Chris Voss

well there's a lot of talk going on in the media on both sides i mean they're both both sides are very uh aware of the the positioning of their conversation in the media is more to affect their supporters and their allies more than it is to affect the other side that's why in the media most of the time what's being said it's it's hard to understand and hard to interpret because you don't know what ears

they're trying to target at the moment.

Most of the time, it's not the years that you expect it to be.

So it's really hard to get a firm read on this based on context without also knowing what's going on behind the scenes of conversations.

You know, one side is calling it negotiations, the other side saying, well, we're talking, we're not negotiating.

uh these are matters of distinction face saving characterizations in public so without without being told what's being said explicitly and clearly there's conversations going on through pakistan at this point in time as mediators um relaying information so there are conversations taking place and different sides are characterizing it in different ways you're not 100 sure what ears are trying to hit with their statements

Yeah, well, you try to find out what really deep down inside matters to the other side.

What are their core values?

The real issue in many cases is autonomy.

Nobody likes to be forced to the table.

They like to feel like that they made a choice to be there.

Autonomy is actually more important than survival.

Maslow's hierarchy of needs, our hypothesis that survival was number one with Maslow, isn't 100% accurate.

And what I usually ask people is, name a civilization in the history of mankind that's been content in slavery.

You can't find one.

The United States is a country that give me liberty or give me death.

We didn't invent that phrase or that attitude.

But what that tells you is autonomy is more important than survival.

And at the end of the day, people are going to really make decisions whether or not they feel they were autonomous in that decision or whether or not they feel forced into it.

Well, it does if you see all that noise.