Ben Lindbergh

And so, roguelike deck-building game.

You said, if you like card games.

What if you don't?

Just asking for a friend.

I have more affinity for physical card games than digital ones.

Great, great.

Yeah, the interesting thing is that the publisher is franchising this, right?

So they have the Vampire Survivor engine, and then they're basically like, what if Vampire Survivor is but Warhammer or whatever?

Hell yeah.

Right, you know?

And so they're basically like providing the framework for the game and then licensing that to other people so that they can sort of reskin it and make it Vampire Survivor's but for insert IP here.

Which, you know, is kind of a copycat model, obviously.

But if you like the core gameplay and you also like that property, then I guess that's a good proposition.

I mean, it's probably a profitable proposition, but also not bad because, you know, then they're incorporating the people who make that thing.

So it's not as if...

the publisher is shouldering the responsibility of making it a faithful adaptation.

They're just kind of outsourcing it to the IP holder and just saying, here, you can use our game to make your version of it.

Very hard.

I meant to mention, by the way, when we were talking about Sorrows, another Sony published game that we have talked about, which is Marathon.

I feel like we kind of called how things would go with Marathon, where it has developed a core audience that really loves the game, but the overall audience has dwindled.