Anne Morris

And it's this mix of feeling both stressed and bored at the same time.

So our friend Adam Grant,

Sometimes uses the word languishing to describe this, a variety of this experience.

It's a beautiful word, but it's something beyond just feeling stuck or stagnant.

It's also an experience where our nervous systems are jacked up, but we're not getting any payoff for it.

We're never outrunning the lion.

We're never bringing down the woolly mammoth.

We are just in this state of activity without any return.

Totally.

Something.

And today we want to get after both of these parts, which I think of as almost a renewal equation.

So there's part one, the exhaustion, which is this deficit of life force, the burnout, the part of work that is feeling unsustainable because we don't have enough energy.

energy holding us up.

And then the second part is how to replace that deficiency with something else, something bigger, something more ambitious, something that's going to more reliably create, dare I say, a surplus of energy where we might even be jumping out of bed to get after it in our experience of work.

Okay, Frances, let's start with the cause of the problem here on the exhaustion side.

So your lovely colleague, Leslie Perlow, has done a lot of thinking on this.

Why are we all so tired at work?

Yeah, I was going to ask, what's the, so I'm in a culture, there's an implicit expectation that I'm always on.

What's the remedy?

So if it's a team of Anne and Frances, we can still be an always-on culture, but Anne is on part of the time, Frances is on the other part of the time.