Bruce Straley

And you look at something like this and you say, of course, they really are the exception to the rule.

Yeah.

How do you make an indie studio and then keep the faith that this is all going to work out in some way?

That's a question.

I mean, like, you know, we have an engaged audience and that's why you're here because people want to talk to you and hear from you and all this stuff and they love games and they love the news.

But every day, a layoff, a closure, a game being delisted.

Yeah, no, it's a bloodbath out there.

And then I go to DICE and you talk to the people who are, the kids who bring out the awards are part of that mentorship program and they all want to come work here and it's this whole conversation of like, what do we do when there aren't jobs or how do you motivate them in the light of how dark it can be?

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

And, I mean, to double down on their success, right?

When you have a game as successful as Hollow Knight, you can take that much longer to do that.

And I think, you know, it's something you talked about when you were talking about Wildflower, right?

Well, now I'm doing serious.

I'm not doing serious.

This is where people are like, oh, man, Greg can do both things.

He can be the funniest guy in the world or the smartest guy in the world.

And I know it.

It's crazy.

You're talking about Wildflower, though, and you're talking about bringing this team together, learning the love language.

And I think that's something that I bring up every so often about how sad it is to see these studios close.