etat. We have our imagination of a coup or regime change is that There are tanks and violence and, you know, somebody shoots up the chandelier in the presidential palace.